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ENC attendance thread

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby jservuk » Thu, 07 Apr 2016, 23:04

RugbyLiebe wrote:
jservuk wrote:
Hansgrohe wrote:American football stadiums and revenues are huge and 6N games are very centralized. This doesn't say much for popularity of the sport itself, the averages are somewhat inflated/deflated.


Very true. There will be 98,000 at this year's Top14 Final in Barcelona, but that doesn't mean Rugby is as popular there as the other game.


Funwise there you are wrong. France is probably the only EU-country were rugby is quite close to soccer and even more popular in many regions. 90% in the stadium in Barcelona will be French, most of them from the South of France and Barcelona is nearly 280km closer to let's say Toulon, than Paris is.


My point was about Barcelona - years from now people will quote the 98,000 attendance and say "Look, 98,000 people in Barcelona watched Rugby in 2016", as if to say Barcelona is a rugby hotbed. The truth is more subtle, as you clarified.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby victorsra » Fri, 08 Apr 2016, 04:30

Moving back to rugby a bit, I really hope American football doesn't catch on outside the US. It seems like it might be a bit of a competitor in Germany and Brazil. Rugby is a much better sport on and off the field.


American Football is already bigger in Brazil than Rugby. NFL have a MUCH bigger TV audience.

And while we celebrated 10.600 people in Pacaembu stadium for Brazil vs Germany (with free entrance), American Football have put more than 17.000 in a national final (very sh*** level of play, BTW) SELLING tickets.

Well, I really can't watch more than 5 minutes of American Football. It annoys me. On the field, Brazilian Rugby is much better developed. We have much better athletes. But American Football, even with very poor games technicaly, knows better how to attract people (it is their spectacle). However, I won't be surprised if Brazil soon becomes a Top 10 nation in international American Football (even Top 5...).
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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby SallesNeto_BR » Fri, 08 Apr 2016, 05:38

victorsra wrote:
Moving back to rugby a bit, I really hope American football doesn't catch on outside the US. It seems like it might be a bit of a competitor in Germany and Brazil. Rugby is a much better sport on and off the field.


American Football is already bigger in Brazil than Rugby. NFL have a MUCH bigger TV audience.

And while we celebrated 10.600 people in Pacaembu stadium for Brazil vs Germany (with free entrance), American Football have put more than 17.000 in a national final (very sh*** level of play, BTW) SELLING tickets.

Well, I really can't watch more than 5 minutes of American Football. It annoys me. On the field, Brazilian Rugby is much better developed. We have much better athletes. But American Football, even with very poor games technicaly, knows better how to attract people (it is their spectacle). However, I won't be surprised if Brazil soon becomes a Top 10 nation in international American Football (even Top 5...).


Yes, american football is really bigger than rugby. For example, here in my city, a far 350.000 place in the Amazon rainforest, we've 4 AF clubs and just 1 rugby club (+ other in incubator).

I have even seen some "rivalry" between the two sports here. The local rugby club (Makuxi RC) challenged the largest AF club to compete in a picturesque match: rugby in the first time, AF in the second time. They fled.

It is common to see bars in any medium brazilian city broadcasting NFL games. Rugby is not so common.

For comparison purposes, a Super Bowl resonates much more in the Brazilian media than a final of RWC, for example.

But I'm feeling that, today, rugby has growing faster than AF.
Last edited by SallesNeto_BR on Fri, 08 Apr 2016, 15:36, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby victorsra » Fri, 08 Apr 2016, 07:22

I have even seen some "rivalry" between the two sports here.


Agree. There are many rugby players that like american football, and many american football players that like rugby. But, a growing rivalry can be seen between both sports in Brazil. Quite interesting phenomenum, in fact.
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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Sun, 12 Feb 2017, 10:20

According to
http://www.rugbyeurope.eu/rugby-europe/documentation
the attendances of the 1st round 2017 are:

Germany-Romania 3000
Belgium-Georgia 4000
Spain-Russia 8000
Last edited by RugbyLiebe on Sun, 12 Feb 2017, 10:33, edited 1 time in total.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 12 Feb 2017, 10:26

Spain v Russia game sheet says 8,000 (maybe too much...): http://www.rugbyeurope.eu/sites/default ... _sheet.pdf

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Sun, 12 Feb 2017, 10:34

Armchair Fan wrote:Spain v Russia game sheet says 8,000 (maybe too much...): http://www.rugbyeurope.eu/sites/default ... _sheet.pdf


Sorry problems with my mobile devices lead to an early post
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Tue, 28 Feb 2017, 09:14

Attendance for Rugby Europe championship round 2 2017
(again according to http://www.rugbyeurope.eu/rugby-europe/documentation )


Belgium-Russia 2200 (numbers of last encounter 2015 Portugal-Russia under 1000) +1700
Georgia-Germany 3300 (2016 Georgia-Germany 2.000) +1300

Romania-Spain is unknown. Does anybody have a figure?


