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German rugby

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Re: German rugby

Postby frakturfreak » Thu, 08 Feb 2018, 20:25

TheStroBro wrote:
CM wrote:No, the WRA has fucked up. The DRV President has stepped back after receiving anonymous threats, and wild is demanding 5-figure sums per player, to release them.

If this goes on HRK won't play in Europe next year, and Germany might go down, but the WRA has nothing to do in Germany. Society for rugby , my ass, more like society against rugby.

No dude, DRV didn't offer health insurance.


They did offer health insurance but basically everyone in German has to have one in Germany and they the DRV were ready to pay for extended foreign countriy insurrance policies for the WRA players playing Germany, read mulu’s statement on this topic here.

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Thu, 08 Feb 2018, 21:16

Hope this mess prove how wrong DRV bosses were. Put money on Healy and Lemoine to try to prove they were powerful was just bad management.
German clubs are now in front of two choices for the next election : they can continue to be jealous of what WRA accomplished trying to kill them and see German rugby going ten years back. Or they can admit WRA controls everything including players overseas and thank them giving them presidency and try to compete with WRA/HRK building something.
Last edited by olivier on Thu, 08 Feb 2018, 21:17, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: German rugby

Postby CM » Thu, 08 Feb 2018, 21:17

I still think the WRA has lost the public. They haven't communicated their problems, and if they said anything it seemed to amount to:"we want total control"
And while the money of wild and the expertise of his coaches and the skills of his players are always welcome, the DRV cannot become a billionaires plaything.
And from organizational side, the WRA wouldn't have added much, their promotion and communication never amounted to much.

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Thu, 08 Feb 2018, 21:22

Blank stepped down just before a massacre. It looks like he doesn't want to be considered as responsible of an historic humiliation.

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Re: German rugby

Postby CM » Thu, 08 Feb 2018, 21:23

olivier wrote:Hope this mess prove how wrong DRV bosses were. Put money on Healy and Lemoine to try to prove they were powerful was just bad management.
German clubs are now in front of two choices for the next election : they can continue to be jealous of what WRA accomplished trying to kill them and see German rugby going ten years back. Or they can admit WRA controls everything including players overseas and thank them giving them presidency and try to compete with WRA/HRK building something.

What players do they control? Hilsenbeck broke his hand, tussacs brother just died, haupt will never play every game, and some already arrived.
WRA didn't build anything, they recruited players. They did youth work, but the area where They worked is probably the only one with shrinking youth numbers.
What did they achieve? Where do they go from here? They have made themselves phenomenally unpopular. Good luck getting rid of this image now.
And Blank was just confirmed as president by an overwhelming majority, and was threatened by anonymous phone calls.

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Re: German rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 00:29

CM wrote:No, the WRA has fucked up. The DRV President has stepped back after receiving anonymous threats, and wild is demanding 5-figure sums per player, to release them.

If this goes on HRK won't play in Europe next year, and Germany might go down, but the WRA has nothing to do in Germany. Society for rugby , my ass, more like society against rugby.

DRV has definitely lost the plot. So what we have are two lost plots.

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Re: German rugby

Postby ihateblazers » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 04:33

If Wild really wants to help German rugby why doesnt he set up and fund a centralised league like PRO in the US. Hot housing guys in one team in an amateur league with no revenue to speak of and then making demands of a union which is almost broke seems incredibly petty and unproductive.

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 05:30

ihateblazers wrote:If Wild really wants to help German rugby why doesnt he set up and fund a centralised league like PRO in the US. Hot housing guys in one team in an amateur league with no revenue to speak of and then making demands of a union which is almost broke seems incredibly petty and unproductive.

I'm agree he missed that. His idea with WRA was to build an academy able to provide professional players to Germany.

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 05:37

CM wrote:
olivier wrote:Hope this mess prove how wrong DRV bosses were. Put money on Healy and Lemoine to try to prove they were powerful was just bad management.
German clubs are now in front of two choices for the next election : they can continue to be jealous of what WRA accomplished trying to kill them and see German rugby going ten years back. Or they can admit WRA controls everything including players overseas and thank them giving them presidency and try to compete with WRA/HRK building something.

