Tier 2 & 3 Rugby Forum

Spanish rugby

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 16 Oct 2018, 16:50

Second training camp of the season for Leones. A big number of Spanish-born players that were playing in Fédérale 1 and had been forgotten for the few past seasons are returning. Pleasant surprise, although it makes me wonder if there is a real planning followed after how many foreign-born players from Liga Heineken were called in September... :roll:

- Nacho Contardi (Aldro Independiente)
- Manu Mora (Aldro Independiente)
- Ien Ashcroft-Leigh (UBU-Colina Clinic)
- Emiliano Calle (UBU-Colina Clinic)
- Matt Foulds (SilverStorm El Salvador)
- Víctor Sánchez (SilverStorm El Salvador)
- Michael Walker-Fitton (SilverStorm El Salvador)
- Leandro Wozniak (SilverStorm El Salvador)
- Alberto Blanco (VRAC Quesos Entrepinares)
- Fede Casteglioni (VRAC Quesos Entrepinares)
- Alvar Gimeno (VRAC Quesos Entrepinares)
- Afa Tauli (UE Santboiana)
- Koi Hogg (Barça Rugbi)
- Facundo Munilla (Sanitas Alcobendas)
- Lucas Guillaume (Sanitas Alcobendas)
- Guillermo Domínguez (Complutense Cisneros)
- Richard Steward (Complutense Cisneros)
- Fernando López (Ampo Ordizia)
- Julen Goia (Ampo Ordizia)
- Sergi Aubanell (ASVEL)
- Gerard Aubanell (ASVEL)
- Gauthier Minguillon (Valence)
- Andréa Rabago (Dijon)
- Hugo Alonso (Rodez)
- Bittor Aboitiz (Rodez)
- Lucas Levy (CO Berre)
- Tomás Munilla (Béziers)
- Ángel Durango (Saint-Médard)
- Yannick Pardo (Céret)
- Toby Francis (Leeds Beckett)
- Joshua Peters (Blackheath)

Notable mention, the astonishing amount of players formed in two particular hotbeds for Spanish rugby without representation in Liga Heineken: Valencia (Gimeno, Domínguez, Del Hoyo, Pardo) and Marbella (Munilla Bros, Francis, Peters, Hogg).

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby qwerty » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 01:39

Maybe about a third are Spanish-born, aren't they?

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Thomas » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 06:41

Isn't places like Valencia a strong base for Rugby League?? I know they have strong teams there. The recent win by Catalans have boosted the ranks.

Also the Spanish play Serbia this weekend in Belgrade. If they win step closer for their World Cup. I am just saying Union doesn't dominate everywhere in Spain.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby RugbyLiebe » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 07:21

Thomas wrote:Isn't places like Valencia a strong base for Rugby League?? I know they have strong teams there. The recent win by Catalans have boosted the ranks.
Also the Spanish play Serbia this weekend in Belgrade. If they win step closer for their World Cup. I am just saying Union doesn't dominate everywhere in Spain.


Please define "strong base". Rugby also doesn't dominate anywhere in Spain, soccer dominates. So on what do you actually base your opinion that league might be more than an absolut niche product anywhere in Spain? We are talking about a sport whose Spanish wikipedia entry doesn't even mention that the sport is actually played in Spain. The Catalan Dragons, a french pro-team?
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Thomas » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 08:06

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Thomas wrote:Isn't places like Valencia a strong base for Rugby League?? I know they have strong teams there. The recent win by Catalans have boosted the ranks.
Also the Spanish play Serbia this weekend in Belgrade. If they win step closer for their World Cup. I am just saying Union doesn't dominate everywhere in Spain.


Please define "strong base". Rugby also doesn't dominate anywhere in Spain, soccer dominates. So on what do you actually base your opinion that league might be more than an absolut niche product anywhere in Spain? We are talking about a sport whose Spanish wikipedia entry doesn't even mention that the sport is actually played in Spain. The Catalan Dragons, a french pro-team?


I know Football is the religion in Spain.. The 2 top teams in Rugby League Spain are Warriors and Tigres. Yes I do mean the Catalan Dragons but they are trying to develop the sport not just in their region but across the border. having said that in a roundabout way League has had an influence like it or not. Maybe is time to acknowledge that crossover development is beneficial for both codes?? the fact that Valencia region has 4 players joining the National Team in my opinion it has more to do with both codes in the city rather than Union's development.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 08:42

qwerty wrote:Maybe about a third are Spanish-born, aren't they?

A third of them is Spanish-born and half of them have been living Spain since kids.

Thomas wrote:Isn't places like Valencia a strong base for Rugby League?? I know they have strong teams there. The recent win by Catalans have boosted the ranks.

Also the Spanish play Serbia this weekend in Belgrade. If they win step closer for their World Cup. I am just saying Union doesn't dominate everywhere in Spain.