Round1
Germany-Romania 3000 (2016 Germany-Romania 2.500) +500
Belgium-Georgia 4000 (2016: Portugal-Georgia 700) +3300
Spain-Russia 8000 (2015: Spain Russia 6.500) +1500

So at the moment every game has reported a higher attendance number as of Rugby Europe.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 28 Feb 2017, 09:29

Unfortunately I can assure you Spain-Georgia won't improve 2015 figures since the stadium has a lesser capacity than Central.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Tue, 28 Feb 2017, 09:31

Armchair Fan wrote:Unfortunately I can assure you Spain-Georgia won't improve 2015 figures since the stadium has a lesser capacity than Central.


Same will happen this weekend with Germany-Belgium. I doubt we will get to the attendance of the 8.823 against Portugal last year. Germany-Spain is played in the same venue as last year so no higher attendance possible than an again outsold stadium.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Raven » Tue, 28 Feb 2017, 09:43

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:Unfortunately I can assure you Spain-Georgia won't improve 2015 figures since the stadium has a lesser capacity than Central.


Same will happen this weekend with Germany-Belgium. I doubt we will get to the attendance of the 8.823 against Portugal last year. Germany-Spain is played in the same venue as last year so no higher attendance possible than an again outsold stadium.


It´s hard to say really... considering the Belgium border is not as far as Portugal from Offenbach and that it will be Germany´s first home game after beating Romania.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Tue, 28 Feb 2017, 09:56

Raven wrote:
It´s hard to say really... considering the Belgium border is not as far as Portugal from Offenbach and that it will be Germany´s first home game after beating Romania.


Well one can have a good guess by having a look at the official ticket selling page: https://secure.adticket.de/p/reservix/event/947959

the game in Offenbach: there are 3500 seats at the main stand. 2/4 blocks are de facto outsold with under 10 tickets per block left. About 500 are not up for sales and around 400-500 are not sold yet. makes 2500 for the seats.
No idea about the terraces. Should be between 4-5000 overall, which is good, but I doubt the nearly 9000 will be reached.

the game in Cologne: this looks good as only under 100 seats are left. With 3/4 blocks outsold, The stadium should be full again.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby ihateblazers » Fri, 03 Mar 2017, 08:30

SallesNeto_BR wrote:Yes, american football is really bigger than rugby. For example, here in my city, a far 350.000 place in the Amazon rainforest, we've 4 AF clubs and just 1 rugby club (+ other in incubator).

I have even seen some "rivalry" between the two sports here. The local rugby club (Makuxi RC) challenged the largest AF club to compete in a picturesque match: rugby in the first time, AF in the second time. They fled.

It is common to see bars in any medium brazilian city broadcasting NFL games. Rugby is not so common.

For comparison purposes, a Super Bowl resonates much more in the Brazilian media than a final of RWC, for example.

But I'm feeling that, today, rugby has growing faster than AF.


I think you've illustrated perfectly the demand for team contact sports. Even in football mad countries there is a segment of the population that hasn't been indoctrinated by football culture and is open, and in some cases hungry for a team contact sport. In Mexico, Brazil and Germany the NFL fills that void. Hopefully rugby can continue to gain ground as it grows it's global prescence. I've met more and more people from non traditional rugby countries who once they've been exposed to rugby have fallen in love with it.

Regarding the German crowds they are very promising. Especially when you compare them to Canada or even the USA who have longer established rugby histories and are t2.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 03 Mar 2017, 09:48

ihateblazers wrote:
I think you've illustrated perfectly the demand for team contact sports. Even in football mad countries there is a segment of the population that hasn't been indoctrinated by football culture and is open, and in some cases hungry for a team contact sport. In Mexico, Brazil and Germany the NFL fills that void. Hopefully rugby can continue to gain ground as it grows it's global prescence. I've met more and more people from non traditional rugby countries who once they've been exposed to rugby have fallen in love with it.

Regarding the German crowds they are very promising. Especially when you compare them to Canada or even the USA who have longer established rugby histories and are t2.


While I like your analysis, you are missing the two most important contact-sports in Germany. Handball is number two with 767k members organized in the German handball federation and it is a heavy contact sport. Ice-hockey is actually sport number2 attendance-wise - another contact sport.

