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Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Rugby?

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Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Rugby?

Postby kush123 » Thu, 11 May 2017, 06:03

A lot in Asian rugby can be changed after 2020 due to the changed of players eligibility rules , we have seen in the U18 level in Asian rugby with least number of expats in teams the dominating Asian sides are not japan or Hong kongs its Sri Lanka and South Korea .So there's is a possibility of seeing a new champion team in Asia after 2020 other than japan.

in the other hand i believe if japan won't make it to the 2023 rugby world cup, world rugby will reconsider of bringing back that old direct Asian team wc spot again since there will be a possibility of having no Asian team in the 2023 rwc with the current qualification system . which means 60% world population wont be a part of this world event in 2023 and that's not going to do any good for a sport who's trying to make it a globalized event .

so if both these scenarios happens if a team other than japan can win the arc after 2020 they can get a direct entry to the 2023 rwc . this will do wonders for that Asian rugby nation and for their teams market in the same way how japan got benefited of participating the past rugby world cups . so in my opinion japan lose in rugby 2019 wc will be a win for asian rugby and its going to be good for asian rugby .

*apologize for my poor grammar , i'm not really fluent in English :)

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby Hinato » Thu, 11 May 2017, 08:04

kush123 wrote:A lot in Asian rugby can be changed after 2020 due to the changed of players eligibility rules , we have seen in the U18 level in Asian rugby with least number of expats in teams the dominating Asian sides are not japan or Hong kongs its Sri Lanka and South Korea .So there's is a possibility of seeing a new champion team in Asia after 2020 other than japan.

in the other hand i believe if japan won't make it to the 2023 rugby world cup, world rugby will reconsider of bringing back that old direct Asian team wc spot again since there will be a possibility of having no Asian team in the 2023 rwc with the current qualification system . which means 60% world population wont be a part of this world event in 2023 and that's not going to do any good for a sport who's trying to make it a globalized event .

so if both these scenarios happens if a team other than japan can win the arc after 2020 they can get a direct entry to the 2023 rwc . this will do wonders for that Asian rugby nation and for their teams market in the same way how japan got benefited of participating the past rugby world cups . so in my opinion japan lose in rugby 2019 wc will be a win for asian rugby and its going to be good for asian rugby .

*apologize for my poor grammar , i'm not really fluent in English :)


Une équipe 100% japonaise met 100 points au Sri Lanka. Ne confonds pas rugby à 7 et rugby à XV...
Même avec 100 % de joueurs locaux, le Japon domine en Asie.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby kush123 » Thu, 11 May 2017, 08:36

Hinato wrote:
kush123 wrote:A lot in Asian rugby can be changed after 2020 due to the changed of players eligibility rules , we have seen in the U18 level in Asian rugby with least number of expats in teams the dominating Asian sides are not japan or Hong kongs its Sri Lanka and South Korea .So there's is a possibility of seeing a new champion team in Asia after 2020 other than japan.

in the other hand i believe if japan won't make it to the 2023 rugby world cup, world rugby will reconsider of bringing back that old direct Asian team wc spot again since there will be a possibility of having no Asian team in the 2023 rwc with the current qualification system . which means 60% world population wont be a part of this world event in 2023 and that's not going to do any good for a sport who's trying to make it a globalized event .

so if both these scenarios happens if a team other than japan can win the arc after 2020 they can get a direct entry to the 2023 rwc . this will do wonders for that Asian rugby nation and for their teams market in the same way how japan got benefited of participating the past rugby world cups . so in my opinion japan lose in rugby 2019 wc will be a win for asian rugby and its going to be good for asian rugby .

*apologize for my poor grammar , i'm not really fluent in English :)


Une équipe 100% japonaise met 100 points au Sri Lanka. Ne confonds pas rugby à 7 et rugby à XV...
Même avec 100 % de joueurs locaux, le Japon domine en Asie.


Not sure which 100% Japanese team are you talking about in here , cause I have seen most of the Japanese sides faced Sri Lanka had expats in their team . Anyways do you remember what happened to 100% Japanese young players faced SL young players in 7s they just went cartwheeling, I have posted that embarrassing video in here but I dunno how to retreave it again .

