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2023 Rugby World Cup Host

2023 Rugby World Cup host

South Africa
13
21%
Ireland
14
23%
Italy
31
50%
France
4
6%
 
Total votes : 62
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 08:44

jservuk wrote:As I thought, with Rome cash strapped and not willing to fund the Olympics in 2024, and RWC requiring financial guarantees from FIR (£100m?), who probably would have been looking for government funds for this, any bid would have been to go fund it themselves.

This says a lot about the largess of the Olympics, and sadly, the casts doubt on the claim that RWC is a cheap way of hosting a big event and generating income.

IRB/RWC could have helped Italy by reducing/foregoing the required guarantee. But I guess they're only interested in expansion if it means no lessening of the cash intake.


That's actually the first thing I read about the withdraw of Italy which makes 100% sense. Thanks!

@Olivier this explanation was, what I was asking for. It can't be a scoop, if it is posted by the FIR itself.

So basically once again World Cup showed they have no balls. If they really give it to Ireland they know who has good friends, if they give it to France they prefer big nations to host it more often and if they give it to South Africa they are crazy. Well done to get yourself in a Lose-Lose-situation.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby iul » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 08:47

Is there any way to bring back the US/Canada bid at this time?

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby tryman » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 09:33

I do know but there's still a part of me that doesn't know why people are so hard on Ireland's bid.

Let's clear up this tag of favouritism which is absolute rubbish. World Rugby are based in Ireland because of tax incentives, simple as that. What favours does World Rugby do for Ireland... It's a total myth, someone will say Ireland get off lightly on player citing issues which is rubbish as it's based on an independent panel.

Rugby in Ireland is the 4th sport, the World Cup coming will reach out to new people who will know of rugby but yet are fully engaged in the sport. Ireland isn't used to holding major sporting events so when it's does (aka Ryder Cup or Special Olympics) all the country attends as they see it as a once in a lifetime event. Plus and this is a massive plus Irish people are willing to pay high prices for tickets meaning 2023 WC will be extremely profitable for World Rugby. Also remember how many big blue chip company's are based in Ireland, corporate tickets (where the real money is made) will be flying all around the place.

Ireland still brought the best away support to the 2015 RWC. If any of you remember Ireland V Romania (not what you would call a highly competitive match) sold over 90,000 tickets in Wembley beating the New Zealand V Argentina game the week before which would have had a lot more general interest. Ireland bought huge support to Cardiff and the Olympic Stadium too.

The games will be spread all around the country but generally in higher populated urban areas (I.e Dublin, Cork, Belfast, Limerick) while other games will take place in Tipperary and Mayo.

Ireland is extremely easy for anyone in the UK or the rest of Europe to get to with Ryanair's main hub based at Dublin airport. Additional transport will be put on during the World Cup to cater for all the supporters. In regards accommodation the RWC will not clash with any other event (sporting or not) meaning rooms should be more or less dedicated to the World Cup. Of course as places get busy you will need to get accommodation further out. I was at the quarter finals games in Cardiff at 2015 and couldn't get accommodation near Cardiff and had to stay past Swansea, the same at the Pro12 final this year in Edinburgh as it clashed with other events in the city. You just have to go further out, it's as simple as that. Accommodation was extremely limited in New Zealand too.

The country will take the World Cup to there hearts and it will be evident in much more of a way then England where football is king.

World Rugby make their money by charging a large hosting fee. Ticket sale revenue is kept by the home nation until they break even then the profit is spilt with World Rugby. By the time 2023 comes around this fee will be much higher than it was for England 2015, Ireland has the money and will pay with no issue.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby victorsra » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 14:34

Accomodations is something flexible. Air b&b is wonderful.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby CraigChalmers » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 16:58

tryman wrote:I do know but there's still a part of me that doesn't know why people are so hard on Ireland's bid.

Let's clear up this tag of favouritism which is absolute rubbish. World Rugby are based in Ireland because of tax incentives, simple as that. What favours does World Rugby do for Ireland... It's a total myth, someone will say Ireland get off lightly on player citing issues which is rubbish as it's based on an independent panel.

Rugby in Ireland is the 4th sport, the World Cup coming will reach out to new people who will know of rugby but yet are fully engaged in the sport. Ireland isn't used to holding major sporting events so when it's does (aka Ryder Cup or Special Olympics) all the country attends as they see it as a once in a lifetime event. Plus and this is a massive plus Irish people are willing to pay high prices for tickets meaning 2023 WC will be extremely profitable for World Rugby. Also remember how many big blue chip company's are based in Ireland, corporate tickets (where the real money is made) will be flying all around the place.

