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Canadian rugby

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Blurandski » Sat, 19 May 2018, 19:02

TheStroBro wrote:
marvinparsons wrote:Why would you even invest money for this season if you didn't want to join a pro league? That has to be the only objective. You can't have a pro team that isn't in a league.


When I last spoke with Mark Winokur they had already done several feasability studies. Their first proof of concept was the match against the Merlins in the fall. Webb felt comfortable moving forward with a full exhibition season. Their business model has several triggers that they had to meet to give the investment group what they wanted. I'll be arranging some time to speak with Bill Webb and Mark Winokur again when they've completed this longer trial. When they played Utah they were pretty close to where they wanted to be. However, he stated to me that their decision window has always been in June. Financing is in place, Partnerships and Sponsorships as well. Money isn't the issue for them.


I still can't believe that people in NA actually have their stuff together with regard to rugby, there's been so, so many false dawns, but this time it looks like the real thing. That level of planning is very good.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby GentsRugger » Sat, 19 May 2018, 19:08

Can they compete with TWP? They’ve already shown they can. Their first home game was at the exact same day and time and TWP drew 1,000-1,500 more than the Arrows.
Two home openers the same day. One team well established (TWP) and one team brand new that didn’t use any advertising just Twitter, Facebook, Instagram and word of mouth(Arrows).
The difference in attendance wasn’t that impressive if you’re TWP. TWP selling all their tickets now or are they still giving away tickets for free?
Your question of whether they can compete with TWP has already been answered.
First you don’t think they have the money. Then when it turns out they do you don’t believe they can compete with TWP even though they’ve proven they can.
What’s the next thing on your list of reasons this won’t work?
Could be time to admit it just might...

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Blurandski » Sat, 19 May 2018, 19:13

Canadian_Rugger wrote: The big kicker will be if they can compete with TWP because they will need to. I'm a little worried because I feel that Rugby Canada has neglected the Ontario market at its own peril. I'm not talking about the amateur game either. As far as I'm concerned, the popularity of the amateur game is completely irrelevant to how successful a professional sports team will be in Toronto.

TWP have money, they have an extremely wealthy backer and they have made clear signals of intent that they will be playing in the top flight next season. If they are playing the likes of St Helens, Wigan, Catalans Dragons, Leeds and Toulouse next season in TO, I'm uncertain there is room in the market for another team.

I say this having went to the most recent TWP game at Fletchers, lots of Union people there but a tonne of casuals who don't know the sport but like it a lot. I've never seen a lot of casuals at any Rugby Union match in this country, even test matches.


Their owner has ploughed a ridiculous amount of money in to marketing (they give away a tonne of tickets), and is planning on opening up two more franchises, but his entire model rests on getting a big TV deal in NA, which I can't see them getting without genuine grassroots growth (in which they are investing next to nothing in), I also can't help but wonder how attractive Toronto vs places no-one has ever heard of vs Toronto v DC/NY/Houston will be. Plus next year it's been confirmed that they can't do the block fixtures thing, so they'll be crossing the Atlantic ~30 times, which will kill their players. Total ticket revenue ($25*6,000*15) is just above $2.25m CAN, which is half their salary cap (and they're spending up to it). They'll not survive to the 10 year mark imo, by which time total loss will be north of £15m GBP. Of course that all rests on them not getting that massive TV deal (which they're 99.5% not going to get). RL is dying for a reason.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby GentsRugger » Sat, 19 May 2018, 19:17

Oh yeah, you talk about the casual sports fans. What casual sports fan knows who the hell St Helens, Wigan, Catalan Dragons is? I’ll bet you the casual sports fan knows New York, DC and the rest of the MLR cities. Try explaining a TWP rivalry with Leeds or some club in the UK to a casual sports fan and then try explaining a rivalry between the Arrows and NY. I can tell you which one will be easier...

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Canadian_Rugger » Sat, 19 May 2018, 21:56

GentsRugger wrote:Can they compete with TWP? They’ve already shown they can. Their first home game was at the exact same day and time and TWP drew 1,000-1,500 more than the Arrows.
Two home openers the same day. One team well established (TWP) and one team brand new that didn’t use any advertising just Twitter, Facebook, Instagram and word of mouth(Arrows).
The difference in attendance wasn’t that impressive if you’re TWP. TWP selling all their tickets now or are they still giving away tickets for free?
Your question of whether they can compete with TWP has already been answered.
First you don’t think they have the money. Then when it turns out they do you don’t believe they can compete with TWP even though they’ve proven they can.
What’s the next thing on your list of reasons this won’t work?
Could be time to admit it just might...


