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Georgia vs Romania discussion

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Re: Georgia (Lelos)

Postby amz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 11:32

RugbyPUBtbilisi wrote:Off topic!!!

This conversation ends here.

Discuss Romanian team in correct thread.


It's your fellow Georgian who started it and not continues so blame him not us for bringing this here.

As about Georgia, I wish you good luck with the backs but the improvement is very slow after so many U20 generations (each one was brilliant, isn't it?)

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby amz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 11:45

I really admire the mods, they're so prompt when it's something that bothers the Georgians ;)

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby datodato » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 12:55

Sharikdze, Mchedlidze, Matiashvili, Modebadze, Lobzhanidze, Abzhandadze, Koshadze, Apradidze... we don‘t need your phony „Good luck“. We are happy with the boys we have and hope that more will come through. It is the first generation of Players who will have trained on pitches pretty much all their life. We should wish you good luck and hope that you will be able to produce magical Romanian players like Vlaicu, Tincu, Fercu or Tincu (my favorite!) again.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby amz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 13:03

Tincu retired from 2012, Fercu didn't played in June or this November. What matches are you watching? Are you even watching other teams than Georgia?

Some of the Georgians you listed are yet to play full tests, be starters at their clubs or play professional rugby somewhere. Two are solid tough, Sharikadze and Lobzhanidze with the last one stagnant from 2 years already. Matiashvili is also on the rise and soon to be their level but the rest...are at best only bets so far. Even Mchedlidze who is in France from some time struggles with form and I don't remember any good match made by him for Lelos. He's a limited player, a driving play type of wing, this is all so will hardly improve your creativity even if he is a French club based player.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Canadian_Rugger » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 19:42

Legit comment from a neutral supporter. At present I rate both Romania and Georgia as equals as far as on pitch performances are concerned. Romania, through their professional Superliga, have clearly improved. Both have bested Pacific Isle Sides the past few years:

Romania has, since 2013, beaten:

Tonga, Samoa, Canada, USA, Uruguay, Namibia, Russia, Spain, etc.

They've also lost two close matches against Japan, the match in Japan was particularly impressive as it was their first tour in years. They also nearly beat Italy at the World Cup and gave them a very good game. Their professional clubs have also given a better showing than any of the Italian Excellenza Clubs and would rate the top half of Superliga as better than anything outside Treviso or Aironi in Italy, even then, I think the top teams might even knock those two off.

Given all this, I'd rate Georgia as slightly better but Romania are not far off and I'd rate both as at least equal to Italy in terms of ability. They, along with Japan and Fiji are the cream of Tier 2 and are Tier 1 for all intents and purposes.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Kiroshi » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 19:56

Alright datodato, you asked for it with this stupid topic and you are getting it:


First of all, in that match your scrum got pushed back 10m or so TWICE. Even Milton acknowledged that in a post game interview. Plus we never moved to uncontested scrums like Wales did. Check it out here -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wFDx2j9fx8

Second, even though we have some naturalized players we aren't breaking any rule. England, France, etc. even New Zealand have naturalized players.

Third, we have beaten Samoa with half of our team missing. And now we are fielding even a weaker team against Tonga and we still have chance of winning.

Fourth, just like others said we have 10 U23 players in the squad against Tonga and more youngsters are about to come.

Fifth, your 55k crowd brings a total gate of about what? 50k EUR? Or even less? What's your medium ticket price? 1 eurocent? Our's is 15 EUR. Considering the fact that our stadium will be expanded to about 10k places, you do the math.

Sixth, the French have implemented the JIFF rule. We'll see how tough you are 10 years from now with your semi-amateur national championship.

Seventh, it's been almost 10 years since you preached the end of the Romanian rugby on the old FIRA forum. Now we are close to our best ranking position which was 13.

Eighth, our Ministry of Sports is about to prioritize funding for the top 15 sports in our country, rugby being among them. This means increased funding for rugby starting from 2018. Also FRR have already secured new sponsors.

Ninth, sometimes I wonder if some members of the forum(you and the guy with the PUB especially) have 1 neuron or you guys just don't understand English language.

