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Spanish rugby

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 17:21

Florentino Pérez is even reluctant to a women's football team, so he hardly would accept to open other sports sections. Real Madrid has always been less open-minded than other multisport clubs in our country. The only reason why basketball team still exists is because they found the right coach at the right time, seven years ago there were big calls from press and fans asking to dismantle it completely.

Regarding Basque Country and Catalonia, who knows. The nationalist parties would do anything to push for their agenda (like any other political party in any other country, region or city, to be honest), but right now Catalan establishment seems more focused on making the most out of Dragons Catalans XIII success than on using rugby union. In the end the big battlefield will always be football, this week we saw Basque Football Federation holding a vote to ask for their admission in FIFA and UEFA.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Ainsthrilln » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 18:20

Armchair Fan wrote:Florentino Pérez is even reluctant to a women's football team, so he hardly would accept to open other sports sections. Real Madrid has always been less open-minded than other multisport clubs in our country. The only reason why basketball team still exists is because they found the right coach at the right time, seven years ago there were big calls from press and fans asking to dismantle it completely.

Regarding Basque Country and Catalonia, who knows. The nationalist parties would do anything to push for their agenda (like any other political party in any other country, region or city, to be honest), but right now Catalan establishment seems more focused on making the most out of Dragons Catalans XIII success than on using rugby union. In the end the big battlefield will always be football, this week we saw Basque Football Federation holding a vote to ask for their admission in FIFA and UEFA.


Florentino Pérez will not be president of Real Madrid forever. I remember that Ramón Calderon entertained the idea of having a rugby team, and there were negotiations with CRC, which at the time was the most successful team in Madrid.

And about basketball, a part of the football journalists have always deprecated basketball, and every time the team has bad results they press the club to get rid of it (much alike the British rugby press talks about expelling Italy from the 6 Nations after every trashing), but I think that it has never had much support among the fans. It was way worse when Real Madrid finished on tenth position on Liga ACB 2002/2003, and the answer to bad results has always been putting more money on the table, not winding up the team.

However, I do not expect to see a Real Madrid rugby team anytime soon. And the other relevant multi-sport team is Barcelona, which treats rugby as an amateur sport. Maybe they would be interested if Top 14 handed them an invitation, but I don't see them paying for the right play in Pro 14, and their budget is already quite constrained (salaries were 86% of the budget, against UEFA's recommendation of 70%).

As per Catalan Dragons XIII. Do you have information about any actual support? Checking their sponsors I don't see any Spanish public authority, nor any Spanish company that could be influenced by them.

Finally, the Basque football federation is only playing to the crowd. They know Spanish federation will never authorise it, and they have zero chance of winning an appeal against that decision at sport or regular courts. In fact, Basques always had lots of power in the Spanish Football Federation, including the president from 1988 to 2017 and half the coaches of the national teams at every category. The Basque federation is most probably asking for it just to please the Basque politicians, but without any actual hope to get it.

In any case, I wouldn't mind to grant them the wish of an official Basque national team as long as the Basque teams were expelled from LaLiga and any other Spanish competition. If they want their own National Team, they should have their own competitions.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 18:32

Mark my words. Florentino Pérez will die in office. He changed the rules to launch a presidential campaign restricting them so much only him and a couple of other guys could afford to become Real Madrid presidents.

Regarding rugby league, let me remember Esport 3 broadcast live last Challenge Cup final.

It seems we talk a lot of off topic, but in the end things happening around Spanish sport are key to understand why things that look straightforward about Spanish rugby future from the outside are not that easy to implement.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Ainsthrilln » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 18:49

Armchair Fan wrote:Mark my words. Florentino Pérez will die in office. He changed the rules to launch a presidential campaign restricting them so much only him and a couple of other guys could afford to become Real Madrid presidents.

Regarding rugby league, let me remember Esport 3 broadcast live last Challenge Cup final.

It seems we talk a lot of off topic, but in the end things happening around Spanish sport are key to understand why things that look straightforward about Spanish rugby future from the outside are not that easy to implement.


I know about the restrictions set up on the by-laws. The elected Board of Directors have to provide a pledge over their own wealth for hundreds of millions to ensure that any mishandling of funds is restored to the club, so only really rich people can become members of the Board.

But Florentino is 71, unfortunately his last day might not be so far away.