Thomas, I follow rugby league and I watched the game against Russia. But rugby league is just annexed to union in Valencia. Many of their players are union whose teams couldn't register due to high fees, not enough players, fights with federations, a desire to play international games... Union has over 4,000 players in Comunitat Valenciana and over 30 men senior teams.

So we could say Valencia is important to rugby league but rugby league isn't that important in Valencia.

Regarding Catalan Dragons, their hype is only politically based, I can't see league developing below the Pyrenees just because of their Challenge Cup success.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Thomas » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 09:02

Fair enough, I follow League as well and have been curious about the Spanish influence. I do work with teams from time to time particularly in Preseason.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Wed, 17 Oct 2018, 09:31

My hats off for them, here everything is rugby, there isn't a real battle between codes. Clubs just switch depending on how easy it is for them to enter. In Andalucía it's pretty easy to see teams jumping from union to league back and forth. And don't forget underage rugby league is almost non existent, so it makes sense for some of them to enter young teams in union even if senior only compete in league.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 20 Oct 2018, 14:11

Two interesting games this afternoon, both for relegation and top spots

Liga Heineken - Week 5 - Live Streaming
Saturday 16:30 CEST - Barça Rugbi v Sanitas Alcobendas
http://api.gooru.live/v2.0/public/library/467665.html

Saturday 16:30 CEST - Complutense Cisneros v Bizkaia Gernika
http://api.gooru.live/v2.0/public/library/468190.html

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 20 Oct 2018, 16:36

Great news since we keep seeing very close games whatever teams face each other.

--

Jean-Michel Aguirre keep acting as FER ambassador in front of French clubs and was spotted this weekend in Agen negotiating the release of Xerom Civil and Lucas Rubio (uncapped):
https://www.ladepeche.fr/article/2018/1 ... rugby.html

I understand Rubio would replace one of Rouet bros as Sébastien wouldn't reach 2023 RWC, but I wonder whether he could play as 10 which is our weakest spot right now by far. As 9, we've got quite a few formed in Spain that will be able to play test level.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 21 Oct 2018, 08:44

Liga Heineken - Week 5 - Live Streaming
Sunday 12:00 CEST - La Vila v Santboiana


Sunday 12:30 - SilverStorm El Salvador v Aldro Independiente
First half


Second half


Sunday 12:30 - UBU-Colina Clinic v Ampo Ordizia


Sunday 12:30 - Hernani v VRAC Quesos Entrepinares
Last edited by Armchair Fan on Mon, 22 Oct 2018, 20:28, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 22 Oct 2018, 12:35

Liga Heineken - Week 5 - Results and standings
SilverStorm El Salvador 43 - 24 Aldro Independiente (leader really outclassed the team from Santander, who only recovered in the last quarter)
Barça Rugbi 26 - 29 Sanitas Alcobendas (Barça had an easy kick to draw but their fly-half decided to send it into touch and failed)
UBU-Colina Clinic 30 - 47 Ampo Ordizia (too much for the newly-promoted team)
Hernani 20 - 22 VRAC Quesos Entrepinares (only a kick in injury time saved current champions from another defeat)
La Vila 17 - 15 UE Santboiana (La Vila came back in spite of a red card and Sant Boi missed a late kick)
Complutense Cisneros 32 - 39 Bizkaia Gernika (Cisneros looks awful if unable to secure these home wins)

Image

Impressive stat by @paulusmoreira: 16 out of 30 games so far have been decided by less than 7 points. More than what we had seen for the past five seasons. And next week we should see more of the same since only one of the six matches looks unbalanced on paper...

It's the first time in five years too that no team has won its first five games and all of them have won at least one.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 03:14

Interesting, do you think something is happening that’s making the league more even?

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 08:26

Hard to give a single answer. A little more money and improved scouting, the fact that the newly-promoted team is as competitive as anybody (UBU-Colina Clinic), the champion lacking two key positions that they are still trying to fulfill (3 and 10), historic teams not changing their philosophy and quietly fading away (Cisneros and Santboiana)...

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 19:12

Spain lose two homegrown talents to Tier 1 nations in one week

http://tier2rugby.blogspot.com/2018/10/ ... ts-to.html

Also has a full chart of 19 Spanish players born after 1998 who are in Top 14 or ProD2 academies and they appear to all be from Spain (rather than qualified through heritage). If they end up playing for Spain then you could have a good influx of young talent to make it to the next World Cup.

Despite the setbacks from the recent RWC fiasco, I see Spain having a bright future. With a decent club culture and the benefit of having established clubs just a train ride away in France, you could start churning out some decent players.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 19:41

Not all of them are Spanish-born, some are French or Argentinian even if grown up here. But yes, it speaks volumes of how coaching has improved in the country. There are a few more in England (Diego Periel at Bath, capped in 7s even though born in 2001; Victor Gavin, Andy Petros and Mario Pichardie at Wasps Academy) plus some a bit older spending some time in New Zealand.