Tenth, no matter what you say, or how much you pray Romanian rugby won't die. The whole infrastructure is about to be improved, some new stadiums such as Craiova's, Ploiesti can already host rugby matches + the upcoming Steaua, Dinamo and Rapid stadiums, each of them having between 18k and 30k seats. We will have improved funding, the playing numbers among juniors is slowly but steadily improving, and even the visibility of the sport is increasing(even against Brazil the stadium was almost full). And above all, we have an improving economy(even with that idiotic government that we have now), no 1 in EU in the 3rd quater of 2017.


So good luck waiting for Romanian rugby to die.


P.S. This is not a post to discredit Georgians or GEO rugby. This is a response to some posters who are trying throw dirt towards our rugby.
Last edited by Kiroshi on Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 19:59, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Kiroshi » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 19:58

amz wrote:Tincu retired from 2012, Fercu didn't played in June or this November. What matches are you watching? Are you even watching other teams than Georgia?

Some of the Georgians you listed are yet to play full tests, be starters at their clubs or play professional rugby somewhere. Two are solid tough, Sharikadze and Lobzhanidze with the last one stagnant from 2 years already. Matiashvili is also on the rise and soon to be their level but the rest...are at best only bets so far. Even Mchedlidze who is in France from some time struggles with form and I don't remember any good match made by him for Lelos. He's a limited player, a driving play type of wing, this is all so will hardly improve your creativity even if he is a French club based player.


Oh yeah Lobzhanidze, the new rugby superstar who was NULL(not even 0(joke for programmers)) when compared with Surugiu in our last match.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby beber » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 20:34

Kiroshi wrote:
Fifth, your 55k crowd brings a total gate of about what? 50k EUR? Or even less? What's your medium ticket price? 1 eurocent? Our's is 15 EUR. Considering the fact that our stadium will be expanded to about 10k places, you do the math.


IIRC, between 5 GEL (1.57€) and 10 GEL (3.14€)
Saying on average 7.5 GEL, a 55K crowd brings more than 125K€
But beyond the money, it's always more pleasant to see a big and full stadium from my POV

amz wrote:Some of the Georgians you listed are yet to play full tests, be starters at their clubs or play professional rugby somewhere. Two are solid tough, Sharikadze and Lobzhanidze with the last one stagnant from 2 years already.


Lobzhanidze was named player of the month in September by Brive supporters. I don't think he is stagnant, despite his poor game against Wales.
Last edited by beber on Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:07, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby amz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 20:38

Canadian_Rugger wrote:Romania has, since 2013, beaten:

Tonga, Samoa, Canada, USA, Uruguay, Namibia, Russia, Spain, etc.


and Georgia ;)

Worth adding that Lelos never beat T1 opposition.

@beber: OK player of the month but as datodato put it
"one swallow does not a summer make" to quote Aristotle

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Canadian_Rugger » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 20:45

amz wrote:
Canadian_Rugger wrote:Romania has, since 2013, beaten:

Tonga, Samoa, Canada, USA, Uruguay, Namibia, Russia, Spain, etc.


and Georgia ;)

Worth adding that Lelos never beat T1 opposition.

@beber: OK player of the month but as datodato put it
"one swallow does not a summer make" to quote Aristotle



Almost forgot! You won the REC this year!

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby GeoRugby » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:01

Canadian_Rugger wrote:Legit comment from a neutral supporter. At present I rate both Romania and Georgia as equals as far as on pitch performances are concerned. Romania, through their professional Superliga, have clearly improved. Both have bested Pacific Isle Sides the past few years:

Romania has, since 2013, beaten:

Tonga, Samoa, Canada, USA, Uruguay, Namibia, Russia, Spain, etc.

They've also lost two close matches against Japan, the match in Japan was particularly impressive as it was their first tour in years. They also nearly beat Italy at the World Cup and gave them a very good game. Their professional clubs have also given a better showing than any of the Italian Excellenza Clubs and would rate the top half of Superliga as better than anything outside Treviso or Aironi in Italy, even then, I think the top teams might even knock those two off.