Anyhow I'm not saying SL will beat japan . I'm only saying Japan won't be the powers house again in Asian rugby after 2020 , my bet is Korea will be the arc champions before 2023 WC, or atleast the loosing margins will get smaller every year after 2020
Last edited by kush123 on Thu, 11 May 2017, 08:59, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby RugbyLiebe » Thu, 11 May 2017, 08:41

World Rugby will bring back the certain Asian spot, if Japan fails to make the quarters. They gave Oceania (2+0,5+0,25+0,125) spots when nobody from the PI qualified

Apart from that Japan will be the best Asian team for at least the next 20-30 years. They have a pro-league, they have a team in the best rugby league in the world and they have a very, very good school system which brings a lot of people in contact with rugby.

And more important a lot of people outisde of the pro-leagues training within a semi-pro-environment. My club was once slaughtered 100something-0 by a Japanese uni side. They practice 5 times a week, they have a staff of 3-5 people catering there needs, they do European tours lasting 3 weeks. And that was a university-side. No chance they will be overtaken within at least generation by anyone in Asia.
AND just as an addition they have expats.
Last edited by RugbyLiebe on Thu, 11 May 2017, 08:57, edited 1 time in total.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby kush123 » Thu, 11 May 2017, 08:43

Hinato wrote:
kush123 wrote:A lot in Asian rugby can be changed after 2020 due to the changed of players eligibility rules , we have seen in the U18 level in Asian rugby with least number of expats in teams the dominating Asian sides are not japan or Hong kongs its Sri Lanka and South Korea .So there's is a possibility of seeing a new champion team in Asia after 2020 other than japan.

in the other hand i believe if japan won't make it to the 2023 rugby world cup, world rugby will reconsider of bringing back that old direct Asian team wc spot again since there will be a possibility of having no Asian team in the 2023 rwc with the current qualification system . which means 60% world population wont be a part of this world event in 2023 and that's not going to do any good for a sport who's trying to make it a globalized event .

so if both these scenarios happens if a team other than japan can win the arc after 2020 they can get a direct entry to the 2023 rwc . this will do wonders for that Asian rugby nation and for their teams market in the same way how japan got benefited of participating the past rugby world cups . so in my opinion japan lose in rugby 2019 wc will be a win for asian rugby and its going to be good for asian rugby .

*apologize for my poor grammar , i'm not really fluent in English :)


Une équipe 100% japonaise met 100 points au Sri Lanka. Ne confonds pas rugby à 7 et rugby à XV...
Même avec 100 % de joueurs locaux, le Japon domine en Asie.

Lol found the link viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1039&p=47986#p47986

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby Hinato » Thu, 11 May 2017, 10:57

kush123 wrote:
Hinato wrote:
kush123 wrote:A lot in Asian rugby can be changed after 2020 due to the changed of players eligibility rules , we have seen in the U18 level in Asian rugby with least number of expats in teams the dominating Asian sides are not japan or Hong kongs its Sri Lanka and South Korea .So there's is a possibility of seeing a new champion team in Asia after 2020 other than japan.

in the other hand i believe if japan won't make it to the 2023 rugby world cup, world rugby will reconsider of bringing back that old direct Asian team wc spot again since there will be a possibility of having no Asian team in the 2023 rwc with the current qualification system . which means 60% world population wont be a part of this world event in 2023 and that's not going to do any good for a sport who's trying to make it a globalized event .

so if both these scenarios happens if a team other than japan can win the arc after 2020 they can get a direct entry to the 2023 rwc . this will do wonders for that Asian rugby nation and for their teams market in the same way how japan got benefited of participating the past rugby world cups . so in my opinion japan lose in rugby 2019 wc will be a win for asian rugby and its going to be good for asian rugby .

*apologize for my poor grammar , i'm not really fluent in English :)


Une équipe 100% japonaise met 100 points au Sri Lanka. Ne confonds pas rugby à 7 et rugby à XV...
Même avec 100 % de joueurs locaux, le Japon domine en Asie.

Lol found the link http://www.t2rugby.com/viewtopic.php?f= ... 986#p47986


Je pense que tu ne réalises pas l'écart de niveau en rugby à XV entre le Japon et les autres nations de rugby en Asie...
Avant de parler des autres, commencez à critiquer votre formation qui est catastrophique.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby RugbyLiebe » Thu, 11 May 2017, 12:15

Hinato wrote:
Hinato wrote:
Une équipe 100% japonaise met 100 points au Sri Lanka. Ne confonds pas rugby à 7 et rugby à XV...
Même avec 100 % de joueurs locaux, le Japon domine en Asie.


