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The future of Italian Rugby

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby jservuk » Sat, 09 Jun 2018, 16:55

Win for Japan.

Was this a full strength Italy side?

Does this mean Japan have a good chance of making the knock-out stages in 2019?

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Ser Podrick of Payne » Sat, 09 Jun 2018, 17:05

It was a pretty decent selection for Italy, at least bearing in mind their team form has been poor this year. Not sure how much Zanni plays in the 2nd row.


15 Matteo MINOZZI (Zebre Rugby Club, 8 caps) *

14 Tommaso BENVENUTI (Benetton Rugby, 50 caps) *

13 Michele CAMPAGNARO (Exeter Chiefs, 32 caps) *

12 Tommaso CASTELLO (Zebre Rugby Club, 10 caps)

11 Mattia BELLINI (Zebras Rugby Club, 13 caps) *

10 Tommaso ALLAN (Benetton Rugby, 38 caps)

9 Marcello VIOLI (Zebre Rugby Club, 13 caps) *

8 Abraham STEYN (Benetton Rugby, 19 caps)

7 Giovanni LICATA (Flame Gold Rugby, 5 caps) *

6 Sebastian NEGRI (Benetton Rugby, 7 caps)

5 Dean BUDD (Benetton Rugby, 11 caps)

4 Alessandro ZANNI (Benetton Rugby, 104 caps)

3 Tiziano PASQUALI (Benetton Rugby, 7 caps)

2 Leonardo GHIRALDINI (Stade Toulousain, 94 caps) - captain

1 Andrea LOVOTTI (Zebre Rugby Club, 25 caps) *

available

16 Luca BIGI (Benetton Rugby, 9 caps)

17 Federico ZANI (Benetton Rugby, 6 caps)

18 Giosuè ZILOCCHI (Patarò Calvisano, newcomer) *

19 George BIAGI (Zebre Rugby Club, 21 caps)

20 Marco FUSER (Benetton Rugby, 27 caps) *

21 Jake POLLEDRI (Gloucester Rugby, 1 cap)

22 Tito TEBALDI (Benetton Rugby, 23 caps)

23 Jayden HAYWARD (Benetton Rugby, 8 caps)

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby sk 88 » Sat, 09 Jun 2018, 18:41

jservuk wrote:Win for Japan.

Was this a full strength Italy side?

Does this mean Japan have a good chance of making the knock-out stages in 2019?



The match v Scotland will probably be crucial to that. I'm not sure if this result changes that or not.

It is Japan's record win versus a 6N side, so definitely a positive. Fingers crossed Japan will get the same "rub of the green" that T1 nations usually get at home and can make a real mark on the tournament.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby rey200 » Sat, 09 Jun 2018, 21:13

I have no doubts that Japan should be considered a T1 nation by now.
Ceterum censeo Sex Nationes esse augendas.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby dwpeate » Sun, 10 Jun 2018, 20:03

Interesting that Italy chose 6 forwards.
Anyone know if highlights are available? Nothing on youtube!

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby 4N » Sun, 10 Jun 2018, 20:41

Full match

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby rugby.change » Mon, 11 Jun 2018, 02:11

I bet Georgia are licking their lips over the upcoming November test against the Italians.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby victorsra » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 05:38

PRO14 wants an Italian franchise in Rome (probably Zebre's relocation) and FIR is indeed studying it. The plan is to have rugby back to Flaminio stadium and even FIR's offices there after renovations (as the stadium is now abandoned): http://www.r1823.it/2018/06/25/gavazzi- ... ia-a-roma/
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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Figaro » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 07:30

victorsra wrote:PRO14 wants an Italian franchise in Rome (probably Zebre's relocation) and FIR is indeed studying it. The plan is to have rugby back to Flaminio stadium and even FIR's offices there after renovations (as the stadium is now abandoned): http://www.r1823.it/2018/06/25/gavazzi- ... ia-a-roma/


This, or something like it - if it's not Zebre it's Benetton, or a merger/scrapping of both teams into a single Roman franchise - gets rumoured pretty much every year, and usually never makes it beyond the Italian media. I'll believe it when it happens, or at least, not until we get substantially more solid evidence that it will. Though I will admit that Zebre's expedition match in Aquilla is the first indicator that they're serious about it, and certainly the fact it was the best attended ProX game in Italy won't have put them off.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby victorsra » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 12:56

Well this time was FIR's president talking at least.
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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby victorsra » Fri, 29 Jun 2018, 14:37

More info with Gazzetta Dello Sport (Italy's main sports newspaper) interviewing Gavazzi (FIR's president): https://www.gazzetta.it/Rugby/29-06-201 ... resh_ce-cp

Roma diventerà anche sede di una terza franchigia?
«Treviso e Zebre, fino al 2021, resteranno sole. Poi, col Pro 14 che spinge e del quale nel 2019 diventeremo soci a tutti gli effetti, l’ipotesi diventerà tutt’altro che peregrina. Soprattutto col Flaminio a disposizione e senza dimenticare un possibile coinvolgimento del Tre Fontane. Milano? Manca un impianto e il Comune latita».