They invested $200,000 this year, that is not a large sum of money. That's not even junior A hockey money. As far as attendance goes, tickets were capped at 3000 for the Wolfpack match at Fletchers, the Wolfpack sold all the tickets. Fletchers isn't a good venue but it was the best available.

The real home opener on June 9th when they play London will be a good litmus test of the actual popularity of the team.

GentsRugger wrote:Oh yeah, you talk about the casual sports fans. What casual sports fan knows who the hell St Helens, Wigan, Catalan Dragons is? I’ll bet you the casual sports fan knows New York, DC and the rest of the MLR cities. Try explaining a TWP rivalry with Leeds or some club in the UK to a casual sports fan and then try explaining a rivalry between the Arrows and NY. I can tell you which one will be easier...


Toronto is a cosmpolitan city, it's clear a large part of TWP strategy is to appeal to expats and non-traditional rugby fans of which there are a plethora in Toronto. It's the same reason Soccer clubs can play exhibition matches in Toronto and put 50,000 fans in to the Rogers Centre.

Blurandski wrote:
Canadian_Rugger wrote: The big kicker will be if they can compete with TWP because they will need to. I'm a little worried because I feel that Rugby Canada has neglected the Ontario market at its own peril. I'm not talking about the amateur game either. As far as I'm concerned, the popularity of the amateur game is completely irrelevant to how successful a professional sports team will be in Toronto.

TWP have money, they have an extremely wealthy backer and they have made clear signals of intent that they will be playing in the top flight next season. If they are playing the likes of St Helens, Wigan, Catalans Dragons, Leeds and Toulouse next season in TO, I'm uncertain there is room in the market for another team.

I say this having went to the most recent TWP game at Fletchers, lots of Union people there but a tonne of casuals who don't know the sport but like it a lot. I've never seen a lot of casuals at any Rugby Union match in this country, even test matches.


Their owner has ploughed a ridiculous amount of money in to marketing (they give away a tonne of tickets), and is planning on opening up two more franchises, but his entire model rests on getting a big TV deal in NA, which I can't see them getting without genuine grassroots growth (in which they are investing next to nothing in), I also can't help but wonder how attractive Toronto vs places no-one has ever heard of vs Toronto v DC/NY/Houston will be. Plus next year it's been confirmed that they can't do the block fixtures thing, so they'll be crossing the Atlantic ~30 times, which will kill their players. Total ticket revenue ($25*6,000*15) is just above $2.25m CAN, which is half their salary cap (and they're spending up to it). They'll not survive to the 10 year mark imo, by which time total loss will be north of £15m GBP. Of course that all rests on them not getting that massive TV deal (which they're 99.5% not going to get). RL is dying for a reason.


TWP don't care if they get included in the TV deal, in fact, the team has come out and said they would be ok if the English clubs kept it all, with the caveat they get exclusive rights to the Canadian market. Bargaining of course.

The block fixtures piece is not true, they will be allowed block fixtures. This year was an anomaly because they needed a new field which is why they spent the first part of the season playing away.

Also, it is true they gave away tickets last year but why is that a bad thing? That is how you attract corporate sponsorship and build interest. Hockey teams also give away tickets, I've seen two Leafs games with ticket giveaways and that is the richest sports franchise is Canada.

There are a lot of people that want TWP to fail. I'm backing them 100% and am so happy that someone not connected to our overpoliticized rugby union is finally doing something with the round ball. I don't even care that it is league, in fact the sport is growing on me.

Super League is going to change next year. It's clear the big clubs want TWP, Toulouse, New York, London and Catalans in the League. There are a lot of behind the scenes negotiations ongoing atm.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Blurandski » Sat, 19 May 2018, 22:04

Canadian_Rugger wrote:
They invested $200,000 this year, that is not a large sum of money. That's not even junior A hockey money. As far as attendance goes, tickets were capped at 3000 for the Wolfpack match at Fletchers, the Wolfpack sold all the tickets. Fletchers isn't a good venue but it was the best available.