And of course, there is a lot of off-topic, but Spain is a complicated country, and sport is very intertwined with politics, so a sensible project like having a Pro14 team in Bilbao or San Sebastián cannot be evaluated without talking about politics.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 22:22

I’d love having a team there but would it just cause a greater divide? As you said it wouldn’t work if any non-Basque Spanish were involved so wouldn’t that just irk the rest of the country who’d love the chance to get involved?

Obviously I’m not Spanish so I’m curious to know from an actual Spaniard.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 22:31

An opinion from a single Spaniard wouldn't be enough, trust me :D

If it was up to me I wouldn't set up a professional franchise in the Basque Country for multiple reasons. Ainsthrilln already mentioned that you could hardly replace Aviron Bayonnais and Biarritz Olympique as main examples of Basque rugby and leechers of all the talent from the region, even those born south of the Pyrénées. And then, Basque rugby used to be a powerhouse but has been stagnant for last few years with demographics not helping.

If you take into account that, it's enough to dismiss the idea without even needing to talk politics or competition from other sports. So I'm not against the idea of a Basque team, I'd be supportive of it, but I can't see it working.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby 4N » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 22:55

The Spanish Basque Country has many more people than the French side and uses the Basque language (and Spanish). That alone would engage lots more fans than Bayonne (who use little Basque symbolism) or Biarritz. Plus those two clubs have fallen off quite a bit and are both second division now.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 23:06

We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. That's why I'm skeptical.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby 4N » Sat, 15 Dec 2018, 23:42

Two million is a pretty good catchment area by Pro 14 standards. Connacht has only 500,000 people. A provincial Basque side would attract good support in lieu of any “national” sides I think. And there are three Basque clubs in the Spanish top division (four last year) - clearly lots of tradition there.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Rugga » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 09:24

Armchair Fan wrote:We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. That's why I'm skeptical.


What do you believe is the best way forward for Spainish rugby?

Should they go regional like the pro14? or should they go like the top14 and the premiership with clubs?

In my humble opinion you have to a few requirements to do it the premiership or pro14 way with clubs.

1. You have got to have loads of players. France and England both have over 300,000 players. This is why Australia can’t do it. Spain don’t have this yet.

2. You have to have a big population in general to support and attend. This is why places like New Zealand can’t do it. Spain has this.

3. You have to be a rich country with lots of money in it. This is why South Africa can’t do it. Spain has this.

In my opinion Spain should start embracing regional rugby teams immediately. To grow the game then some time maybe 50 years down the line you’ll be able for a professional club competition. Not yet though.

See Spain has the advantages over Scotland and Wales that Ireland had they have regions like Catalonia and Munster which can be used as teams instead of to towns in south Wales that are rivals playing with each other.

You should start with creating rivalry’s, identities and support for these kind of games ( I know that there is already loads of this but stay with me). Maybe at the end of your club season have inter regional matches like Ireland had before with Leinster vs Munster vs Ulster etc. Spain could have Basque Country vs Catalonia vs Madrid or have a state of origin thing like in Australia.

Eventually either develop this into having pro regional teams playing in the pro 14 or have your own mitre 10 cup type thing or both.

Eventually after having this for decades and hopefully the status of rugby has grown over time and Spain has way more people playing rugby like 100,000 plus then you can think of having a league like the top14 or premiership.


Questions? Thoughts? Concerns?

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 09:51

Let me answer in a proper way later ;)

--

Liga Heineken - Week 12 - Live Streaming
12:00 - UE Santboiana v Ampo Ordizia


12:00 - Bizkaia Gernika v Aldro Independiente


12:00 - La Vila v Complutense Cisneros


12:30 - Hernani v Barça Rugbi


12:30 - VRAC Quesos Entrepinares v SilverStorm El Salvador


12:30 - Sanitas Alcobendas v UBU-Colina Clinic
Last edited by Armchair Fan on Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 23:38, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby iul » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 10:00

Rugga wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. That's why I'm skeptical.


What do you believe is the best way forward for Spainish rugby?

Should they go regional like the pro14? or should they go like the top14 and the premiership with clubs?

In my humble opinion you have to a few requirements to do it the premiership or pro14 way with clubs.

1. You have got to have loads of players. France and England both have over 300,000 players. This is why Australia can’t do it. Spain don’t have this yet.

2. You have to have a big population in general to support and attend. This is why places like New Zealand can’t do it. Spain has this.

