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Rugby in Zimbabwe

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby amz » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 11:38

It is depressing to see this disarray but I suppose it isn't limited to rugby. I mean Zimbabwe could have developed much much better considering the tradition and vicinity with SA.

Hopefully at some point this fall will end, I really wish to see a strong Zimbabwe side and it'd be great if will tour Romania or play home or at other tournaments, same as Namibia is doing now occasionally.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 11:42

We hope to get to that stage and better but at the moment there are many more important issues now than sport. The passion for the game is still very high and once things come right there will be a big push to improve.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby amz » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 11:47

Sables4EVA wrote:We hope to get to that stage and better but at the moment there are many more important issues now than sport. The passion for the game is still very high and once things come right there will be a big push to improve.


I hope so, fingers crossed. I thought that matches from 2015 Qualification tournament will mark a comeback, even without actually qualifying to RWC I expected a steady raise of level.

Great to hear that the passion is still there, here sports barely have watchers in stands (all sports, including soccer) as this is one of the most important needs for a successful competition.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Ser Podrick of Payne » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 12:11

Sables4EVA wrote:We hope to get to that stage and better but at the moment there are many more important issues now than sport. The passion for the game is still very high and once things come right there will be a big push to improve.

Well there were rumours that your glorious leader was about to shuffle off this mortal coil, but they say that every few months!

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 12:35

He has more lives than a cat!

@AMZ, yes we all expected things to move forward but it seems things have gone the other way. If we had qualified for the WC and the 7s had made core status things would have really kicked off. There will be another rush to qualify for the Japan WC and some players who made themselves unavailable will return, because the perception among certain players is any other game is a waste of time, and hopefully with a safer and economically stronger home base we will finally beat Namibia for the African slot and that will add impetus to the game here.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby amz » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 12:45

Sables4EVA wrote:He has more lives than a cat!


Luckily his friend Ceausescu didn't had lives of a cat!

Sables4EVA wrote:@AMZ, yes we all expected things to move forward but it seems things have gone the other way. If we had qualified for the WC and the 7s had made core status things would have really kicked off. There will be another rush to qualify for the Japan WC and some players who made themselves unavailable will return, because the perception among certain players is any other game is a waste of time, and hopefully with a safer and economically stronger home base we will finally beat Namibia for the African slot and that will add impetus to the game here.


It's difficult to assemble something from leaps which happen here and there, continuity is needed.

Forgive my ignorance but can you quickly list the players who made themselves unavailable? Is a team including them strong enough to beat Namibia? The main issue Sables would face against Welwitschias is that Namibians have more test level practice together, a tournament like Nations Cup is quite important for their cohesion and having a side in SA system it's also very important. It's important for players to understand that they cannot simply turn before the match and expect to win against a side with more practice, perhaps ZRU will have to look beyond simply convincing players to participat only before RWC qualification tournaments.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Wed, 07 Sep 2016, 13:08

Players I can name off the top of my head are Ross Cronje, Lawrence Cleminson, Jan Ferrierra, Pieter Joubert, Farai Mudariki, Martin Wolfenden, Kinjgsley Lang, Alva Senderayi and Riaan O'Niell. Whether or not they were injured or the ZRU couldn't bring them back for the games for whatever reason they would have made a big difference against Kenya and Uganda and may have given Namibia a tougher time.

Hopefully Zimbabwe can also have a resurgence as Romania had after removing the dictator.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby amz » Thu, 08 Sep 2016, 07:23

Sables4EVA wrote:Hopefully Zimbabwe can also have a resurgence as Romania had after removing the dictator.


I don't know what exactly is the situation in Zimbabwe from economical/social/political point of view but here basically structures which sustained rugby before 1989 were destroyed so what is happening now is basically a new build up, hardly anything that was before if functioning today. Removing a dictator alone might not lead to an immediate resurgence.

On the other hand, it is possible that the changes in society mayn't need to be so deep as it was here.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby JamesWales » Thu, 08 Sep 2016, 08:58

Was rugby in Romania somehow linked to the communist regime, which impacted upon it's development after 1990?

I assume Rugby in Zimbabwe is not overly promoted by Mugabe in Zimbabwe, or is it embraced as sport for black Zimbabweans too?