The real home opener on June 9th when they play London will be a good litmus test of the actual popularity of the team.

Toronto is a cosmpolitan city, it's clear a large part of TWP strategy is to appeal to expats and non-traditional rugby fans of which there are a plethora in Toronto. It's the same reason Soccer clubs can play exhibition matches in Toronto and put 50,000 fans in to the Rogers Centre.

TWP don't care if they get included in the TV deal, in fact, the team has come out and said they would be ok if the English clubs kept it all, with the caveat they get exclusive rights to the Canadian market. Bargaining of course.

The block fixtures piece is not true, they will be allowed block fixtures. This year was an anomaly because they needed a new field which is why they spent the first part of the season playing away.

Also, it is true they gave away tickets last year but why is that a bad thing? That is how you attract corporate sponsorship and build interest. Hockey teams also give away tickets, I've seen two Leafs games with ticket giveaways and that is the richest sports franchise is Canada.

There are a lot of people that want TWP to fail. I'm backing them 100% and am so happy that someone not connected to our overpoliticized rugby union is finally doing something with the round ball. I don't even care that it is league, in fact the sport is growing on me.

Super League is going to change next year. It's clear the big clubs want TWP, Toulouse, New York, London and Catalans in the League. There are a lot of behind the scenes negotiations ongoing atm.


That's what I meant about the TV deal, they're banking on a massive NA deal, which I cannot see happening. With regards to block fixtures, from what I've read on total RL that is not the case.

There's nothing bad about giving away tickets, but it means that attendance is a shite measure of interest for them. I'm also away of the behind the scenes machinations, and RL if they're not careful are going to kill themselves by kicking out half the academies in return for foreign shores, but not actually have a high enough quality player base. TWP also rub me up the wrong way because they're doing absolutely nothing for the grassroots.

RL lacks long-term planning, and while I do want it to succeed (oval ball > round ball), in the past three years I've seen my local RL franchise fold due to attracting fewer spectators than my school's fourth XV. My uni RL has also folded due to only having 5 players, and the only league team in my county is on the verge of folding. Why? RL stopped doing development officers, due to the greedy SL clubs wanting more money. Without the umbrella of top tier RL locally RL really struggles, and what will including London, Toulouse, Catalans, Toronto, DC (NY is a dodo apparently), Jacksonville do? It'll kick out 5 top tier RL clubs, that in turn will be forced to scale down operations, which in turn will lead to the amateur game falling further.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Grayday88 » Sat, 19 May 2018, 22:17

I have to see having seen TWP last week at Warrington they will need to improve a lot to be competive in Super League.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Sat, 19 May 2018, 22:41

RL is run by people who thought an England V Kiwis Test in Mile High was a good idea.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Sat, 19 May 2018, 22:47

Rugby League’s biggest problem is they think they can just throw money at something and it will win people over. Reality is the sport doesn’t want to invest the decades of grass roots they need to genuinely build their game. I’ve already seen talk from RL fans about how they hope TWP can convert local rugby players but the issue is what can they offer long term that rugby can’t? The Arrows will more than likely join MLR, so professionalism at a club level is no longer a draw, and they’ve got the added appeal of regular international matches on top of the Olympics and World Cup. The issue isn’t limit to The UK, there are grassroots issues in Australia too with clubs struggling outside of Sydney in the country areas. This despite a 2 billion dollar TV deal.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Osmanperalta » Sat, 19 May 2018, 23:36

TheStroBro wrote:RL is run by people who thought an England V Kiwis Test in Mile High was a good idea.

dont forget the rugby league team in new york that will play in front of 20.000 people in just 3 years OMG :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Sun, 20 May 2018, 01:21

There's no real point crapping on RL. At the very least they're trying something, but as someone who grew up with and was a part of that community years ago I've just seen that sport believe its own BS far too many times without actually addressing the fundamental issue of building the game from the grassroots up. They tried it with Super League, they tried it with the World Cup, they just don't have the patience to put in 20-25 years of work to grow their sport globally or evan domestically. Rugby may have had a bigger footprint world wide but it wasn't until the World Cup started that serious efforts begun to actually grow the sport, and we're only just seeing that investment bare fruit now 30 years later.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby GentsRugger » Sun, 20 May 2018, 13:02

Canadian_Rugger wrote:Also, it is true they gave away tickets last year but why is that a bad thing? That is how you attract corporate sponsorship and build interest. Hockey teams also give away tickets, I've seen two Leafs games with ticket giveaways and that is the richest sports franchise is Canada.