3. You have to be a rich country with lots of money in it. This is why South Africa can’t do it. Spain has this.

In my opinion Spain should start embracing regional rugby teams immediately. To grow the game then some time maybe 50 years down the line you’ll be able for a professional club competition. Not yet though.

See Spain has the advantages over Scotland and Wales that Ireland had they have regions like Catalonia and Munster which can be used as teams instead of to towns in south Wales that are rivals playing with each other.

You should start with creating rivalry’s, identities and support for these kind of games ( I know that there is already loads of this but stay with me). Maybe at the end of your club season have inter regional matches like Ireland had before with Leinster vs Munster vs Ulster etc. Spain could have Basque Country vs Catalonia vs Madrid or have a state of origin thing like in Australia.

Eventually either develop this into having pro regional teams playing in the pro 14 or have your own mitre 10 cup type thing or both.

Eventually after having this for decades and hopefully the status of rugby has grown over time and Spain has way more people playing rugby like 100,000 plus then you can think of having a league like the top14 or premiership.


Questions? Thoughts? Concerns?

NZ, Aus and SA can't do it because they have chosen the wrong path. They've destroyed their local competitions to build SR, a super complicated, convoluted competition, with a lot of travel, a lot of games between teams with no natural rivalry and a lot of games at unwatchable times.
Spain should stay away from the regional teams IMO. Just focus on professionalizing clubs.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Ainsthrilln » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 11:09

Rugga wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. That's why I'm skeptical.


What do you believe is the best way forward for Spainish rugby?

Should they go regional like the pro14? or should they go like the top14 and the premiership with clubs?

In my humble opinion you have to a few requirements to do it the premiership or pro14 way with clubs.

1. You have got to have loads of players. France and England both have over 300,000 players. This is why Australia can’t do it. Spain don’t have this yet.

2. You have to have a big population in general to support and attend. This is why places like New Zealand can’t do it. Spain has this.

3. You have to be a rich country with lots of money in it. This is why South Africa can’t do it. Spain has this.

In my opinion Spain should start embracing regional rugby teams immediately. To grow the game then some time maybe 50 years down the line you’ll be able for a professional club competition. Not yet though.

See Spain has the advantages over Scotland and Wales that Ireland had they have regions like Catalonia and Munster which can be used as teams instead of to towns in south Wales that are rivals playing with each other.

You should start with creating rivalry’s, identities and support for these kind of games ( I know that there is already loads of this but stay with me). Maybe at the end of your club season have inter regional matches like Ireland had before with Leinster vs Munster vs Ulster etc. Spain could have Basque Country vs Catalonia vs Madrid or have a state of origin thing like in Australia.

Eventually either develop this into having pro regional teams playing in the pro 14 or have your own mitre 10 cup type thing or both.

Eventually after having this for decades and hopefully the status of rugby has grown over time and Spain has way more people playing rugby like 100,000 plus then you can think of having a league like the top14 or premiership.


Questions? Thoughts? Concerns?


I don't know Spanish rugby as well as AF, but in my opinion Spain will have club rugby or a mixed system like in Italy.

I think that having a semipro club league is unavoidable, as Spain is too big to have just 3 or 4 regions at best competing in Pro 14, but there is not enought player base to have an internal franchise tournament with over 6 teams (Valladolid, Madrid, Bilbao/San Sebastián, Barcelona, Málaga/Sevilla and Valencia, plus maybe a full Argentinean team in Santander).

Ten years ago we tried a post-season franchise competition, Super Ibérica, and it was a total failure. We also used to have a cup between regional "national" teams, and it was discontinued at senior level because nobody was really interested. It is still competed at u16 and u18 level, but for instances the Basque union refuses to send a team, saying that they prefer to play against French teams instead (the truth is that they do not want to play against other Spanish regional teams, because they do not consider themselves a region, but would love to play against Spain's NT).

Also, if I am not mistaken, Catalonia was expelled until recently from Spanish regional competitions, as they refused to pay FER the quotas owed to them. And 10-12 years ago requested Rugby Europe (then called FIRA) to be accepted as full member, and sued it at French courts when their request was denied (of course losing the appeal, but the move was made to make proud the Catalonian nationalistic politicians).