What players do they control? Hilsenbeck broke his hand, tussacs brother just died, haupt will never play every game, and some already arrived.
WRA didn't build anything, they recruited players. They did youth work, but the area where They worked is probably the only one with shrinking youth numbers.
What did they achieve? Where do they go from here? They have made themselves phenomenally unpopular. Good luck getting rid of this image now.
And Blank was just confirmed as president by an overwhelming majority, and was threatened by anonymous phone calls.

You really want to defend current DRV... But you're really short in arguments. Could you please tell me the excuses of Tyumenev, Italians, Preocanin, Cameron-Dow, Murphy... The DRV badly listed players who were not able to play during all the season... That's incompetence.

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Re: German rugby

Postby mulu » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 06:51

olivier wrote:
CM wrote:
olivier wrote:Hope this mess prove how wrong DRV bosses were. Put money on Healy and Lemoine to try to prove they were powerful was just bad management.
German clubs are now in front of two choices for the next election : they can continue to be jealous of what WRA accomplished trying to kill them and see German rugby going ten years back. Or they can admit WRA controls everything including players overseas and thank them giving them presidency and try to compete with WRA/HRK building something.

What players do they control? Hilsenbeck broke his hand, tussacs brother just died, haupt will never play every game, and some already arrived.
WRA didn't build anything, they recruited players. They did youth work, but the area where They worked is probably the only one with shrinking youth numbers.
What did they achieve? Where do they go from here? They have made themselves phenomenally unpopular. Good luck getting rid of this image now.
And Blank was just confirmed as president by an overwhelming majority, and was threatened by anonymous phone calls.

You really want to defend current DRV... But you're really short in arguments. Could you please tell me the excuses of Tyumenev, Italians, Preocanin, Cameron-Dow, Murphy... The DRV badly listed players who were not able to play during all the season... That's incompetence.


Tyumenev - Strasbourg has only 4 front row players left so we made the agreement to get Mika released for game 3,4 and 5

Preocanin/Murphy - are not fulltime rugby players and therefor we mutually decided to have them available for game 3,4,5 as 6 weeks in a row are not doable with work

Cameron-Dow - just had a baby and will be available for game 2,3,4,5

Oltmann - injured himself in training last saturday and the extend of the injury is yet to be assessed.

btw all the players receive a match fee (for the first time in german rugby history) to (partly) compensate them for what they lose out with work and/or clubs. This was possible due to the fact that we found a private donor for that matter.

Just to clear things up: We are not fighting against the GFR/WRA, we are trying to find common ground while still respecting our constitution (which means that there are some rights the DRV can give away, especially not against the will of its members). Frankly we don’t know what the demands are, as there was never a clear communication around this.

The process is much more complex as it might seem from the outside and while I respect every opinion and comment it is sometimes interesting which judgements are being made without even understanding a fraction of what is going on.

While you are at it, check the german team which last played in Cluj (and the result of that game: http://www.espn.com.au/rugby/lineups?ga ... gue=239925) and then also please compare the starting lineups of germany v uruguay in frank­furt and uruguay v canada in montevideo, last but not least have a look at germany’s latest results v Belgium, Spain, Georgia and Russia and have a look at the rwc qualification table just to give things a little bit more realistic approach.

I don’t even want to start on how the level of play in the first division has decreased in the last 10 years and for what reason. I just can tell you that in 2007 (SC Neuenheim, RG Heidelberg, SC Frankfurt 80, Berliner RC, TSV Handschuhsheim, Heideberger RK, Hannover 78 and even RK Heusenstamm started the league with a realistic chance of making the final or even winning the championship) compare this to 10 years later and make your own assumptions why (amateur-)clubs don’t train 4-5 times a week any more to be competitive but went back to training 1 or 2 times a week and also have reduced their activities around youth rugby. I have an idea why this happened, what’s your educated guess?

BTW in my opinion the benefactor of SC Frankfurt 1880 (Uli Byszio) had the most lasting and positive influence on german rugby in the last 10-12 years. He set a benchmark with his semi-pro-players for the traditional clubs and once this clubs caught up he didn’t strip them of their best players but accepted to be beatable to keep the league competitive and concentrate on the youth. Therefor the club not just multiplied his numbers but must run on of the best (club) youth programs in europe (just lately defeating the italian youth champion in italy).

