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Catalonia?

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Catalonia?

Postby The Do » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 09:29

I was watching the news overnight and it showed that Catalonia is seeking a independence referendum from Spain. To what effect would an independent Catalonia affect the Spainish national rugby team?

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby Zhenya_Zima » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 09:37

It would still mainly comprise of non-Spaniards.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby amz » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 09:58

Hopefully Catalunya independence will never happen.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby beber » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 10:27

I think there is currently only 1 catalan in Spanish team : winger Jordi Jorba

I know that Jordi Murphy is born in Barcelona

There are a lot of players from the french part of Catalonia in Top14 / ProD2 including Guilhem Girado

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 11:05

It was one of my earliest discussions on this forum, two years ago, and I predicted it wouldn't happen before 2017... viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4&start=50#p28332

Let me talk politics first, rugby later. What happened this week isn't new. We've had menaces of breaking away nearly every week since 2010. They were supposed to leave in 2014. Then in 2016. Now 2018. Both Madrid and Barcelona governments are corrupt as hell and they use this story to keep people distracted. From Madrid they just try to ignore the fact a 48-49% of Catalonia wants to leave (although separatis parties hold a majority in regional chamber) and don't accept to hold a referendum because "Contitution doesn't allow". Which is bullshit since Constitution can be changed. And the problem is this denial is only increasing the percentage of people in favor of independence. On the Catalan side, it's already the second time they announce a referendum but how legitimate would that be if political parties opposed to independence don't participate at all? Would the world accept an independence vote with 30 or 40% participation? It isn't clear at all and that's why I don't see it happening in a short time.

On the rugby side. Catalonia has a point since they were accepted to FIRA before Spain. And current Spanish law says regional sides can play at international level in sports where Spain didn't have a national federation. But it's hardly possible to apply today's law to situations that happened in the 1930s... If Catalonia breaks away, Spain would lose its spiritual birthplace, Sant Boi, and great club academies. But to be honest it wouldn't be a big loss for the national side. Valladolid is the powerhouse, Madrid has more registered players than any other region and Valencia and Andalucía are growing quite rapidly. On the contrary, traditional places like Catalonia and Euskadi have stagnated in latest years. Maybe it would impact far more 7s than XV and even Catalonia knows it's where they could have a big impact in case of independence: instead of their traditional XV game (last year they played and beat Portugal), they've done a bet on Sevens and formed men's and women's sides to compete in international tournaments.

Apart from that Catalan Rugby Union took part recently in a study on the economic impact of independence for sporting federations and they say they would earn 1,4M€. Let bme doubt about it since it would put them on upper Rugby Europe Trophy levels right from the beginning, over Portugal or Netherlands, but that's what they say: http://seleccions.cat/images/pdf/Estudi ... /rugbi.pdf

How would they fare? Some French-born pros in Spain national team would be eligible for Catalonia, like Bélie or Custoja. Plus they have great academies and all clubs are close one to each others, so it would work well like in Portugal or Uruguay.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby jservuk » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 11:58

If it did happen, it might present Catalan Rugby an opportunity as Catalan football would be weakened with Barca no longer having the rivalry with the other teams. Football will then slowly die in Catalonia, and with the El Classico people in Madrid and the rest of Spain would lose interest in seeing RM winning every year. Win-win for Rugby.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 12:01

Forget about it. Barça will still play in Spanish league whatever happens. Politics are important, but business is "importanter".

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby The Do » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 22:05

Thank you armchair. That was quite in depth.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby BLASICO » Sun, 11 Jun 2017, 23:05

Forget it. European Union doesn't want any unilateral split/separation because there are several regions inside the union in a similar situation. And if it will be put in place sometime... no € allow and cross border.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby rey200 » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 05:41

They might not want it, but if it's going to happen there will be an easy solution. Meaning: they (Catalonia) will have to pay. Spain will be paid to accept it, the world will continue to turn and everything said before about joining the Euro etc. will be forgotten. That's called pragmatism.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby BLASICO » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 08:18

rey200 wrote:That's called pragmatism.


It's not easy.

67% of the surveyed reject the Catalan local government's way of acting with disconnection laws, compared with 27% who support it; and 61% of Catalans reject unilateral Independence.
It seems some local politicians make a lot of noise.


http://ccaa.elpais.com/ccaa/2017/05/23/ ... 14504.html

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 08:40

Because Catalans still have lots of ties with the rest of Spain (family, culture...) and Catalan bourgeoisie makes lots of money all around Spain. But little by little this fear of breaking away without Madrid's permission will be nothing compared to the fed up feeling of being stuck in the same situation for almost a decade. We're not even talking about how many Catalans are in favor of independence, but about how many of them would like to break away without an agreement. That seems to me an already rotten relationship.

The main issue is (the rest of) Spain doesn't look like a good partner, considering how the party in the government has lots of corruption cases and opposition is non existent. It's easy to sell those unconfortable with that the idea that an independent Catalonia would be far more rich and that even if EU doesn't want them, they will end up being a Mediterranean Switzerland... And if not, at least their robbing politicians will be those elected in Barcelona, Girona, Tarragona and Lleida, not those chosen in Sevilla, Lugo or Palencia.

To be back on sports field, the same study on how much money Catalan Rugby Union would collect in the case of an independence also estimated the number of medals Catalonia could reach (8/9 with 129/149 athletes) at the Olympics. How did they calculate it? I have no idea and it's probably bullshit considering that if Catalonia were independent it would be needed to negotiate how some State-owned high performance facilities in Catalonia would be used (coownership? sale?) or the new model of Olympic funding without the help of companies whose business is mostly in the rest of Spain. But a headline as "Catalonia would reach 9 medals at the Olympics" grabs the attention of people and feeds hope.

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Re: Catalonia?

Postby marino » Mon, 12 Jun 2017, 14:35

I know some people from Catalonia and all of them think more or less the same, we don´t care if it´s Spain or Catalonia, what we want is to have a good life. So they don´t really care much about this, but politicians make noise with that.

But they don´t really have real credibility. They steal all the money they can so good words don´t mean anything, that´s the reality about Spain and Catalonia.

Talking about rugby is what Armchair said, the most important places where rugby is being developed is Madrid, Valladolid, Andalucia and Valencian Community.

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