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Canadian rugby

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby rusty_lock » Wed, 27 Jun 2018, 21:02

I agree with the last two posts but my problem is the it will be a generation before we see the fruit of that method. I think a two pronged approach that streams exceptional athletes with potential into high performance programs can bear fruit in the near term. I realize that the challenge is finding meaningful competition that fosters development. But RC has to do something besides put on dinners and circle jerk to the good old days. The alternative is rugby oblivion for 30 years

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby cien_almas » Thu, 28 Jun 2018, 00:46

Are there any Canadian qualified by nationality/grandparents Canada can push for in other countries? There have to be some players in NZ, SA, or UK at the Currie Cup-ish level who are better than some of the guys they are pushing these days. I suppose USA and Uruguay haven't really gone that route but there has to be some short term help for Canada there.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby marvinparsons » Thu, 28 Jun 2018, 03:32

cien_almas wrote:Are there any Canadian qualified by nationality/grandparents Canada can push for in other countries? There have to be some players in NZ, SA, or UK at the Currie Cup-ish level who are better than some of the guys they are pushing these days. I suppose USA and Uruguay haven't really gone that route but there has to be some short term help for Canada there.


Evan Olmstead, Josh Larsen, Gordon McRorie, Shane O'Leary, all already on the team. Tangential links to Canada. If they had more out there they'd use them.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby marvinparsons » Thu, 28 Jun 2018, 03:47

rusty_lock wrote:I agree with the last two posts but my problem is the it will be a generation before we see the fruit of that method. I think a two pronged approach that streams exceptional athletes with potential into high performance programs can bear fruit in the near term. I realize that the challenge is finding meaningful competition that fosters development. But RC has to do something besides put on dinners and circle jerk to the good old days. The alternative is rugby oblivion for 30 years


Agreed. I just think the idea that you can plow rugby players into "elite" training environments absent regular games against similarly "elite" competition is a complete fallacy and the notion that this is a sensible strategy should be dispelled. This is the CRC/Langford model and I think it's fair to say that the results are in and it is an abject failure.

To use the John Tavares analogy he spent his formative years in high level training environments, but this was probably 95% on his AAA teams/Junior teams that played other teams in his region and where 95% of the other players on the ice never went anywhere. It wasn't training by himself or 5 exhibition games with 20 other players; he probably barely had any more training than the 3rd liners on those same teams minus a few all-star games here or there.

The guys in Langford (and everyone else) would be better off if they just played regularly in the CDI or a Marshall league that was improved with the money being spent on these players/Langford/CRC. You only need 6-8 clubs per league and the travel isn't even crazy or anything. A rising tide raises all boats. A low tide sinks all ships and that's where we're at: horrible club rugby and abhorrent test rugby.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby therugbycoach » Thu, 28 Jun 2018, 15:30

Canada has unique problems which im not sure the RC exec people have any ideas on...
the country is too big, the player bases are too far apart, the climate isnt right for rugby in a huge part of the country for 6 months

You can see the idea with selecting the "Best" players and dumping them away from everyone in a place where climate isnt as much of an issue... what they seem to forget that Those "Best" may not be anymore .. yet due to the club game and distances between clubs you never / well selectors dont get to see the best of the rest against each other enough to know if anyone is better that the mob they have. And the other club player may net be getting to a better standard due to knowing there is no real selection may also be a reason they never want experienced coaches only ones with level 1 papers etc.

Its good to identify youth u19 u20 etc as prospectives but they need to be playing a lot of rugby to get the skills and experience and even a real love of rugby. Many will lose drive when serious GFs and work / school interests take hold and then of course if they arent rich enough to pay their own way

Mind you saying this i think even with a lot of National team being involved with MLR or in Europe / UK they would be better Most look a lot better in there games away from Canadian national team that they ever do playing in it

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Thu, 28 Jun 2018, 17:33

therugbycoach wrote:Canada has unique problems which im not sure the RC exec people have any ideas on...
the country is too big, the player bases are too far apart, the climate isnt right for rugby in a huge part of the country for 6 months

You can see the idea with selecting the "Best" players and dumping them away from everyone in a place where climate isnt as much of an issue... what they seem to forget that Those "Best" may not be anymore .. yet due to the club game and distances between clubs you never / well selectors dont get to see the best of the rest against each other enough to know if anyone is better that the mob they have. And the other club player may net be getting to a better standard due to knowing there is no real selection may also be a reason they never want experienced coaches only ones with level 1 papers etc.

Its good to identify youth u19 u20 etc as prospectives but they need to be playing a lot of rugby to get the skills and experience and even a real love of rugby. Many will lose drive when serious GFs and work / school interests take hold and then of course if they arent rich enough to pay their own way

Mind you saying this i think even with a lot of National team being involved with MLR or in Europe / UK they would be better Most look a lot better in there games away from Canadian national team that they ever do playing in it


Couple of issues with current Rugby Canada rules. Players should be able to choose their club. So Rugby Canada has a centralized group training at Langford that then goes off to train with their clubs in the CDI BC Premier League. When Barkwill wasn't on the Seawolves as one of the most Senior Canadian players he chose not to be selected over some of the younger national team players in his club. RC only allowed 5 Capped players to named per match 23. So then you have 6-7 National Team Player pool guys in a club and only five will get 1st team match time during that week. So I suppose you could allocate the players out, or you could just let them join a club of their choosing and not worry about it.

Well the issue gets compounded when you remove your national team player pool from competition, you could say this is because HP department doesn't regard the level of competition as high enough. But that level of competition is still higher than what the 25 guys in the training group get because it is live match time against an opponent wanting to win. Whereas the Central training group is just training and going up against themselves and no one else.

Uruguayan National team players once selected all move to Monte Video if they aren't already in Monte Video and join a club there. So the players are centralized and it raises the level of competition within that league. For years RC told players to move from wherever they were if they wanted a shot. The pay was shit but good men like Johnny Moonlight and his brother moved to BC to do just that. If RC had the money, or not even the money. Just get a partnership with a University in Ontario to make that the Eastern High Performance Center and designate the Ontario League as another place for National Pool players to play.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Used2BwithIt » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 02:51

Saw this job advert for a Chief Operating Officer. Is someone currently in this role or is this added management?

https://www.linkedin.com/jobs/view/chie ... 732080387/

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby grande » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 15:21

Looks like it was previously held by Myles Spencer.

According to this article, Spencer was fired at the same time as Jim Dixon (Nov 2017)
http://theprovince.com/sports/rugby/rug ... t-shake-up

But according to his LinkedIn, he's been the COO until April 2018.
https://ca.linkedin.com/in/myles-spencer-70951789

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby grande » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 15:31

I don't remember this summer's CRC season mentioned here, so I'll post it.

Exhibition matches

July 26: Cork (IRE) vs The Rock (Swilers)

CRC Round Robin

July 27: Bears vs Wolfpack (Calgary Rugby Park)
Aug 3: Wolfpack vs Bears (UBC)
Aug 4: Blues vs Rock (TBA)
Aug 7: Rock vs Blues (TBA)

CRC Finals

Aug 23: West 1 vs East 2 and East 1 vs West 2 (Calgary Rugby Park)
Aug 26: 3rd Place & Finals (Calgary Rugby Park)

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby mb.rugger89 » Fri, 13 Jul 2018, 17:23

Look at that, the plan forward. Not too sure i agree with the 2 months of training at langford. Why not tour the provinces to play, sure its not a high standard of rugby but its more training as a team which would benefit them.


https://rugby.ca/en/news/2018/07/canada ... -repechage

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