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Re: German rugby

Postby Wallaby21 » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 08:38

I have been following the issues with German Rugby from the other side of the World at looked at both sides and read many posts, articles and been in contact with one of the players from WRA.
I read with interest some of the posts on this forum; I would like to offer my own opinion.
1. Is Germany really interested in competing on the World stage of Rugby? If the answer is yes they must consider that the sport is professional. Germany had a wonderful chance of making the next World Cup, but now the chance has slipped away.
2. A sponsor of a sport needs to have transparency as to where his sponsorship money is being spent.
3. To have a successful organisation you need to have efficient and professional management structure (I don’t see this)
4. Professional players do this for a job and expect to have an income (WRA provides this) they have an employer, like any job they must work for the interests of the employer.
5. I have read the players statement – they are not looking for money to play for Germany but rather have conditions and a support network and have structure in place. This simply means having a team doctor present at their games, communication with management, structure preparation for games, support staff all of those things and more.
6. If the players were to make themselves available to play for the National team their employer is not obliged to pay their wages in their absence, rather the National body should pay their wages whilst there are not with their employer (not match payments)
7. When the extended squad was announced for the match against Romania I believe there were 2 players from WRA that were not included who were the two co-captains that spoke to the DRV (are they being punished?)
8. Players wanted an assurance of medical cover – I believe this was finally offered
9. Heidelberg RVK are a great chance of winning the Continental Cup – what does that do for German Rugby
10. DR Wild had done so much for German Rugby, he is a Billionaire does he need to get financial grain – I don’t think so. I think he does it for the love of the game. I believe he did not believe the administration was doing a great job (perhaps he wanted to be involved in some way with the profession structure). But it was the most stupid decision to separate from your major sponsor
I really comes down to people working together for the sport (development, growth & success). The players from WRA do want to play for their country but the situation now is impossible.
I hope this mess is sorted out and the public/management/players and fans can look at both sides and come up with a solution and better working relationship – Germany has a future is World Rugby but must consider professionalism. Good Luck
If you can find it on the internet read the WRA players press release it may change your mind about hating them, but rather understanding the principles and the values they stand for.

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Re: German rugby

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 09:50

Wallaby21 wrote:I have been following the issues with German Rugby from the other side of the World at looked at both sides and read many posts, articles and been in contact with one of the players from WRA.
I read with interest some of the posts on this forum; I would like to offer my own opinion.
1. Is Germany really interested in competing on the World stage of Rugby? If the answer is yes they must consider that the sport is professional. Germany had a wonderful chance of making the next World Cup, but now the chance has slipped away.
we finished 4th in the Qualifying ranking after losses against Russia and Spain, the chance was realistically minimal
Wallaby21 wrote:
2. A sponsor of a sport needs to have transparency as to where his sponsorship money is being spent.

The sponsor had 100% transparency where the money the DRV spent went. Every federation and club for that matter needs to have an annual financial report in Germany where exactly is listed where which money went. If I read it as a simple rugby club comitee member, the sponsor could do as well

Wallaby21 wrote:3. To have a successful organisation you need to have efficient and professional management structure (I don’t see this)

Sorry, the WRA did a lot of good things, but lets stay honest here: their communication as a sign of an efficient and professional management structure was always really, really bad. Up until now, when nobody from the rugby public knows what exactly they actually want. Same goes for pulling a different candidate out of the hat in summer to get elected as DRV-president. Not professional at all.

Wallaby21 wrote:4. Professional players do this for a job and expect to have an income (WRA provides this) they have an employer, like any job they must work for the interests of the employer.

True. The problem is the proclaimed interest of the WRA is the growth of German rugby. If you don't allow your employees to play for the national team, how is that in the interest of German rugby?

Wallaby21 wrote:5. I have read the players statement – they are not looking for money to play for Germany but rather have conditions and a support network and have structure in place. This simply means having a team doctor present at their games, communication with management, structure preparation for games, support staff all of those things and more.


I've heard from many different sources, that there was not a single game without a team doctor present. about the rest: I'm too much of an outsider to judge that.