Je pense que tu ne réalises pas l'écart de niveau en rugby à XV entre le Japon et les autres nations de rugby en Asie...
Avant de parler des autres, commencez à critiquer votre formation qui est catastrophique.


Just out of interest, why do you always write in French? EVERYONE else writes in English. I mean you could at least try....
You are obviously an expert on Asian rugby and have mostly very interesting posts, but to translate them is sometimes really annoying (when i.e. my school-French isn't enough :D )
Last edited by RugbyLiebe on Thu, 11 May 2017, 12:30, edited 2 times in total.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby thatrugbyguy » Thu, 11 May 2017, 12:25

I wouldn't be so sure Japan will dominate for too much longer. Hong Kong's professional program seems to already be showing results after last weeks match against Japan. We'll know more in the next few matches how much they've improved but the results are starting to look promising. If those results continue it's not going to surprise me if Asia get an automatic place in 2023 even if Japan auto-qualify.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby kush123 » Thu, 11 May 2017, 12:57

Hinato wrote:
kush123 wrote:
Hinato wrote:
kush123 wrote:A lot in Asian rugby can be changed after 2020 due to the changed of players eligibility rules , we have seen in the U18 level in Asian rugby with least number of expats in teams the dominating Asian sides are not japan or Hong kongs its Sri Lanka and South Korea .So there's is a possibility of seeing a new champion team in Asia after 2020 other than japan.

in the other hand i believe if japan won't make it to the 2023 rugby world cup, world rugby will reconsider of bringing back that old direct Asian team wc spot again since there will be a possibility of having no Asian team in the 2023 rwc with the current qualification system . which means 60% world population wont be a part of this world event in 2023 and that's not going to do any good for a sport who's trying to make it a globalized event .

so if both these scenarios happens if a team other than japan can win the arc after 2020 they can get a direct entry to the 2023 rwc . this will do wonders for that Asian rugby nation and for their teams market in the same way how japan got benefited of participating the past rugby world cups . so in my opinion japan lose in rugby 2019 wc will be a win for asian rugby and its going to be good for asian rugby .

*apologize for my poor grammar , i'm not really fluent in English :)


Une équipe 100% japonaise met 100 points au Sri Lanka. Ne confonds pas rugby à 7 et rugby à XV...
Même avec 100 % de joueurs locaux, le Japon domine en Asie.

Lol found the link viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1039&p=47986#p47986


Je pense que tu ne réalises pas l'écart de niveau en rugby à XV entre le Japon et les autres nations de rugby en Asie...
Avant de parler des autres, commencez à critiquer votre formation qui est catastrophique.


Japan Hong Kong running their rugby on expats , no expats these rugby playing nations become just equal to other asian teams , we have seen it in the u18 level in asia .

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby kush123 » Thu, 11 May 2017, 13:06

RugbyLiebe wrote:World Rugby will bring back the certain Asian spot, if Japan fails to make the quarters. They gave Oceania (2+0,5+0,25+0,125) spots when nobody from the PI qualified

Which means Japan failing in the RWC 2019 is a good thing for the Asia rugby ?

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 12 May 2017, 09:10

kush123 wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:World Rugby will bring back the certain Asian spot, if Japan fails to make the quarters. They gave Oceania (2+0,5+0,25+0,125) spots when nobody from the PI qualified

Which means Japan failing in the RWC 2019 is a good thing for the Asia rugby ?


No, off course it will be a bad thing. Japan will always be the team who qualifies and no second team will maybe get a second chance. And off course chances are smaller that there won't be a second Asian set spot if they finally come to their senses and have a 24-team-RWC.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby YamahaKiwi » Sat, 20 May 2017, 07:47

RugbyLiebe wrote:World Rugby will bring back the certain Asian spot, if Japan fails to make the quarters. They gave Oceania (2+0,5+0,25+0,125) spots when nobody from the PI qualified

Apart from that Japan will be the best Asian team for at least the next 20-30 years. They have a pro-league, they have a team in the best rugby league in the world and they have a very, very good school system which brings a lot of people in contact with rugby.

And more important a lot of people outisde of the pro-leagues training within a semi-pro-environment. My club was once slaughtered 100something-0 by a Japanese uni side. They practice 5 times a week, they have a staff of 3-5 people catering there needs, they do European tours lasting 3 weeks. And that was a university-side. No chance they will be overtaken within at least generation by anyone in Asia.
AND just as an addition they have expats.