I hope there is a market for it, but there is a lot of competition.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby ihateblazers » Fri, 03 Mar 2017, 11:59

RugbyLiebe wrote:
While I like your analysis, you are missing the two most important contact-sports in Germany. Handball is number two with 767k members organized in the German handball federation and it is a heavy contact sport. Ice-hockey is actually sport number2 attendance-wise - another contact sport.

I hope there is a market for it, but there is a lot of competition.


I've never seen the attraction in handball, an incredibly bizzare sport in my opinion, No offense to any fans on this forum. I guess it's like the European version of Aussies rules or Gaelic football to a certain degree.

I see what you mean by ice hockey but it will always be hindered by costs of equipment and facilities.

My point was more in global terms there isn't really the major professional competition from team contact sports. Only the NFl has that massive presence and they don't really have the grassroots organisation or culture outside of North America.

I don't want to across like one of those nuts youll find on rugby league forums talking about global growth. But yeah I see the potential. It doesn't help when t1 and world rugby organise the way things they do now.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Armchair Fan » Fri, 03 Mar 2017, 15:30

ihateblazers wrote:I've never seen the attraction in handball, an incredibly bizzare sport in my opinion, No offense to any fans on this forum. I guess it's like the European version of Aussies rules or Gaelic football to a certain degree.

It's cheap, it's indoor, it may be played anywhere and you don't need 35-player squads to be competitive.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby NedRugby » Sat, 04 Mar 2017, 20:09

In the Rugby Europe documentation centre it gives 2000 as the crowd for Russia v Romania today. No spectator numbers are given on the Germany-Belgium gamesheet (which incidentally gives the wrong score - 34-28 instead of 34-29). The Spain-Georgia gamesheet isn't there yet.

http://www.rugbyeurope.eu/rugby-europe/documentation

It's not the ENC, but we had 3500 for Netherlands v Portugal today. I can believe it. It's the biggest crowd I've seen here for an international match I think. There may have been more for the Amsterdam 7s, but then you have 100 teams taking part so by the time of the finals that makes for a lot of spectators.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyLiebe » Sat, 04 Mar 2017, 20:19

In the stadium for the Germany-Belgium-game 4126 spectators were announced (if I recall the number right).
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyPUBtbilisi » Sun, 05 Mar 2017, 13:35

ready for beating the records?
Georgia vs Russia on Dinamo Arena (55,600).
50,000+ is for Sure! What about Full house?

Nice warm up match before Romania. Especially after Spanish cold shower yesterday.
I think this match can easily attract 50K or more.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby germanbullsfan » Sun, 05 Mar 2017, 19:20

This has nothing to do with Rugby , these 50 k + would also come to a badminton match if only they could watch Russia losing!

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Amateur_IK » Sun, 05 Mar 2017, 19:47

germanbullsfan wrote:This has nothing to do with Rugby


You may think so.
But there were 50k+ on the match against Romania and 15k+ against Spain in 2016. Also, two sold outs on Japan and Samoa in November.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby jservuk » Sat, 11 Mar 2017, 15:31

Found a fascinating website that tries to measure sport popularity on TV across the world.

This shows some encouraging figures for rugby:

http://www.kantarmedia.com/global/think ... -sport-fan

It shows that in France, 47% of people "follow" football, but 40% follow rugby, which says that football and rugby are not that far apart.

Surprisingly, it says 43% in UK follow football (less than in France) but 22% follow rugby - far less than France.

What this suggest to me is that far from getting near the fabled saturation point for sport on TV, there is still plenty of room for growth.

In Germany and Spain the interest in rugby is at 4% and 8% respectively.

On another page, there is some breakdown of popularity in age groups and income.

http://www.kantarmedia.com/global/think ... otball-fan

The simple set of figures give some insight into the rugby market in the 4 countries considered.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby RugbyPUBtbilisi » Sat, 11 Mar 2017, 16:31

45K tickets sold, less than 24 hours to go.

We will see Full house 55,700+ people vs Russia
50,000 vs Romania (in 2016)

Imagine if Scotland arrives in 2019.

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Vova12 » Sat, 11 Mar 2017, 20:05

RugbyPUBtbilisi wrote:45K tickets sold, less than 24 hours to go.

We will see Full house 55,700+ people vs Russia
50,000 vs Romania (in 2016)

Imagine if Scotland arrives in 2019.

This is more than the number of people in Russia who know about tomorrows match ...

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Re: ENC attendance thread

Postby Vova12 » Sat, 11 Mar 2017, 20:17

Who will get to the World Championship?

Germany, Romania, Spain or Russia? :shock:

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