Wallaby21 wrote:6. If the players were to make themselves available to play for the National team their employer is not obliged to pay their wages in their absence, rather the National body should pay their wages whilst there are not with their employer (not match payments)

That's a thing absolutely strange for German sports. But as Mulu stated the post above, they were providing that. If you do so, you do a set fee: But off course a set fee. Not their exact wage. Otherwise it would be extremely stupid - oh you're a doctor. I pay you 1000 Euro, sorry you are just a construction worker, thats 100 Euro for you.

Wallaby21 wrote:7. When the extended squad was announced for the match against Romania I believe there were 2 players from WRA that were not included who were the two co-captains that spoke to the DRV (are they being punished?)

Which two are missing? I mean check in this very forum the page before this one. I can't see any former captains missing...

Wallaby21 wrote:8. Players wanted an assurance of medical cover – I believe this was finally offered

This has to be a really bad misunderstanding of our public health care system, a problem which couldn't even come up, if one had basic knowledge of it. Even if they played for money, the wouldn't be payed as employees, but as "Ehrenamtliche". Your normal health insurance kicks in for that.

Wallaby21 wrote:9. Heidelberg RVK are a great chance of winning the Continental Cup – what does that do for German Rugby

Great. Thumps up and fingers crossed. I watched the semis and will watch the final. But this has nothing to do with the national team debate (apart from their player's losing some maybe important sparring games on a high level in the REC if they are not released for national team duties)

Wallaby21 wrote:10. DR Wild had done so much for German Rugby, he is a Billionaire does he need to get financial grain – I don’t think so. I think he does it for the love of the game. I believe he did not believe the administration was doing a great job (perhaps he wanted to be involved in some way with the profession structure). But it was the most stupid decision to separate from your major sponsor

Absolutely true. But what the hell does he actually want? What exactly is his problem? What exaqctly should change? Silence.

Wallaby21 wrote:I really comes down to people working together for the sport (development, growth & success). The players from WRA do want to play for their country but the situation now is impossible.
I hope this mess is sorted out and the public/management/players and fans can look at both sides and come up with a solution and better working relationship – Germany has a future is World Rugby but must consider professionalism. Good Luck
If you can find it on the internet read the WRA players press release it may change your mind about hating them, but rather understanding the principles and the values they stand for.


I've read it. Multiple times. I can understand that the players fear for their jobs. And this overlaps everything. But it is not the job of a federation to provide a job to any player. That is not how any sport in Germany has ever worked. I'm not saying this couldn't be a model for the future (some really important burocratic hurdles to overcome, though) But, if you want to start a revolution - fair enough. But than campaign for it. Do it the right way. Do it democratic. But not autacratic simply crossing your arms and saying: I won't release my players. I totally feel with the players. They are the weakest link between all of this. But that's not the federation's fault.
Last edited by RugbyLiebe on Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 11:59, edited 2 times in total.
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Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: German rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 10:55

My feeling is people don't judge current German rugby war, but only see it from their own already-set opinions on unions v clubs, State v individual freedom...

To miss most of their key players is a failure for DRV. Not to explain clearly what's wrong with DRV is a huge misjudgement from Wild.
REC 2018 never happened. Please respect my beliefs

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 16:00

I really appreciate you took a moment to discuss here.
By the way, some of the facts are strong.
mulu wrote:Tyumenev - Strasbourg has only 4 front row players left so we made the agreement to get Mika released for game 3,4 and 5
Preocanin/Murphy - are not fulltime rugby players and therefor we mutually decided to have them available for game 3,4,5 as 6 weeks in a row are not doable with work
Cameron-Dow - just had a baby and will be available for game 2,3,4,5

You could have explained this like USA Rugby does for every window.
It doesn't hide the fact a ton of players (Vergnon, Valette, Ducau, Scholz, Bauer, Breglia...) from in the original squad mustn't have included. There is so many absent players that you were forced to call players who weren't in the original squad. DRV only published this squad to make believe Healy and Lemoine could work with an excellent squad and justify their salary.

While you are at it, check the german team which last played in Cluj (and the result of that game: http://www.espn.com.au/rugby/lineups?ga ... gue=239925) and then also please compare the starting lineups of germany v uruguay in frank­furt and uruguay v canada in montevideo, last but not least have a look at germany’s latest results v Belgium, Spain, Georgia and Russia and have a look at the rwc qualification table just to give things a little bit more realistic approach.