Following your example, is like Munster refusing to play Leinster, and wanting to play against England (or Ireland) instead. Spanish rugby cannot really count with them for anything (but again, Basque regional federation is against FER, but FER's president Alfonso Feijoo is Basque, as it is his son, Pablo Feijoo, Spain's national Sevens coach).

If you add that rivalries already exist between clubs, the biggest of them VRAC-El Salvador, both clubs from Valladolid, it is really difficult to move from a club league to a regional franchise league. Club league will always exist, maybe semipro, maybe with less club to raise the average level, but its existance is out of the discussion.

So maybe Spain could support 1/2/3 franchises at Pro14 league at some point, on top of the domestic league, in order to have a pool of players with a higher standard of competition to improve the results of the national team, but not replace its competition with franchises.

Thus, the Italian model.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby amz » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 13:31

This would be possible if FFR will agree because they have plenty of clubs who want to promote, it's not like they need more top clubs. Joining Celtic league may be a better option since they look to extend.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Ainsthrilln » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 19:47

amz wrote:This would be possible if FFR will agree because they have plenty of clubs who want to promote, it's not like they need more top clubs. Joining Celtic league may be a better option since they look to extend.


FFR has not ever shown any interest in helping us. An Spanish club near the border could join their league starting at the lower level, like Servette in Switzerland, but that's it.

A Spanish franchise would have to play the Celtic League, if it can bring money to the table and ensure that the team would have a certain playing standard. Italians did the first and, at least with Benetton, the second.

But can we? At the moment FER cannot even dream with having the budget able to sustain it, and even if we sweep ProD2 and Top14 hiring players who can play for Spain, and hire a few South Africans or New Zealanders to fill the weekest positions, I am not sure if we would be better than the Southern Kings.

In any casez it would be a dream come true.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 22:26

Surely they could pull in Spanish players currently in ProD2 and other NT players and at least be ok for a bit. Grab some additional mercenaries for the first few years and they can at least be on par with the SA and Italian teams.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 16 Dec 2018, 22:48

Rugga wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. That's why I'm skeptical.


What do you believe is the best way forward for Spainish rugby?

Should they go regional like the pro14? or should they go like the top14 and the premiership with clubs?

In my humble opinion you have to a few requirements to do it the premiership or pro14 way with clubs.

1. You have got to have loads of players. France and England both have over 300,000 players. This is why Australia can’t do it. Spain don’t have this yet.

2. You have to have a big population in general to support and attend. This is why places like New Zealand can’t do it. Spain has this.

3. You have to be a rich country with lots of money in it. This is why South Africa can’t do it. Spain has this.

In my opinion Spain should start embracing regional rugby teams immediately. To grow the game then some time maybe 50 years down the line you’ll be able for a professional club competition. Not yet though.

See Spain has the advantages over Scotland and Wales that Ireland had they have regions like Catalonia and Munster which can be used as teams instead of to towns in south Wales that are rivals playing with each other.

You should start with creating rivalry’s, identities and support for these kind of games ( I know that there is already loads of this but stay with me). Maybe at the end of your club season have inter regional matches like Ireland had before with Leinster vs Munster vs Ulster etc. Spain could have Basque Country vs Catalonia vs Madrid or have a state of origin thing like in Australia.

Eventually either develop this into having pro regional teams playing in the pro 14 or have your own mitre 10 cup type thing or both.

Eventually after having this for decades and hopefully the status of rugby has grown over time and Spain has way more people playing rugby like 100,000 plus then you can think of having a league like the top14 or premiership.


Questions? Thoughts? Concerns?

Like Ainsthrilln I truly believe professional rugby in Spain will be born through existing clubs or won't be at all. It is a long way ahead, but it is the most secure way after a failed experience with franchises with Liga Superibérica. Nobody wants to take such a risk, because it only takes a couple of clubs boycotting to sink two on paper powerful franchises.

Any foreigner believes current Spanish regions would be the perfect starting point for a franchise competition (Pichot said it when he came here), but it isn't that easy. From the outside, 'you' (I generalise) seem to believe we've got 17 autonomous communities of similar weight and identity, but it isn't the case. There are degrees. Basque Country and Catalonia have the deepest identities and oppose themselves to 'Spain' (rather Castille). A franchise representing Galicia, Andalucía or Asturias may have some appeal, but for other regions it makes little to no sense, they are Spanish above all and only created political entities in the eighties because nobody could afford to be 'less than Catalonia or Basque Country'*. I mentioned in the past how football used to hold regional friendlies in Christmas and they were quietly dropped because they generated no interest.