Ireland still brought the best away support to the 2015 RWC. If any of you remember Ireland V Romania (not what you would call a highly competitive match) sold over 90,000 tickets in Wembley beating the New Zealand V Argentina game the week before which would have had a lot more general interest. Ireland bought huge support to Cardiff and the Olympic Stadium too.

The games will be spread all around the country but generally in higher populated urban areas (I.e Dublin, Cork, Belfast, Limerick) while other games will take place in Tipperary and Mayo.

Ireland is extremely easy for anyone in the UK or the rest of Europe to get to with Ryanair's main hub based at Dublin airport. Additional transport will be put on during the World Cup to cater for all the supporters. In regards accommodation the RWC will not clash with any other event (sporting or not) meaning rooms should be more or less dedicated to the World Cup. Of course as places get busy you will need to get accommodation further out. I was at the quarter finals games in Cardiff at 2015 and couldn't get accommodation near Cardiff and had to stay past Swansea, the same at the Pro12 final this year in Edinburgh as it clashed with other events in the city. You just have to go further out, it's as simple as that. Accommodation was extremely limited in New Zealand too.

The country will take the World Cup to there hearts and it will be evident in much more of a way then England where football is king.

World Rugby make their money by charging a large hosting fee. Ticket sale revenue is kept by the home nation until they break even then the profit is spilt with World Rugby. By the time 2023 comes around this fee will be much higher than it was for England 2015, Ireland has the money and will pay with no issue.


Think you are making far more of Irelands support last year than you should. Ireland v Romania got 200 people more than New Zealand v Argentina - which is nothing! Truth is, they sold out Wembley because they got the chance to play there - any of England, Wales, France, Australia or South Africa would probably do the same given the chance. Irelands unwavering support also saw 6,000 empty seats for their opening game in Cardiff…

Oh, and yes they might have taken 40,000 to Cardiff for the quarter final, but given the distances (and the average wage in each country) involved, the 25,000 Argentina had there is infinitely more impressive!


As for accommodation, it's all very well saying stay further away and it works for say a Pro12 Final; but staying in Dublin for a game in Belfast (I know people who had to do this for the Pro12 Final) won't work if Dublin is hosting 3+ RWC matches itself that weekend…

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby dropkick » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 17:56

CraigChalmers wrote:
tryman wrote:I do know but there's still a part of me that doesn't know why people are so hard on Ireland's bid.

Let's clear up this tag of favouritism which is absolute rubbish. World Rugby are based in Ireland because of tax incentives, simple as that. What favours does World Rugby do for Ireland... It's a total myth, someone will say Ireland get off lightly on player citing issues which is rubbish as it's based on an independent panel.

Rugby in Ireland is the 4th sport, the World Cup coming will reach out to new people who will know of rugby but yet are fully engaged in the sport. Ireland isn't used to holding major sporting events so when it's does (aka Ryder Cup or Special Olympics) all the country attends as they see it as a once in a lifetime event. Plus and this is a massive plus Irish people are willing to pay high prices for tickets meaning 2023 WC will be extremely profitable for World Rugby. Also remember how many big blue chip company's are based in Ireland, corporate tickets (where the real money is made) will be flying all around the place.

Ireland still brought the best away support to the 2015 RWC. If any of you remember Ireland V Romania (not what you would call a highly competitive match) sold over 90,000 tickets in Wembley beating the New Zealand V Argentina game the week before which would have had a lot more general interest. Ireland bought huge support to Cardiff and the Olympic Stadium too.

The games will be spread all around the country but generally in higher populated urban areas (I.e Dublin, Cork, Belfast, Limerick) while other games will take place in Tipperary and Mayo.

Ireland is extremely easy for anyone in the UK or the rest of Europe to get to with Ryanair's main hub based at Dublin airport. Additional transport will be put on during the World Cup to cater for all the supporters. In regards accommodation the RWC will not clash with any other event (sporting or not) meaning rooms should be more or less dedicated to the World Cup. Of course as places get busy you will need to get accommodation further out. I was at the quarter finals games in Cardiff at 2015 and couldn't get accommodation near Cardiff and had to stay past Swansea, the same at the Pro12 final this year in Edinburgh as it clashed with other events in the city. You just have to go further out, it's as simple as that. Accommodation was extremely limited in New Zealand too.

The country will take the World Cup to there hearts and it will be evident in much more of a way then England where football is king.

World Rugby make their money by charging a large hosting fee. Ticket sale revenue is kept by the home nation until they break even then the profit is spilt with World Rugby. By the time 2023 comes around this fee will be much higher than it was for England 2015, Ireland has the money and will pay with no issue.