What do you mean ? You already lost by 50 against Georgia, so you can lost by 80 to Romania ? Need an explaination...

I don’t even want to start on how the level of play in the first division has decreased in the last 10 years and for what reason. I just can tell you that in 2007 (SC Neuenheim, RG Heidelberg, SC Frankfurt 80, Berliner RC, TSV Handschuhsheim, Heideberger RK, Hannover 78 and even RK Heusenstamm started the league with a realistic chance of making the final or even winning the championship) compare this to 10 years later and make your own assumptions why (amateur-)clubs don’t train 4-5 times a week any more to be competitive but went back to training 1 or 2 times a week and also have reduced their activities around youth rugby. I have an idea why this happened, what’s your educated guess?


Yes, they gave up ! Especially Hannover 78. Instead of standing up and take up the challenge, they badly gave up. Clubs are the only responsible of the decrease of level in Bundesliga. Only TVP rose to the challenge and they won... All remaining clubs expressed their jealousy to see a club able to beat the best Italian teams. They did the same in the 90s when Uli Byszio promoted Frankfurt's senior team.

BTW in my opinion the benefactor of SC Frankfurt 1880 (Uli Byszio) had the most lasting and positive influence on german rugby in the last 10-12 years. He set a benchmark with his semi-pro-players for the traditional clubs and once this clubs caught up he didn’t strip them of their best players but accepted to be beatable to keep the league competitive and concentrate on the youth. Therefor the club not just multiplied his numbers but must run on of the best (club) youth programs in europe (just lately defeating the italian youth champion in italy).


Uli Byszio is wasting money ! You can't only invest at youth level. You need to expose your youth to the best senior level. After Hannover 78, Frankfurt is the main responsible of the decrease of level in Bundesliga. Senior team investment is essential to improve overall level of rugby.
Senior men's rugby is essential to increase global revenue and participating numbers.

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Re: German rugby

Postby CM » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 20:07

olivier wrote:
BTW in my opinion the benefactor of SC Frankfurt 1880 (Uli Byszio) had the most lasting and positive influence on german rugby in the last 10-12 years. He set a benchmark with his semi-pro-players for the traditional clubs and once this clubs caught up he didn’t strip them of their best players but accepted to be beatable to keep the league competitive and concentrate on the youth. Therefor the club not just multiplied his numbers but must run on of the best (club) youth programs in europe (just lately defeating the italian youth champion in italy).


Uli Byszio is wasting money ! You can't only invest at youth level. You need to expose your youth to the best senior level. After Hannover 78, Frankfurt is the main responsible of the decrease of level in Bundesliga. Senior team investment is essential to improve overall level of rugby.
Senior men's rugby is essential to increase global revenue and participating numbers.


I do like myself some senior rugby, but when Uli Byszio started using his money in Frankfurt, there wasn't much junior rugby in Germany, There is still way too few junior rugby. Before we need a professional division we need more well developed players, and not only in Heidelberg. In every normal sports, there are several junior players to one senior player, if you look at the numbers. In German rugby it is the other way around. Lots of people start playing rugby only in their twenties. Youth rugby should be the main focus in the next years in Germany. And it is growing at the moment.

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Re: German rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Fri, 09 Feb 2018, 23:37

WRA Response...I don't read German: http://www.german-rugby.de/

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Re: German rugby

Postby RugbyLiebe » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 07:43

TheStroBro wrote:WRA Response...I don't read German: http://www.german-rugby.de/


The response is basically showing that the WRA seems to have no idea about World Rugby laws.

1. Apparently they've asked the DRV to insure their players as licensed players. Thing is they can't as they are not employed as players but as coaches. If they would be handled as licensed players not releasing them would lead to a ban.

2. The WRA asked Compensation from the DRV. That's a direct breach of World Rugby law 4.5.5.

"
4.5.5          No Union, Rugby Body or Club shall enter in any written agreement and/or arrangement of any kind that provides for and/or in any way facilitates third party influence and/or control over a Player’s playing relationship with his Union, Rugby Body or Club and/or his Registration."