Given all this, I'd rate Georgia as slightly better but Romania are not far off and I'd rate both as at least equal to Italy in terms of ability. They, along with Japan and Fiji are the cream of Tier 2 and are Tier 1 for all intents and purposes.

Agree with this assessment.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby amz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:09

beber wrote:Lobzhanidze was named player of the month in September by Brive supporters. I don't think he is stagnant, despite his poor game against Wales.


I noticed on wiki 15 matches for Brive for him since 2015, this is pretty low and than I went to check his stats:

http://www.itsrugby.co.uk/player-34004.html

It seems this season started 1 match in Challenge Cup (when many reserves play) and 1 in Top 14 and played a grand total of 5 matches. How was voted player of the month beats me, was that try so important? Or it was a top on a forum of supporters well advertised to Georgian fans who voted regardless of his performance. To me it looks he rarely gets a spot lately.

LE: Just to be clear, I don't want to take anything from player's merit , he is certainly a very good prospect, had a very good RWC for a youngster and I do agree it is difficult for him to play at such an young age in Top 14. But some stagnation seem to happen and these votes cannot take the place of consistent game time. He's young, he have time to develop and settle in a big club but don't take from granted each career, one bad injury and one player can be off, stay on bench half season and all form and confidence gone etc. That's why I always said the main issue for you on your bid for 6N is depth of squad and without a regular club competition to feed players at a decent level you'll be at the hand of foreign clubs all the time and it will be just a merry go roun, this one is injured, other can't come, another one didn't played or played too much and is too tired. Professional environment don't guarantee you'll have all the time best players available and that's why Haig earlier this year was talking about Super Rugby or Pro 14, because that's what he needs, a side to play week in week out. T1 tests alone are obviously a good thing but don't help development but only help getting better experience.

As someone pointed on a different topic, this is the advantage T1 sides will always have and this is were all T2 nations should look to close the gap and not by gaining a test here and there. There's no coincidence that Japan is the most successful one, they have strong local competition. Even if they have players abroad, they have a replacement all the time at a decent level.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby beber » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:37

amz wrote:
beber wrote:Lobzhanidze was named player of the month in September by Brive supporters. I don't think he is stagnant, despite his poor game against Wales.


I noticed on wiki 15 matches for Brive for him since 2015, this is pretty low and than I went to check his stats:

http://www.itsrugby.co.uk/player-34004.html

It seems this season started 1 match in Challenge Cup (when many reserves play) and 1 in Top 14 and played a grand total of 5 matches. How was voted player of the month beats me, was that try so important? Or it was a top on a forum of supporters well advertised to Georgian fans who voted regardless of his performance. To me it looks he rarely gets a spot lately.

He was named by the club, alongside 2 other players and fans voted. He played every Top14 game in September . Georgian fans possibly voted for him

On Brive official forum, many Brive fans are calling the coach to give Lobzhanidze a better gametime, saying he was very good each time he played
https://www.cabrive-rugby.com/mp_composants/forum


Saying that this conflict between Georgia and Romania is ridiculous.
Georgia has his strategy to growth. Putting a lot efforts on youth players, and trying to send young guns abroard to professional teams.
Romania has his strategy to growth. Have a professional championship.

It's, for both nations, the best way. Georgian clubs simply can't have enough money to make professional teams and Romania U20 and U18 results are too poor to take the georgian way.

I think, for the past few years Georgia showed a bit more than Romania did. But I also think Romania is not appreciated at its real value and deserve more Tier1 tests. Beating Samoa, Georgia and Tonga are strong results! I would love to see them playing against latin teams like France or Argentina.
Last edited by beber on Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:39, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Nikoloz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:38

It`s so funny and uncomfortable as well to read all this comments above from both sides. Both sides are killing the spirit of rugby and it`s really funny to read all this staff here about Romanian naturalized team and about the stagnation of Lobzhanidze. I`m not trying to teach you something and I have no right to do that, but let me tell you that this is the most ridiculous thead I`ve ever read.

Georgians, get used to it that we lost REC this year.
Romanians, get used to it that nowadays we are better.

I don`t want to write in a spirit of "let`s support each other" etc. but, let`s support each other. Romanians have a great chance to climb on 13th place this Saturday and we both will be ahead of Italy. That`s a very interesting situation for both of us! Come on guys!