Think you are making far more of Irelands support last year than you should. Ireland v Romania got 200 people more than New Zealand v Argentina - which is nothing! Truth is, they sold out Wembley because they got the chance to play there - any of England, Wales, France, Australia or South Africa would probably do the same given the chance. Irelands unwavering support also saw 6,000 empty seats for their opening game in Cardiff…

Oh, and yes they might have taken 40,000 to Cardiff for the quarter final, but given the distances (and the average wage in each country) involved, the 25,000 Argentina had there is infinitely more impressive!


As for accommodation, it's all very well saying stay further away and it works for say a Pro12 Final; but staying in Dublin for a game in Belfast (I know people who had to do this for the Pro12 Final) won't work if Dublin is hosting 3+ RWC matches itself that weekend…



Cardiff hotels cost average of €1,400 for RWC quarters
Ireland rugby fans facing huge hotel bills in Cardiff for France match and potential
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/i ... -1.2347141

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby victorsra » Fri, 30 Sep 2016, 18:58

http://www.rugbyfun.com.ar/2016/09/nos- ... -de-subir/

Pichot explained why Argentina is not in the 2023 race. He said that the Argentina's elections made it impossible to reach an agreement with the government and the elections and the 2023 bid deadlines were really close. Well, makes sense.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby NaBUru38 » Sat, 01 Oct 2016, 14:45

ihateblazers wrote:Here are my guesses for the way voting would go down.

17 votes for France
15 votes for South Africa
6 votes for Ireland


I can't see Ireland winning the bid, as France will get nearly every vote in Europe and South Africa in the rest of the world.

I think that New Zealand, England and North America are the swing votes.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby victorsra » Sat, 01 Oct 2016, 19:08

Question: is it possible to have a couple of matches in Italy in the French bid? Or even Spain? Would it shift the argument that France has just received a tournament to the idea that it is promoting new markets?

Using 12 stadiums, beiing 7 of the 10 Euro-16 stadiums (Paris Stade France ,Lyon, Lille, Marseille, Nice, Toulouse and Bordeaux) + Paris future Grand Stade + Rome + Milan + Barcelona + San Sebastián or Bruxelles or Padova or some new French market like Nantes or Strasbourg would be good and balanced.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby NaBUru38 » Sun, 02 Oct 2016, 22:01

victorsra wrote:Question: is it possible to have a couple of matches in Italy in the French bid?

Or even Spain?


Certainly so - if they qualify.

victorsra wrote:Would it shift the argument that France has just received a tournament to the idea that it is promoting new markets?


No. France will get most European votes, but none from other tier 2-3 regions.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby victorsra » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 02:37

That's not what I mean. I was suggesting that th French bid could incorporate a couple of Italian venues. But I don't know if World Rugby's rules for the bids would allow it.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby tryman » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 06:13

NaBUru38 wrote:
ihateblazers wrote:Here are my guesses for the way voting would go down.

17 votes for France
15 votes for South Africa
6 votes for Ireland


I can't see Ireland winning the bid, as France will get nearly every vote in Europe and South Africa in the rest of the world.

I think that New Zealand, England and North America are the swing votes.


I'm not sure why people don't think other country's will not vote for Ireland

The Irish bidding team believe they've already 40% of the vote. England would certainly vote for Ireland.

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-confident-r ... 2-May2015/

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby ihateblazers » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 07:51

If the bidders are exempt then that means 14 votes (at the time of writing, would increase with Italy now withdrawn). If all members are eligible to vote then that means approximately 18 votes.

See that stat doesn't really fly with me. The T2 sub regions are all influenced by their T1 partners, except perhaps Europe which has sizeable T2 partners. I can't see so many voting for Ireland instead, no one apart from North America has anything to gain by voting for Ireland. I guess Europe, Romania/Georgia could be voting for Ireland now, i couldn't see them when Italy were in the running, i don't see how it would be in their interest. Perhaps with Italy's withdrawal we might see some shuffling in the decks.

The numbers just don't add up for me.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby paratus » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 09:42

tryman wrote:I'm not sure why people don't think other country's will not vote for Ireland

The Irish bidding team believe they've already 40% of the vote. England would certainly vote for Ireland.

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-confident-r ... 2-May2015/



Yes you would certainly think so with Northern Island being a constituent part of the bid

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby suofficer » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 10:10

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-confident-r ... 2-May2015/[/quote]


this link is over a year old.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby CraigChalmers » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 19:38

tryman wrote:
NaBUru38 wrote:
ihateblazers wrote:Here are my guesses for the way voting would go down.

17 votes for France
15 votes for South Africa
6 votes for Ireland


I can't see Ireland winning the bid, as France will get nearly every vote in Europe and South Africa in the rest of the world.