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby thatrugbyguy » Thu, 08 Sep 2016, 09:07

The Romanians here would know better but I believe rugby in the country prior to the fall of communism was linked with the military.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Thu, 08 Sep 2016, 09:29

JamesWales wrote:Was rugby in Romania somehow linked to the communist regime, which impacted upon it's development after 1990?

I assume Rugby in Zimbabwe is not overly promoted by Mugabe in Zimbabwe, or is it embraced as sport for black Zimbabweans too?


No rugby is not overly promoted by the government. It used to have a perception of being an elitist sport but nowadays the majority of top players coming out of the system are black. There is a very strong development program that started a few years ago and this is bearing fruit now.

@AMZ, luckily the rugby infrastructure is still in place, and in the last couple of years has seen a resurgence whereby former rugby stadiums that had been converted to soccer have been reverted to rugby (Police Grounds being the main example). There is also a resurgence of provincial boards which will make growth at that level improve.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby amz » Thu, 08 Sep 2016, 09:56

thatrugbyguy wrote:The Romanians here would know better but I believe rugby in the country prior to the fall of communism was linked with the military.

JamesWales wrote:Was rugby in Romania somehow linked to the communist regime, which impacted upon it's development after 1990?


I'll answer you shortly on Romanian thread as this one about Zimbabwe :)

@Sables4Eva this is very good news and this comes from one who struggled to find grounds in Bucharest to play rugby regularly without pronhibitive costs; there are also timid signs that we'll have new grounds soon :thumbup:

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby victorsra » Thu, 08 Sep 2016, 15:12

A question I always had is about Zimbabwe's colours.

Isn't green and white the colours linked to Rhodesian times?

Zimbabwe's soccer team is yellow. The cricket team uses red and yellow (has Zimbabwe/Rhodesia used green and white in cricket in ODI Cricket before?).

Is rugby the only one in Zimbabwe that kept green and white?

Has Mugabe government ever tried to change the colours of Zimbabwe's rugby shirt?

Can you make it more clear to me Sables4ever?
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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Fri, 09 Sep 2016, 09:10

victorsra wrote:A question I always had is about Zimbabwe's colours.

Isn't green and white the colours linked to Rhodesian times?

Zimbabwe's soccer team is yellow. The cricket team uses red and yellow (has Zimbabwe/Rhodesia used green and white in cricket in ODI Cricket before?).

Is rugby the only one in Zimbabwe that kept green and white?

Has Mugabe government ever tried to change the colours of Zimbabwe's rugby shirt?

Can you make it more clear to me Sables4ever?


Sure, no problem.

The colours of the rugby jersey have been used most probably since the first game played in 1910. The Rhodesian flag was only unveiled in 1968 and the common story spoken here is the flag was inspired by the rugby teams colours.

The original green and white was taken from the coat of arms of Rhodesia, as was the nick name of the Sables and upon independence the new coat of arms also has the same colours so they were retained for the rugby team as per tradition, though now the flanking animals are Kudus. There never has been any discussion on the change of colours and many black players proudly wear the green and white.

the cricket team only came into prominence in the late 80s so their colours are more based on the Zimbabwean flag and the football teams colours have changed many times over the decades and have only in the past 10 or 20 years remained on yellow shirts and green shorts.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby victorsra » Fri, 09 Sep 2016, 13:43

Thanks
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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby HMFCalltheway » Sat, 24 Sep 2016, 09:51

Looks like Zimbabwe have missed out on another quality player. Mike Williams could be Jack Clifford's replacement for England in the 7 shirt.

He likely would have never represented Zim but that only leaves Marco Mama as the only Zimbabwean not capped by another nation in the Premiership.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/ ... ded--surp/

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Thu, 29 Sep 2016, 07:07

The continuing disintegration of rugby in Zimbabwe continues.

The Sables knocked down to Div1B
The Youth teams being outclassed in the Craven weeks
The Cheetahs not even qualifying for the final of the African Championships.
The administration in disarray and many officials dropping out
Financial investigations into the World U20 Trophy
More and more players turning their back on Zimbabwe for other countries

I am heartbroken with the state of the game here.