Apart from that, there are some pretty evident issues to solve in order to regionalise rugby. Legally it's quite difficult to implement, since sporting unions aren't supposed to organise professional sport and sustain teams. Apart from that, some regional unions are almost non existent, with clubs in their territories basically playing in other leagues, so they wouldn't be represented. We would need to push for their development almost from scratch. Moreover regionalisation of Spanish rugby wouldn't happen without victims, since the status of some clubs without much support around them (Independiente and Bathco are islands in Cantabria rugby, like Fénix in Aragón or Cáceres in Extremadura. Their unions are much smaller than them) would suffer. Others that exist may not have enough structure to cover all their territory: Andalucía has lots of potential but Sevilla isn't a vantage point good enough to scout properly eastern provinces like Málaga, Granada, Almería or Jaén**.

By the way, these end of season regional games already exist between Catalonia, Euskadi and Galicia. It's the Galeuscat Cup and people don't care too much. The stepping stone would be current Autonomic Championship played in U18 and U16, which this season changed its format into a round robin competition. But Basque Country decided a long time ago not to take part in it.

* Madrid anthem lyrics are basically mocking the creation of a totally artificial region
** If you follow news you may know far right obtained parliamentary representation in Andalucía recently, a novelty for the last 40 years in Spain. Well, part of the reason is that: a city in the West cumulates most of the power and the cities and provinces in the East feel they are ill treated, forgotten, etc... so they found a way to punish and send a message.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 01:33

Seems that many people assume similar things about Spain as they do the US for rugby. Get a Pro14 team in there and then their rugby will grow! But if you really look into the sports culture I guess it appears to make more sense to focus on a national league. You guys already have a decent semi pro competition and there are those talks to make a pro one out of it. Sure there are a lot of foreigners playing in the league but you have the infrastructure and stadiums needed to take it pro. I’d love to have what you guys have when creating MLR in the US.

Speaking of which, how are conversations going about professionalization?

For the record, I’m one of the people who’ve assumed this as well.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Blurandski » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 02:25

All regions do is cannibalise existing rivalries, personally I'm of the opinion that Italy should have never joined the Pro14, by now they would have been able to build up the national championship into something significant.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby vino_93 » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 07:19

Fully agree.
Franchise competition is good for small british nations. Trying to import it to bigger nations, like Italy or Spain is a mistake. These countries are used to play national championships, whatever is the sport. Maybe merge with neighbour, but no more.

With a proper development plan, Italy should have focused on its NC, which was quite correct at that time.

And Spain has something which works, with rivalries, big events, .... Let time do, keep on working, and you will have something good in a few years.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Rugga » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 08:59

iul wrote:
Rugga wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. That's why I'm skeptical.


What do you believe is the best way forward for Spainish rugby?

Should they go regional like the pro14? or should they go like the top14 and the premiership with clubs?

In my humble opinion you have to a few requirements to do it the premiership or pro14 way with clubs.

1. You have got to have loads of players. France and England both have over 300,000 players. This is why Australia can’t do it. Spain don’t have this yet.

2. You have to have a big population in general to support and attend. This is why places like New Zealand can’t do it. Spain has this.

3. You have to be a rich country with lots of money in it. This is why South Africa can’t do it. Spain has this.

In my opinion Spain should start embracing regional rugby teams immediately. To grow the game then some time maybe 50 years down the line you’ll be able for a professional club competition. Not yet though.

See Spain has the advantages over Scotland and Wales that Ireland had they have regions like Catalonia and Munster which can be used as teams instead of to towns in south Wales that are rivals playing with each other.

You should start with creating rivalry’s, identities and support for these kind of games ( I know that there is already loads of this but stay with me). Maybe at the end of your club season have inter regional matches like Ireland had before with Leinster vs Munster vs Ulster etc. Spain could have Basque Country vs Catalonia vs Madrid or have a state of origin thing like in Australia.

Eventually either develop this into having pro regional teams playing in the pro 14 or have your own mitre 10 cup type thing or both.

Eventually after having this for decades and hopefully the status of rugby has grown over time and Spain has way more people playing rugby like 100,000 plus then you can think of having a league like the top14 or premiership.


Questions? Thoughts? Concerns?