The Leafs give away 100 tickets in a 19,000 capacity arena. TWP gives away a couple thousand tickets and then says "Look at our attendance numbers"*

*Disregard the fact we gave half the tickets away for free.

Little bit of a difference there, no?

There are a lot of people that want TWP to fail. I'm backing them 100% and am so happy that someone not connected to our overpoliticized rugby union is finally doing something with the round ball. I don't even care that it is league, in fact the sport is growing on me.

This is my whole point. Someone in Canadian rugby union is actually doing something but because for some reason it isn't up to your standard you're choosing to ignore it. Why don't you just admit at this point you like league better than union? It seems like you haven't paid attention to anything the Arrows are doing because you simply have no interest. You have no problem trashing them at every turn and talking about all these reasons it'll never work and they'll never be like TWP...even though your arguments for why they won't work can never hold any water.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby 4N » Sun, 20 May 2018, 13:25

GentsRugger wrote:
Canadian_Rugger wrote:Also, it is true they gave away tickets last year but why is that a bad thing? That is how you attract corporate sponsorship and build interest. Hockey teams also give away tickets, I've seen two Leafs games with ticket giveaways and that is the richest sports franchise is Canada.

The Leafs give away 100 tickets in a 19,000 capacity arena. TWP gives away a couple thousand tickets and then says "Look at our attendance numbers"*

*Disregard the fact we gave half the tickets away for free.

Little bit of a difference there, no?

There are a lot of people that want TWP to fail. I'm backing them 100% and am so happy that someone not connected to our overpoliticized rugby union is finally doing something with the round ball. I don't even care that it is league, in fact the sport is growing on me.

This is my whole point. Someone in Canadian rugby union is actually doing something but because for some reason it isn't up to your standard you're choosing to ignore it. Why don't you just admit at this point you like league better than union? It seems like you haven't paid attention to anything the Arrows are doing because you simply have no interest. You have no problem trashing them at every turn and talking about all these reasons it'll never work and they'll never be like TWP...even though your arguments for why they won't work can never hold any water.


This seems like a good way to alienate further people from Canadian rugby, not really something you guys need right now. What's wrong with liking both codes?

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Sun, 20 May 2018, 14:20

Yeah, let’s just keep some cool heads. There’s nothing wrong with liking both games and people are allowed to prefer one over the other.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Sun, 20 May 2018, 16:16

4N wrote:
This seems like a good way to alienate further people from Canadian rugby, not really something you guys need right now. What's wrong with liking both codes?

Nothing is wrong with it. North American RL fans are the ones who turn Union fans off. I pay a decent amount of attention to NRL, Australian Rugby League seems to be the only federation that is growing. I see grassroots efforts all over, for women's League they were ahead of the ARU when it came to a provincial comp. In the States, USAR Board may be incompetent, USARL is full of dudes who are allegedly criminals.

A friend of mine was the last League player banned by the RFU and he has a great quote: "Rugby, the only sport that eats itself." In reference to Union and League fighting each other.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Canadian_Rugger » Sun, 20 May 2018, 21:08

GentsRugger wrote:The Leafs give away 100 tickets in a 19,000 capacity arena. TWP gives away a couple thousand tickets and then says "Look at our attendance numbers"*

*Disregard the fact we gave half the tickets away for free.

Little bit of a difference there, no?


Actually, pro teams give away far more tickets than you think. Most of them are given to corporate sponsors who pay for box seats which is where the teams make a real killing or organizations the teams wants to use as a marketing prop (Armed Forces/Govt/Special Interest Groups) . They will give a corporate sponsor hundreds of tickets in some cases that can be distributed to employees and their families. I know this because I've literally been responsible for distributing the tickets for said events.

They will also do things like say its a sellout when it isn't in order to jack the price up and control prices through the manipulation of supply and demand. Hotels also use a similar practice which is why when you book a hotel room a couple of months out for a big event the price is astronomical and they may state they don't even have any rooms available and then low and behold, a day before a big event, rooms are available all of a sudden.