BUT

The U17 team performed well at the Grant Khomo week in SA, defeating 2 of their 3 opponents, including Namibia
The U19 team qualified for the African Youth Championships final and narrowly lost to Namibia
Old Georgians, club champions of Zimbabwe are performing admirably in the Gold Cup, winning one game and losing the other to a very strong team, holding the game close until the final stages.

I hold on to these positives and hope they mean the future is still there for us and the current state is temporary and not the death knell of the game here.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Neptune » Mon, 19 Dec 2016, 11:10

Sables4EVA wrote:Last year the ZRU was approached and invited to field a team to replace the Namibian team. As far as I know the ZRU accepted and was preparing to raise the sponsorship for the campaign and sent e-mails and phone calls to try and confirm the fixture list and were answered with silence. Then it was announced that Kenya would be the team involved with no explanation from SARU on the change.

Personally I think the ZRU insisted on games being hosted in Zimbabwe and the sponsors were not happy with that as advertising would have been a problem in Zimbabwe.


Kenya's invitation had been pending for years, we were to fulfill a few obligations before joining the competition. First of all we were to cater for all our financial travel and accomodation costs, which we agreed to through our main beer sponsor Tusker, then we were to have all our matches in South Africa. We initially wanted at least 3 matches in Nairobi, but it wasn't financially viable. Our XVs coach Jerome Paarwater also coaches the Western Province, so he organised most of the logistics down south. It is important to note that our previous Union chairman Mwangi Muthee was the main person who made all this possible. He was a pro XVs rugby person, and after he left, I dont think the current chairman is up to the task in uplifting XVs rugby. He just issues press conferences and all that rhetoric. We have applied for the 2017 version, hopefully we can get it, but one sure thing is that our current union are really dormant, as compared to the 2014 year when we went to the Vodacom cup.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Neptune » Mon, 19 Dec 2016, 11:22

Sables4EVA , I think Zimbabwe rugby should also find a rugby ground to host matches. When Kenya comes over, we are always taken to Prince Edward which is a high school, and hence fans cannot bring beer to the grounds. As you know, rugby over a beer is very satisfactory. :) . It's only this year when you hosted us at the Police grounds. Anyway, at least in 2017 we get to host you guys in Nairobi. Hopefully, whoever wins the match between our two countries will support the other against Namibia. Our boys back home are really fighting to kill the Namibian dominance. We beat them in 2014, and if all goes well, we could beat them this year and gain an RWC 2019 berth. :)

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Mon, 19 Dec 2016, 15:13

As far as I know the Police Grounds has been set to be the home ground of the Sables so if you do come don to watch we can share a beer while watching the game.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Neptune » Tue, 20 Dec 2016, 08:55

Sables4EVA wrote:As far as I know the Police Grounds has been set to be the home ground of the Sables so if you do come don to watch we can share a beer while watching the game.


It's actually you who will be coming to Nairobi according to the fixtures.

Could you also tell me more about Rugby in Zimbabwe. Is their a second tier competition after the NRL or the NRL is the only rugby competition in the region?

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Wed, 21 Dec 2016, 19:02

There is a national league of 10 clubs and feeding into this are provincial leagues mainly in the north and south of the country. There is possibly a provincial tournament starting in the next season which will fill the gap between national and club rugby.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Neptune » Sat, 31 Dec 2016, 07:05

Sables4EVA, Hi

Why is it that Zim cricket does well, yet their rugby is struggling? Are the cricket players paid proffesionals, while their rugby counterparts just part time amateurs? Thanks

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby Sables4EVA » Sun, 01 Jan 2017, 09:43

Neptune wrote:Sables4EVA, Hi

Why is it that Zim cricket does well, yet their rugby is struggling? Are the cricket players paid proffesionals, while their rugby counterparts just part time amateurs? Thanks


That's exactly the reason, all the cricketers are paid professionals, The rugby players are all amateur.

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Re: Rugby in Zimbabwe

Postby eal22 » Sun, 01 Jan 2017, 23:30

Everything has collapsed in Zimbabwe, including cricket. With the introduction of bond notes the demise of the nation is complete. Mugabe's death may unleash even worse governance, likely military lead. Zimbabweans as a group are too apathetic to rise up which helps keep the peace to a degree but also leads to politicians who do not fear reprisal.

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