When it comes to school sports they have a rubbish system. I should know, I spent five years teaching in it. Another who can tell you how poor it is veteran Japan rugby journo Rich freeman who has also a number of times documented the poor state of rugby (poor coaching, training, grounds etc) in high schools in Japan. With all due respect I would not give credit to the Japanese education system for the prowess of its national and top level rugby teams. Even the universities are poor compared to most of the Top League teams and Eddie Jones consistently spat out vitriol against the poor standard of rugby and coaching there too. Most of the improvement in Japan's results is all to do with better standards at the top clubs and better coaching of the national team in the last decade.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby YamahaKiwi » Sat, 20 May 2017, 07:57

kush123 wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:World Rugby will bring back the certain Asian spot, if Japan fails to make the quarters. They gave Oceania (2+0,5+0,25+0,125) spots when nobody from the PI qualified

Which means Japan failing in the RWC 2019 is a good thing for the Asia rugby ?


It sad that you feel it's in your interests to hope Japan does badly rather than cheering on your region's representative and host of the next RWC.

And by the way, the Japan 7s team you beat (yes, good job), no offence intended but that in no way represents even close to the best team Japan could put on any given day. Just because your team beat a Japan team mostly made up of uni students not even playing at the top pro level in Japan doesn't mean you're now close in any way to being level with Japan when it comes to rugby superiority in Asia. Sorry, I don't mean to be arrogant or belittle your team's victory. I just want to add some context to how important the Asian 7s matches are in the overall scheme of Asian rugby - especially seen from the Japanese view. That current view is they are not especially important, hence the lack of strength and quality of the squad that participates. Again it was a good victory to SL, and as they say, you can only play what is put in front of you.

In terms of more Asian places at the RWC, it's probably more important how HKG/KOR go against firstly cook Is/Tahiti and then if winning that, then in the final repechage tournament. If the 2nd Asian team qualified or got close it will help future chances especially if the RWC goes to 24 teams. even then it might not be a direct 2nd team but would be at least a bigger chance with maybe a direct playoff v another region and then maybe a better chance in the repechages even if they did lose the direct playoff. The bias against Asia currently is purely because they have been unable to beat teams from other regions in final qualifying. That has to change.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby RugbyLiebe » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 10:04

YamahaKiwi wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:World Rugby will bring back the certain Asian spot, if Japan fails to make the quarters. They gave Oceania (2+0,5+0,25+0,125) spots when nobody from the PI qualified

Apart from that Japan will be the best Asian team for at least the next 20-30 years. They have a pro-league, they have a team in the best rugby league in the world and they have a very, very good school system which brings a lot of people in contact with rugby.

And more important a lot of people outisde of the pro-leagues training within a semi-pro-environment. My club was once slaughtered 100something-0 by a Japanese uni side. They practice 5 times a week, they have a staff of 3-5 people catering there needs, they do European tours lasting 3 weeks. And that was a university-side. No chance they will be overtaken within at least generation by anyone in Asia.
AND just as an addition they have expats.


When it comes to school sports they have a rubbish system. I should know, I spent five years teaching in it. Another who can tell you how poor it is veteran Japan rugby journo Rich freeman who has also a number of times documented the poor state of rugby (poor coaching, training, grounds etc) in high schools in Japan. With all due respect I would not give credit to the Japanese education system for the prowess of its national and top level rugby teams. Even the universities are poor compared to most of the Top League teams and Eddie Jones consistently spat out vitriol against the poor standard of rugby and coaching there too. Most of the improvement in Japan's results is all to do with better standards at the top clubs and better coaching of the national team in the last decade.


Came back to this thread, after I suddenly thought about it and voila I overlooked your post.
While all you say about the Japanese school system might be true, you need to see this from a different perspective. To close up on the best rugby nations highschool or uni might not be good enough. And I am not saying this with one word. But to distance tier2+3 nations, especially from Asia this makes all the difference.

If the 11 million German pupils would have this system in place with big exposure to rugby, Germany would qualify for every world cup easily. In my eyes even a bad copy of the Anglo-American-school-sport-system is the reason why Japan is competitive at this level. You need more "Eddie Jones"-guys to grow further from there, as you said.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby rey200 » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 11:49

Spot on RugbyLiebe

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby victorsra » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 14:06

Question: aren't most of those Hong Kong expats born in Hong Kong? Well, it was a British territory 20 years ago...