If my Italian is still ok, Rome will enter just after 2021. FIR doesn't want to relocate any team (so, Rome would be an expansion side). In 2019 FIR will be a PRO14 stakeholder.
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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Canalina » Mon, 02 Jul 2018, 11:56

Tickets price for Italy v Georgia http://ticket.federugby.it/index.php?op ... Itemid=339

The selling should start this wednesday

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sun, 22 Jul 2018, 22:14

More about Italy's Eccellenza name change. The championship will be called now Top 12. And Coppa Italia will be again the name of the cup competition, with 8 clubs now. It would be interesting if Coppa Italia offered a place in the Continental Shield.

https://www.onrugby.it/2018/07/21/lecce ... -il-top12/
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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Immenso » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 01:59

That's a dumb name change, IMO.

Drop a unique identifier like Eccellenza, change it to an a bland nondescript name that confuses it with about 4 other professional rugby leagues.

Or is that the point? Do they want people to mistakenly think it is Top 14, Pro14, or Top League?

Does Eccellenza have such a bad reputation they want to expunge it and hope people think it is something else? I don't know much about Eccellenza (but I know many of the club names from the shamateur era when Ella, Campese, Kirwan etc used to off-season up there) but I now assume it must be so bad that hiding among the masses is a an attractive option for the Stakeholders.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby carbonero » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 03:42

Immenso wrote: Drop a unique identifier like Eccellenza, change it to an a bland nondescript name that confuses it with about 4 other professional rugby leagues.

Eccellenza isn’t a unique identifier. It’s like saying División de Honor in Spanish or Premiership in English. Top 12 is lazy but they could be looking for a name sponsor.

Also, it’s just a name change. No need to take a shit on the league.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Canalina » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 04:46

The major problem with "Eccellenza", according to various clubs' presidents, was that it's the same name of a minor soccer category (the 6th soccer national level, if I'm correct), so when they went to potential sponsors to ask for a partnership they often had to patiently explain that it was not the 6th level of national rugby, but in that moment the already low interest of the potential sponsor was partially gone.
Moreover, "Eccellenza" has not a great appeal for an italian: it sounds perhaps like "egregity" in english. It doesn't warm the hearts. Conclusion: no one fan cries saturday when the federation communicated the change of name.
"Top 12" is few original, I admit, but it's shorter and a bit more indicative.
Also the change back from "Trofeo Eccellenza" to "Coppa Italia" was hailed with satisfaction: no one never understood why the championship and the cup had to have the same name and the journalists often had to write "today there's the third round of Trofeo Eccellenza, the former Coppa Italia..." to specify.

Anyway several months ago a "league" of Eccellenza's clubs was formed, with the aim of bringing some improvements like the change of championship name, a stronger collaboration between the clubs and between the clubs and the two Pro 14 franchises, a much more efficacious marketing, a partnership with a free public television... After many months apparently the change of the championship name is the only achievement and almost no one still talks about that league of clubs; let's see if before the beginning of the new season something new appears.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Tobar » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 14:20

How accessible is Italian rugby to the genera public? It appears that there wasn’t a free to air TV program but are the games cheap/free? Do they have lots of grassroots programs to include as many youth players as possible or is it considered an upper class niche sport that has barriers to entry?

I’ve found that in most countries struggling to build rugby is because it’s seen as an upper class sport and it has its own “old boy” kind of attitude that turns off some potential fans/players. Rugby can easily be a blue collar sport though given its toughness if the right culture exists.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Raven » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 14:47

Tobar wrote:How accessible is Italian rugby to the genera public? It appears that there wasn’t a free to air TV program but are the games cheap/free? Do they have lots of grassroots programs to include as many youth players as possible or is it considered an upper class niche sport that has barriers to entry?

I’ve found that in most countries struggling to build rugby is because it’s seen as an upper class sport and it has its own “old boy” kind of attitude that turns off some potential fans/players. Rugby can easily be a blue collar sport though given its toughness if the right culture exists.