As always, it's great but not an insurance of future performance neither. Man, it's not even an insurance they will wear a red shirt in the future.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Wed, 24 Oct 2018, 02:20

Armchair Fan wrote:As always, it's great but not an insurance of future performance neither. Man, it's not even an insurance they will wear a red shirt in the future.


Yeah not a guarantee for either but they've got a better chance with them in those academies, it's certainly more than we've had here in the US. Hopefully at least a few of them player for Spain.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Charvis » Wed, 24 Oct 2018, 08:23

I am also very optimistic about our future. We have more kids playing every year, more of them playing in France and England, good consistent results in all our national teams, more top clubs signing promising youngsters, more and better coaching, more new clubs etc...
I find it hard to understand why so many fellow countrymen are pessimistic. We will keep on growing despite not being in the WCup.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Wed, 24 Oct 2018, 10:51

I don't think it is as much pessimism as bittersweet taste because they/we still don't see the results of that growth, at least at the level we selfishly put ourselves. You've seen like me idiotic comparisons with Argentina or Italy pretty much everywhere and until we reach their level, if we ever reach it, there will be that kind of pessimism which will only be bigger in the next following years as we didn't qualify for RWC and I fear we won't qualify for the Olympics either, whether it's women or men. Just because we are successful in other team sports we tend to put ourselves goals that may not be that realistic. And being beaten by Portugal at U20 (even though I think it's pretty normal if we compare preparation from both teams) or losing players to France and Argentina just add to that bitterness.

The truth is there still is a lack of money. Even though FER budget will be close to 5 M€, it's still not enough compared to the number of players and the amount of programs (XV & 7s, men & women) we try to push forward. And clubs are still underfunded compared to other teams from top T2 sphere.

My main fear is unions relaxing because of the high participation numbers in underage rugby. We begin to see some struggle signs there, losing players at U18, with U8 or U10 stagnating... Maybe it's just a lack of coaches and pitches, but if I were in FER or a regional union I would be slightly worried. The fact there are lots of teams (>100 at U18, >125 at U16, >115 at U14) shouldn't be an excuse for complacency.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Fri, 26 Oct 2018, 22:41

Men's version of the new shirt. With and without sponsorship
Image
Image
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I hope we don't dare to go to Bucharest with the alternate kit... :D

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 28 Oct 2018, 10:53

Liga Heineken - Week 6 - Live Streaming
12:00 - Aldro Independiente v Barça Rugbi


12:00 - Sanitas Alcobendas v Complutense Cisneros


12:00 - UE Santboiana v Hernani


12:00 - Bizkaia Gernika v La Vila


12:30 - VRAC Quesos Entrepinares v UBU-Colina Clinic


12:30 - Ampo Ordizia v SilverStorm El Salvador
Last edited by Armchair Fan on Mon, 29 Oct 2018, 12:57, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Bogdan_DC » Mon, 29 Oct 2018, 07:14

Armchair Fan wrote:Men's version of the new shirt. With and without sponsorship
Image
Image
Image

I hope we don't dare to go to Bucharest with the alternate kit... :D

From where is that blue in Spain kit? It is a fashion thing or it is a more subtle explanation?

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby amz » Mon, 29 Oct 2018, 08:19

Yeah it's kind of annoying.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 29 Oct 2018, 09:16

I don't have an answer, but I must say it's the same in football or other team sports (not all of them though).

Shorts have almost always been dark blue (some give it a royal explanation, it's House of Bourbon colour) and after the Civil War national team even wore full blue because red was linked to the defeated republican side.

I imagine that from a fashion POV once you've got one colour in pants designers tend to get creative and use it for collars and stripes. At least it's not green like two or three years ago in Sevens...

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 29 Oct 2018, 15:58

Liga Heineken - Week 6 - Results and Standings
Ampo Ordizia 13 - 13 SilverStorm El Salvador (El Salvador gives up the lead but qualified for Cup semifinals, TMO was used for the first time in the league)
Sanitas Alcobendas 25 - 7 Complutense Cisneros (boring one-sided game, Alcobendas takes the lead and Lucas Guillaume made his debut with a try)
Aldro Independiente 24 - 32 Barça Rugbi (Independiente only could make 3 subs because they haven't got enough Spanish players to comply with rules...)
VRAC Quesos Entrepinares 64 - 22 UBU-Colina Clinic (first spanking of the season for the newly-promoted team, VRAC keep recovering)
UE Santboiana 27 - 14 Hernani
Bizkaia Gernika 18 - 13 La Vila (Gernika escapes relegation spot for the first time since season started)

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