I would be funny if Hong Kong wins the Repechage. I would be cheering for Uruguay, but it would be interesting if Hong Kong made it as it would expose WR's poor decisions about the Qualy.
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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby Neptune » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 05:04

victorsra wrote:Question: aren't most of those Hong Kong expats born in Hong Kong? Well, it was a British territory 20 years ago...

I would be funny if Hong Kong wins the Repechage. I would be cheering for Uruguay, but it would be interesting if Hong Kong made it as it would expose WR's poor decisions about the Qualy.


For the repechege, Ill actually be suporting any T3 nation that makes it. It will be the only way WR will pay close attention to the T3's.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby gibbs » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 06:11

victorsra wrote:Question: aren't most of those Hong Kong expats born in Hong Kong? Well, it was a British territory 20 years ago...

I would be funny if Hong Kong wins the Repechage. I would be cheering for Uruguay, but it would be interesting if Hong Kong made it as it would expose WR's poor decisions about the Qualy.


Ironically no.. Except for the two or three ethnic Chinese players and Rowan Varty rest are all British, Kiwi (Remini) born expats

This is the main reason what Asian Rugby is what it is a expat game, Basically run by Brit expats from Hong Kong they will never want to change the status quo
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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby gibbs » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 06:18

kush123 wrote:Anyhow I'm not saying SL will beat japan . I'm only saying Japan won't be the powers house again in Asian rugby after 2020 , my bet is Korea will be the arc champions before 2023 WC, or atleast the loosing margins will get smaller every year after 2020


Whaoh you're getting way ahead of yourself here, Japan is decades ahead in terms of it's Rugby infrastructure, Even though at the highest level they do play foreigners it still has local player base thats unequal to any other Asian or even some top tier Northern Hemisphere teams.. Also the JRU has a club structure that is world class drawing the best talent from around the world, Add to that the financial clout of it's Rugby is basically run by the Multi billion corporate sector

Japan have recently broken itself in to the top tier as well and is holding it's own up there, So the win against Saffa's wasn't just a fluke

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby RugbyLiebe » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 06:27

Neptune wrote:
For the repechege, Ill actually be suporting any T3 nation that makes it. It will be the only way WR will pay close attention to the T3's.


Honestly, which teams to you expect to be at the repechage? That's one of only two or three world cup places for grabs...
No this won't make anyone pay close attention to anything.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby Neptune » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 06:43

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Neptune wrote:
For the repechege, Ill actually be suporting any T3 nation that makes it. It will be the only way WR will pay close attention to the T3's.


Honestly, which teams to you expect to be at the repechage? That's one of only two or three world cup places for grabs...
No this won't make anyone pay close attention to anything.


Likely repechege teams - Zimbabwe/Kenya, Hong Kong/South Korea, Uruguay, Russia/Germany/Spain - out of these teams, there are those that are not yet considered t2, but deliver a killer punch, so, id say it will be good to see a suprise team going forward.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby RugbyLiebe » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 12:26

Neptune wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:
Neptune wrote:
For the repechege, Ill actually be suporting any T3 nation that makes it. It will be the only way WR will pay close attention to the T3's.


Honestly, which teams to you expect to be at the repechage? That's one of only two or three world cup places for grabs...
No this won't make anyone pay close attention to anything.


Likely repechege teams - Zimbabwe/Kenya, Hong Kong/South Korea, Uruguay, Russia/Germany/Spain - out of these teams, there are those that are not yet considered t2, but deliver a killer punch, so, id say it will be good to see a suprise team going forward.



Ah you meant you will support them afterwards at the RWC, fair enough.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Japan qulifying for the 2023 WC-Good or Bad for Asian Ru

Postby TheStroBro » Tue, 13 Jun 2017, 17:29

Neptune wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:
Neptune wrote:
For the repechege, Ill actually be suporting any T3 nation that makes it. It will be the only way WR will pay close attention to the T3's.


Honestly, which teams to you expect to be at the repechage? That's one of only two or three world cup places for grabs...
No this won't make anyone pay close attention to anything.


Likely repechege teams - Zimbabwe/Kenya, Hong Kong/South Korea, Uruguay, Russia/Germany/Spain - out of these teams, there are those that are not yet considered t2, but deliver a killer punch, so, id say it will be good to see a suprise team going forward.

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