I might be wrong, but judging for what I have seen personally, most clubs have junior set ups, some bigger than others of course, AND there are also junior set ups with no senior sides, so these clubs act as feeders for other senior teams. But what I haven´t encountered is rugby in schools, even private institutions focus more in "social" / non competitive football than trying rugby, so I would say it isn´t very upper class only.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Tobar » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 15:30

Raven wrote:
Tobar wrote:How accessible is Italian rugby to the genera public? It appears that there wasn’t a free to air TV program but are the games cheap/free? Do they have lots of grassroots programs to include as many youth players as possible or is it considered an upper class niche sport that has barriers to entry?

I’ve found that in most countries struggling to build rugby is because it’s seen as an upper class sport and it has its own “old boy” kind of attitude that turns off some potential fans/players. Rugby can easily be a blue collar sport though given its toughness if the right culture exists.


I might be wrong, but judging for what I have seen personally, most clubs have junior set ups, some bigger than others of course, AND there are also junior set ups with no senior sides, so these clubs act as feeders for other senior teams. But what I haven´t encountered is rugby in schools, even private institutions focus more in "social" / non competitive football than trying rugby, so I would say it isn´t very upper class only.


Thanks, this is helpful. I feel like a lot can be accomplished by simply introducing the idea of the sport to kids at a young age. Get Into Rugby has been very successful in doing this in countries like Colombia, where knowledge of rugby is next to zero. Honestly just putting program together with kids running around with a rugby ball and passing helps them understand that the game isn't hard or confusing, something that is a barrier over here in the US.

I would like to see the IRF spend money on creating a full time youth club setup in a place like Rome or some other big city. When it comes to growing the sport, just get some decent coaches and some good administration together and then just open it up for as many kids as possible to join in one big club. Practice a few times a week and have a festival of rugby on Saturday. The teams can be picked each year from the entire player pool rather than strict clubs. Make the ages something like 5-14 and then at 14 the kids can go off and join a specific club's youth side after they've been introduced to rugby.

This is something I'd like to see implemented in the US but can see it happening in a place like Italy. Italy should have more resources given their Tier 1 status and participation in the Six Nations. I'm not ignorant enough to believe they're just swimming in cash but I figure it would at least be better than a country like the US.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Immenso » Mon, 23 Jul 2018, 22:54

Canalina wrote:The major problem with "Eccellenza", according to various clubs' presidents, was that it's the same name of a minor soccer category (the 6th soccer national level, if I'm correct), so when they went to potential sponsors to ask for a partnership they often had to patiently explain that it was not the 6th level of national rugby, but in that moment the already low interest of the potential sponsor was partially gone.
Moreover, "Eccellenza" has not a great appeal for an italian: it sounds perhaps like "egregity" in english. It doesn't warm the hearts. Conclusion: no one fan cries saturday when the federation communicated the change of name.
"Top 12" is few original, I admit, but it's shorter and a bit more indicative.
Also the change back from "Trofeo Eccellenza" to "Coppa Italia" was hailed with satisfaction: no one never understood why the championship and the cup had to have the same name and the journalists often had to write "today there's the third round of Trofeo Eccellenza, the former Coppa Italia..." to specify.

Anyway several months ago a "league" of Eccellenza's clubs was formed, with the aim of bringing some improvements like the change of championship name, a stronger collaboration between the clubs and between the clubs and the two Pro 14 franchises, a much more efficacious marketing, a partnership with a free public television... After many months apparently the change of the championship name is the only achievement and almost no one still talks about that league of clubs; let's see if before the beginning of the new season something new appears.


Right, so it's a change to differentiate it, in its domestic market, for casual Italian sports fans and sponsors. Not particularly a name change for the rugby market.

The international rugby market's interest is likely to stop anyway at the Pro 14 level.

Eccellenza sounds like a great name in English.

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby victorsra » Thu, 26 Jul 2018, 22:34

Streaming service for Italian PRO14 teams https://www.onrugby.it/2018/07/26/dirit ... o-su-dazn/
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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Canalina » Mon, 30 Jul 2018, 10:16

Top 12 calendar

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Canalina » Tue, 07 Aug 2018, 13:42

Geographical distribution of the italian 6N U20 matches, 6N women and 6N men so far, included the 2019 edition.
Well, not great surprises: the North is of course more involved, but there's a decent spread also in the centre and in the south

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby grande » Tue, 07 Aug 2018, 14:41

Is that a U20 game in Lamezia, I see?

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Re: The future of Italian Rugby

Postby Canalina » Tue, 07 Aug 2018, 16:39

It's Cosenza, 50 km north of Lamezia. I don't remember the year but it was the only time Calabria hosted a 6N match

An other table... 6N hosted matches region by region

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