This is not a simple thing. WR will and must stop this. Otherwise international rugby would be in danger. Imagine Bath telling the RFU to only release their players if the RFU gives in to their exact financial demand. That's what actually is happening in Germany atm.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: German rugby

Postby amz » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 09:38

Couldn't agree more RugbyLiebe. Good they finally made a statement, they drowned themselves and DRV has now all the right to act and put an end to this scandal.

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Re: German rugby

Postby CM » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 10:12

Just because their demands are unreasonable, because they are impossible, doesn't mean, that the DRV can do anything against it.

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Re: German rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 15:58

RugbyLiebe wrote:
TheStroBro wrote:WRA Response...I don't read German: http://www.german-rugby.de/


The response is basically showing that the WRA seems to have no idea about World Rugby laws.

1. Apparently they've asked the DRV to insure their players as licensed players. Thing is they can't as they are not employed as players but as coaches. If they would be handled as licensed players not releasing them would lead to a ban.

2. The WRA asked Compensation from the DRV. That's a direct breach of World Rugby law 4.5.5.

"
4.5.5          No Union, Rugby Body or Club shall enter in any written agreement and/or arrangement of any kind that provides for and/or in any way facilitates third party influence and/or control over a Player’s playing relationship with his Union, Rugby Body or Club and/or his Registration."

This is not a simple thing. WR will and must stop this. Otherwise international rugby would be in danger. Imagine Bath telling the RFU to only release their players if the RFU gives in to their exact financial demand. That's what actually is happening in Germany atm.

Uh...the RFU has actually done this. Except through the EQP Fee and the collectively bargained four year deal worth in excess of £250MM. French and British Clubs don't release players from T2 Unions all the time. So that's the dumbest shit I've ever heard.

amz wrote:Couldn't agree more RugbyLiebe. Good they finally made a statement, they drowned themselves and DRV has now all the right to act and put an end to this scandal.


Doubt anything will happen, considering Wild also offered a sponsorship and donation package if valued only at one year was still 3xDHL Sponsorship.

This is just the Classic North V. South Clash. The bigger issues is the Southern clubs are not united.
Last edited by TheStroBro on Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 16:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 16:00

TheStroBro wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:
TheStroBro wrote:WRA Response...I don't read German: http://www.german-rugby.de/


The response is basically showing that the WRA seems to have no idea about World Rugby laws.

1. Apparently they've asked the DRV to insure their players as licensed players. Thing is they can't as they are not employed as players but as coaches. If they would be handled as licensed players not releasing them would lead to a ban.

2. The WRA asked Compensation from the DRV. That's a direct breach of World Rugby law 4.5.5.

"
4.5.5          No Union, Rugby Body or Club shall enter in any written agreement and/or arrangement of any kind that provides for and/or in any way facilitates third party influence and/or control over a Player’s playing relationship with his Union, Rugby Body or Club and/or his Registration."

This is not a simple thing. WR will and must stop this. Otherwise international rugby would be in danger. Imagine Bath telling the RFU to only release their players if the RFU gives in to their exact financial demand. That's what actually is happening in Germany atm.

Uh...the RFU has actually done this. Except through the EQP Fee and the collectively bargained four year deal worth in excess of £250MM. French and British Clubs don't release players from T2 Unions all the time. So that's the dumbest shit I've ever heard.

I tried not to laugh when I also read it. Some Germans seem ignorant of LNR/FRR relations...

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Re: German rugby

Postby germanbullsfan » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 16:32

Some Germans like there amateur status and want an honest sport team rather then a winning and competetive squad

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Re: German rugby

Postby olivier » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 16:35

germanbullsfan wrote:Some Germans like there amateur status and want an honest sport team rather then a winning and competetive squad

Only honest in their mind. This is pure conservatism.

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Re: German rugby

Postby CM » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 16:51

The agreement in England are about training time for the national team. And they are agreements with the clubs. The WRA has no official relation with any club. They just happen to play for one club (and some for two others).

And of course there simply isn't the money.

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Re: German rugby

Postby CM » Sat, 10 Feb 2018, 17:22

This is just the Classic North V. South Clash. The bigger issues is the Southern clubs are not united.


Most of the DRV officials are from the south, the former president and the manager are from the south, so this is more an intra-south, or intra-heidelberg clash.
This isn't surprising, because the heidelberger rk is probably less liked in heidelberg than in the rest of Germany.

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