This is my whole point. Someone in Canadian rugby union is actually doing something but because for some reason it isn't up to your standard you're choosing to ignore it. Why don't you just admit at this point you like league better than union? It seems like you haven't paid attention to anything the Arrows are doing because you simply have no interest. You have no problem trashing them at every turn and talking about all these reasons it'll never work and they'll never be like TWP...even though your arguments for why they won't work can never hold any water.


I've got nothing against the Arrows or MLR, I'll def attend a match when/if they make the jump to MLR. This being said, I value the Wolfpack brand because they are running the organization like a true professional sport club. The problem with the Wolfpack is they are a franchise that is playing in a club system. The biggest threat to the Wolfpack is the RFL itself and its amateur clubs who have a lot of political power.

As for me liking League, yep, I like the sport more than Union now. Played Union all my life but as ball starved back, I appreciate the skill level on display in League. Some dynamic athletes playing that sport who can all kick, offload and pass way better than anything I've seen this side of the pond.

I've got zero respect for the Canadian Rugby Union, the latest money grab and money grovel was enough for me. I won't be supporting the organization or anyone that supports them. Have paid zero attention to Rugby Canada since the Qualifiers and I'm not going to watch any matches or pay to go to any matches until they clean up their act.

I would have liked the Arrows to have kept their players against the Selects, probably would have beat them. It would have made sense to do so from a business perspective so they could have shown the juice they are making is better than anything coming out of Langford.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Grayday88 » Sun, 20 May 2018, 22:41

I agree that the TWP biggest problem is the RFL it appears that (admittedly from Belfast looking in) League seems to be struggling everywhere except Australia. Personally I found the World Cup last year embarrassing with empty stadiums and a weird draw and in the case of some teams no players from that country playing for them.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Mon, 21 May 2018, 02:19

TheStroBro wrote:
4N wrote:
This seems like a good way to alienate further people from Canadian rugby, not really something you guys need right now. What's wrong with liking both codes?

Nothing is wrong with it. North American RL fans are the ones who turn Union fans off. I pay a decent amount of attention to NRL, Australian Rugby League seems to be the only federation that is growing. I see grassroots efforts all over, for women's League they were ahead of the ARU when it came to a provincial comp. In the States, USAR Board may be incompetent, USARL is full of dudes who are allegedly criminals.

A friend of mine was the last League player banned by the RFU and he has a great quote: "Rugby, the only sport that eats itself." In reference to Union and League fighting each other.


You're a little misinformed about what's happening down here with RL. ARU launched the Super W this year ahead of the women's League competition which is coming in September. Both are in response to the AFL creating a women's league. And the game has kinda flatlined in many areas from crowds to TV ratings and is still lacking resources in country areas. So what growth there is isn't huge and the game still doesn't have much of a presence outside of New South Wales and Queensland especially at a junior level. Last I looked there were only 4,000 players in Victoria this despite the fact the Melbourne Storm have been in existence for 20 years and have won a number of premierships. If you heard from real RL fans they will complain to hell about the lack of growth and development.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Mon, 21 May 2018, 02:42

thatrugbyguy wrote:
TheStroBro wrote:
4N wrote:
This seems like a good way to alienate further people from Canadian rugby, not really something you guys need right now. What's wrong with liking both codes?

Nothing is wrong with it. North American RL fans are the ones who turn Union fans off. I pay a decent amount of attention to NRL, Australian Rugby League seems to be the only federation that is growing. I see grassroots efforts all over, for women's League they were ahead of the ARU when it came to a provincial comp. In the States, USAR Board may be incompetent, USARL is full of dudes who are allegedly criminals.

A friend of mine was the last League player banned by the RFU and he has a great quote: "Rugby, the only sport that eats itself." In reference to Union and League fighting each other.


You're a little misinformed about what's happening down here with RL. ARU launched the Super W this year ahead of the women's League competition which is coming in September. Both are in response to the AFL creating a women's league. And the game has kinda flatlined in many areas from crowds to TV ratings and is still lacking resources in country areas. So what growth there is isn't huge and the game still doesn't have much of a presence outside of New South Wales and Queensland especially at a junior level. Last I looked there were only 4,000 players in Victoria this despite the fact the Melbourne Storm have been in existence for 20 years and have won a number of premierships. If you heard from real RL fans they will complain to hell about the lack of growth and development.