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby amz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:55

@beber, there's a forum so? Not even a link to a discussion. I speak French so show us the respective discussion. We can vote here Papua is the best Rugby Union Pacific side, who cares? As for your "peaceful" message, I've seen so many "neutral" posts from your in a passive aggressive manner that I don't buy your neutrality anymore. I mean, I read your posts since old FIRA forums, who do you think you're kidding?

Nikoloz wrote:It`s so funny and uncomfortable as well to read all this comments above from both sides. Both sides are killing the spirit of rugby and it`s really funny to read all this staff here about Romanian naturalized team and about the stagnation of Lobzhanidze. I`m not trying to teach you something and I have no right to do that, but let me tell you that this is the most ridiculous thead I`ve ever read.

Georgians, get used to it that we lost REC this year.
Romanians, get used to it that nowadays we are better.

I don`t want to write in a spirit of "let`s support each other" etc. but, let`s support each other. Romanians have a great chance to climb on 13th place this Saturday and we both will be ahead of Italy. That`s a very interesting situation for both of us! Come on guys!


I do agree is ridiculous. I don't know from how long you read these forums but I reckoned Georgia was better in last years and curently is the better team. I would have probably sympathize with Lelos if I wouldn't have met Georgian supporters who constantly target Romanian rugby which by their say is near death, is sinking, it's bad, it's crap, whatever. Now there's a new marotte, the mercenaries. ;) It gives me also a disconfort to be dragged in this type of discussion but I cannot simply stay serene watching others bashing my country on each occasion.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby fullbackace » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 21:59

Nikoloz wrote:It`s so funny and uncomfortable as well to read all this comments above from both sides. Both sides are killing the spirit of rugby and it`s really funny to read all this staff here about Romanian naturalized team and about the stagnation of Lobzhanidze. I`m not trying to teach you something and I have no right to do that, but let me tell you that this is the most ridiculous thead I`ve ever read.

Georgians, get used to it that we lost REC this year.
Romanians, get used to it that nowadays we are better.

I don`t want to write in a spirit of "let`s support each other" etc. but, let`s support each other. Romanians have a great chance to climb on 13th place this Saturday and we both will be ahead of Italy. That`s a very interesting situation for both of us! Come on guys!

:thumbup:


this thread in a nutshell https://giphy.com/gifs/poop-gorilla-thr ... FaUF0nD560
Don't Pray For Easy lives, Pray for enough Beer!

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby BigG » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 22:03

whose idea was that to initiate a discussion which one is better?
Kindergarten.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby beber » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 22:07

amz wrote:@beber, there's a forum so? Not even a link to a discussion. I speak French so show us the respective discussion. We can vote here Papua is the best Rugby Union Pacific side, who cares? As for your "peaceful" message, I've seen so many "neutral" posts from your in a passive aggressive manner that I don't buy your neutrality anymore. I mean, I read your posts since old FIRA forums, who do you think you're kidding?

https://www.cabrive-rugby.com/mp_compos ... ze#p164914
https://www.cabrive-rugby.com/mp_compos ... bz#p164960
https://www.cabrive-rugby.com/mp_compos ... 1&t=4890&p =165992&hilit=lobz#p165992
https://www.cabrive-rugby.com/mp_compos ... bz#p166001



Me ? aggressive ?
I am a fan of Georgian rugby. I also follow closely Romania and the Super Liga for years. Show me a message where I am aggressive please? Show me a message where I criticize Romanian rugby ? If you can't please never quote me again.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby GeoRugby » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 22:34

AMZ. You need to take your favorite advise and calm your tits. Check fullbackace's link.
Last edited by GeoRugby on Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 23:01, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby 4N » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 22:41

beber wrote:Me ? aggressive ?
I am a fan of Georgian rugby. I also follow closely Romania and the Super Liga for years. Show me a message where I am aggressive please? Show me a message where I criticize Romanian rugby ? If you can't please never quote me again.