I think that New Zealand, England and North America are the swing votes.


I'm not sure why people don't think other country's will not vote for Ireland

The Irish bidding team believe they've already 40% of the vote. England would certainly vote for Ireland.

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-confident-r ... 2-May2015/


They said that before we even knew who was bidding. Which is almost enough to make you think the process might be corrupt…

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby tryman » Mon, 03 Oct 2016, 20:33

CraigChalmers wrote:
tryman wrote:
NaBUru38 wrote:
ihateblazers wrote:Here are my guesses for the way voting would go down.

17 votes for France
15 votes for South Africa
6 votes for Ireland


I can't see Ireland winning the bid, as France will get nearly every vote in Europe and South Africa in the rest of the world.

I think that New Zealand, England and North America are the swing votes.


I'm not sure why people don't think other country's will not vote for Ireland

The Irish bidding team believe they've already 40% of the vote. England would certainly vote for Ireland.

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-confident-r ... 2-May2015/


They said that before we even knew who was bidding. Which is almost enough to make you think the process might be corrupt…


Sounds like you've a chip on your shoulder about Ireland in general. Their putting in a fair bid and have the money to pay World Rugby the holding fee, I don't think their doing anything wrong at all.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby tryman » Tue, 15 Nov 2016, 19:56

Ireland launched their World Cup campaign today with a great video clip featuring Liam Neeson the famous actor (for anyone who doesn't know him!). The Prime Minster of Ireland and deputy of the North of Ireland were present.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/37988826

Ireland really mean business with this bid and honestly I can't see how they won't win it... people underestimate how good at politics this small nation is.

They announced 12 grounds initally around the island that could hold games but this maybe cut to 8 or 10. Like nearly 100% on here I hope the 2023 RWC has 24 teams so I kind of hope the 12 grounds stay as its spread quite well around the Ireland.

Sorry I sound like a cheerleader for the Ireland bid but I really think it would make a fantastic World Cup and World Rugby would make massive money from all the blue chip companies in the country. Their people are major event junkies so tickets would sell easily, while Europes biggest airline are based in Dublin so getting in won't be a problem.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby armchair_expert » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 08:12

maybe stupid question but why the Windsor Park in Belfast wasn't even considered in the IRFU bid? it was redeveloped just recently, it has twice more seats than Ravenhill/Kingspan, it's a much better revenue generator than most of their GAA sheds, and I don't think Linfield FC will ask too much for a potential agrement

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby tryman » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 08:20

armchair_expert wrote:maybe stupid question but why the Windsor Park in Belfast wasn't even considered in the IRFU bid? it was redeveloped just recently, it has twice more seats than Ravenhill/Kingspan, it's a much better revenue generator than most of their GAA sheds, and I don't think Linfield FC will ask too much for a potential agrement


The redeveloped Windsor park holds 18,000 the same as Ravenhill which the IRFU/Ulster own. Casement Park also in Belfasy will hold over 30,000,

Unfair to call GAA grounds sheds, if so you could say the same about all New Zealand's stadiums.

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby victorsra » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 13:41

It really looks like de 2011 WC, although the total capacity looks bigger. Just 2 stadiums have more than 50k places. The rest has 30-35k or less, according to their website's information about the new developments of the GAA stadia.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby RugbyLiebe » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 14:20

victorsra wrote:It really looks like de 2011 WC, although the total capacity looks bigger. Just 2 stadiums have more than 50k places. The rest has 30-35k or less, according to their website's information about the new developments of the GAA stadia.


My concern is mainly hotel rooms. There will be way more people within reach and able to just fly over for a day or two if it is in Ireland.
So France for me as long as this concerns are not "tackled" properly.
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby Canalina » Thu, 05 Jan 2017, 06:10

Probably I'm the last man on Earth to have discovered it, but just now I noticed that the 2023 World Cup will be played in the 200th anniversary of the 1823's "birth of rugby" (I hope Flidta Risxva doesn't read these lines, he is not a big fan of the Ellis myth : ) ).
So, as well as the Olympics went to Athens in 2000, I think that it would have been nice if England hosted the cup, or it would be nice if Ireland won the bid and they borrowed at least one match to the city of Rugby.
Maybe other forumers already wrote the same thing but the thread is too long to check it, sorry
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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby thatrugbyguy » Thu, 05 Jan 2017, 07:23

Isn't the main issue that it's a little hard to prove that's the date rugby's birth?

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Re: 2023 Rugby World Cup Host

Postby 4N » Fri, 22 Sep 2017, 02:06

Ireland I think will secure the votes needed.

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