A lot of the "growth" the game has experienced over the past couple of years has been via adding the Touch Australia numbers to their participation figures. In reality it's struggling big time outside of the major centres of New South Wales and Queensland. For all the talk of what the new TV deal was going to deliver the truth is that it has found it's way into the pocket of the admin and players and not the grassroots clubs.

I actually come from a very strong League area in Sydney and things are not rosy at all. Year on year for the past 6 years they've recorded a decrease in youth participation in the game. A couple of hundred at a time. League like Rugby has failed to support it's grassroots. The NRL can mask this with spin but as above now both the decline in attendance and viewership is also becoming particularly stark.

The A-League isn't looking too good either by the way. Their ratings have fallen off a cliff. In fact the only code to be bucking this trend is the AFL. Who unsurprisingly spend a tonne of cash on their grassroots.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby GentsRugger » Mon, 21 May 2018, 03:16

4N wrote:This seems like a good way to alienate further people from Canadian rugby, not really something you guys need right now. What's wrong with liking both codes?


thatrugbyguy wrote:Yeah, let’s just keep some cool heads. There’s nothing wrong with liking both games and people are allowed to prefer one over the other.


I have no issues with anyone who likes both codes or prefers league over union.
However, I am getting pretty sick of every time the Arrows get brought up on this forum they get compared to TWP immediately.
The comparison is natural, I get that. The Arrows will never be TWP though. The TWP have a sugar daddy willing to lose bunches of money to join an established league.
The Arrows are trying to join a startup league and grow with this new league. Comparing them is crazy when they're not trying to be TWP and they never will be. For the record the jury is still out on which method will be successful. Crazy thought, maybe both methods will be?
Anyways, they're completely different. Yet every time the Arrows get brought up...
"Won't be successful they don't have as many followers on social media as TWP"
"Won't be successful they don't have as much money as TWP"
"Won't be successful they can't attract the casual fan like TWP"
"Won't be successful there's only room for 1 rugby team in Toronto and TWP got here first"

We finally are on the brink of professional rugby union in this country. I am very excited about it.
I am just sick of hearing about the TWP and how they're just this big booming business and nothing is happening in union when something is finally happening in union.

Maybe I'm completely on my own here but now that we finally have pro union potentially coming here I want to talk about that without it getting compared to TWP in every single aspect. I'm sick of it.
"They don't have the money to join the league"
Then when it turns out they do...
"Well they can't attract the casual fan, there's only room for one team here" etc etc etc.
I do come on this forum to talk about rugby union in Canada. Not to hear about why league is better.
If I'm just ranting and completely on my own here I hope the other members that often comment in this thread tell me that.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Mon, 21 May 2018, 04:50

The comparisons are going to happen, that's natural. I do agree though it shouldn't have to devolve into which sport is better whenever the topic is brought up.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Mon, 21 May 2018, 14:56

thatrugbyguy wrote:You're a little misinformed about what's happening down here with RL. ARU launched the Super W this year ahead of the women's League competition which is coming in September. Both are in response to the AFL creating a women's league. And the game has kinda flatlined in many areas from crowds to TV ratings and is still lacking resources in country areas. So what growth there is isn't huge and the game still doesn't have much of a presence outside of New South Wales and Queensland especially at a junior level. Last I looked there were only 4,000 players in Victoria this despite the fact the Melbourne Storm have been in existence for 20 years and have won a number of premierships. If you heard from real RL fans they will complain to hell about the lack of growth and development.

Well your Women's National team certainly sells the grassroots stuff hard on insta.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Mon, 21 May 2018, 22:22

That’s because they’re in a battle with other sports for female participation.

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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby jonny24 » Tue, 22 May 2018, 09:52

Idk, I think for every person who likes playing against established European teams, there's at least one person who would prefer our traditional north American sports rivalries.

If Arrows do make the jump they need to be taking marketing notes from TWP though.
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Re: Canadian rugby

Postby Neptune » Thu, 24 May 2018, 00:56

Quick question, are there any rugby clubs in the GTA, specifically Durham region? ( Whitby, Curtis, Ajax, Oshawa and Pickering)?

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