NZ, Aus and SA can't do it because they have chosen the wrong path. They've destroyed their local competitions to build SR, a super complicated, convoluted competition, with a lot of travel, a lot of games between teams with no natural rivalry and a lot of games at unwatchable times.
Spain should stay away from the regional teams IMO. Just focus on professionalizing clubs.


One of the reasons for nz and Australia doing a multinational competition is because they couldn’t generate enough money from a domestic competition to keep all there best players in the country. They can’t even do that any more with the money being offered in Europe.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby iul » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 10:33

Rugga wrote:
iul wrote:
Rugga wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:We're still talking about only 2 million people and 2000 rugby players in a land where Athletic Club from football already embodies all what you mention. Th7at's why I'm skeptical.


What do you believe is the best way forward for Spainish rugby?

Should they go regional like the pro14? or should they go like the top14 and the premiership with clubs?

In my humble opinion you have to a few requirements to do it the premiership or pro14 way with clubs.

1. You have got to have loads of players. France and England both have over 300,000 players. This is why Australia can’t do it. Spain don’t have this yet.

2. You have to have a big population in general to support and attend. This is why places like New Zealand can’t do it. Spain has this.

3. You have to be a rich country with lots of money in it. This is why South Africa can’t do it. Spain has this.

In my opinion Spain should start embracing regional rugby teams immediately. To grow the game then some time maybe 50 years down the line you’ll be able for a professional club competition. Not yet though.

See Spain has the advantages over Scotland and Wales that Ireland had they have regions like Catalonia and Munster which can be used as teams instead of to towns in south Wales that are rivals playing with each other.

You should start with creating rivalry’s, identities and support for these kind of games ( I know that there is already loads of this but stay with me). Maybe at the end of your club season have inter regional matches like Ireland had before with Leinster vs Munster vs Ulster etc. Spain could have Basque Country vs Catalonia vs Madrid or have a state of origin thing like in Australia.

Eventually either develop this into having pro regional teams playing in the pro 14 or have your own mitre 10 cup type thing or both.

Eventually after having this for decades and hopefully the status of rugby has grown over time and Spain has way more people playing rugby like 100,000 plus then you can think of having a league like the top14 or premiership.


Questions? Thoughts? Concerns?

NZ, Aus and SA can't do it because they have chosen the wrong path. They've destroyed their local competitions to build SR, a super complicated, convoluted competition, with a lot of travel, a lot of games between teams with no natural rivalry and a lot of games at unwatchable times.
Spain should stay away from the regional teams IMO. Just focus on professionalizing clubs.


One of the reasons for nz and Australia doing a multinational competition is because they couldn’t generate enough money from a domestic competition to keep all there best players in the country. They can’t even do that any more with the money being offered in Europe.

Nope, SR started before the English and French leagues went pro and the SH had the upper hand financially at the club level at the beginning due to that big TV deal they signed at the beginning. The problem is their viision was wrong. They tried to compete vs the euro clubs by playing half as much rugby. They should have kept the domestic leagues then add a euro cup style tournament on top of them.
I mean think about it.. the Fr and Eng clubs each have 16 guaranteed regular season home games while the SR clubs have 8. Easy to spot why the SHers have less money.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Tobar » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 13:47

I mean, technically 2/3 of them do have a strong national competition - Currie Cup and Mitre 10. Super Rugby is basically the Champions Cup for them. There are also 19 rounds for SR, not 8.

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby iul » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 14:12

Tobar wrote:I mean, technically 2/3 of them do have a strong national competition - Currie Cup and Mitre 10. Super Rugby is basically the Champions Cup for them. There are also 19 rounds for SR, not 8.

each SR team has 8 guaranteed home games / season
Their national competitions falling in popularity

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Re: Spanish rugby

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 17 Dec 2018, 16:25

Liga Heineken - Week 12 - Results and Standings
VRAC Quesos Entrepinares 20 - 0 SilverStorm El Salvador (shockingly one-sided result with a stellar Alvar Gimeno celebrating his 21st birthday)
Sanitas Alcobendas 21 - 10 UBU-Colina Clinic (another grey victory for Alcobendas, as solid as boring)
UE Santboiana 22 - 23 Ampo Ordizia
Hernani 20 - 13 Barça Rugbi (!)
Bizkaia Gernika 29 - 39 Aldro Independiente
La Vila 18 - 17 Complutense Cisneros

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