Beber I have posted alongside you for years and never recall you acting aggressively. Just a rugby fan armed with lots of good stats. :thumbup:

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Nikoloz » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 22:51

amz wrote:@beber, there's a forum so? Not even a link to a discussion. I speak French so show us the respective discussion. We can vote here Papua is the best Rugby Union Pacific side, who cares? As for your "peaceful" message, I've seen so many "neutral" posts from your in a passive aggressive manner that I don't buy your neutrality anymore. I mean, I read your posts since old FIRA forums, who do you think you're kidding?

Nikoloz wrote:It`s so funny and uncomfortable as well to read all this comments above from both sides. Both sides are killing the spirit of rugby and it`s really funny to read all this staff here about Romanian naturalized team and about the stagnation of Lobzhanidze. I`m not trying to teach you something and I have no right to do that, but let me tell you that this is the most ridiculous thead I`ve ever read.

Georgians, get used to it that we lost REC this year.
Romanians, get used to it that nowadays we are better.

I don`t want to write in a spirit of "let`s support each other" etc. but, let`s support each other. Romanians have a great chance to climb on 13th place this Saturday and we both will be ahead of Italy. That`s a very interesting situation for both of us! Come on guys!


I do agree is ridiculous. I don't know from how long you read these forums but I reckoned Georgia was better in last years and curently is the better team. I would have probably sympathize with Lelos if I wouldn't have met Georgian supporters who constantly target Romanian rugby which by their say is near death, is sinking, it's bad, it's crap, whatever. Now there's a new marotte, the mercenaries. ;) It gives me also a disconfort to be dragged in this type of discussion but I cannot simply stay serene watching others bashing my country on each occasion.


I`m not posting here, but reading this forum for more than a year almost every day. For this period I`ve seen a lot of discussions and arguing from both sides, but this is far too much :) I think this "fencing" between two sides (between Georgians and Romanians, not you) started/sharpened after the incident in Superliga including our players (I think all of us know what I`m talking about). After that I see that we are trying to be nice to keep up the spirit of rugby, but in every critical situation we are starting to eat each other. Anyway, I find it very interesting to have Romania as a opponent and it`s way too sad that there is no third of fourth team. So, we are boiling together in one jar. Today we are better, tomorrow you, maybe )) We were improving each others skills for years and last Saturday and results in general are the merit of both sides. So... the path will be long and thorny and we have to path through it together.

What a sweat text, I`m almost melting, hah ))))

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby datodato » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 23:26

Ok, Romanians clearly won here. We can close this thread.

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Re: Georgia vs Romania discussion

Postby Zhenya_Zima » Tue, 21 Nov 2017, 23:41

Erm, go Russia?

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Why Romania Georgia discussion thread locked?

Postby amz » Wed, 22 Nov 2017, 06:36

Why is it locked? First was detached from Lelos topic, which is fine by me, didn't understood why dato started to post there, now is locked and I wonder why. I do get the discussion may not be pleasant but there is also an option to not open the thread. I mean, you either lock it when a random poster started to call a national team a mercenary one, moderate it if you don't like it or let it flow if you decided to make a new thread because you think worth a discussion. May I know why? It's not new thing to have such exchanges of pleasantries. If you don't like'em just cut them from the root next time.

I wanted to reply because beber accused me of calling him "aggressive" and I said something else, please read again, I have no doubt you know what it means and you don't need google. As for your bias or sympathy towards Georgia, it's fine by me beber, everybody in entitled to, the only things that bothers me is claiming neutrality, that's all. And if you want examples of bias, you post any try scored by a Georgian in an forgoten espoir game nobody cares about but you don't mention for example two Oaks are captaining French sides, one Top 14 and one Pro D2. Which I don't mind as I said, people are free to have sympathy towards a team and follow certain players, I for example have a sympathy towards Uruguay and I follow Los Teros. Just don't claim neutrality and don't fell offended when you enter in the middle of a brawl and take some punches because you aren't perceived as neutral.

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Re: Why Romania Georgia discussion thread locked?

Postby Bogdan_DC » Wed, 22 Nov 2017, 06:58

I don't agree with you amz , you can have objectivity even if you cheer for a team or another. And is beber case also.
But yes, why they close that thread?Censorship is everywhere :).

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