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Servette Genf Rugby

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Wed, 08 May 2019, 08:48

Raven wrote:
vino_93 wrote:In Fédérale 3 you can find clubs with some outsiders and semi-pros players, which you haven't under.
As they play in one of the most developped Rugby place of France, the gap won't be that huge. They will mostly play clubs from small cities, with limited money.

That I can imagine, and I believe Servette has also some financial backup so it wouldn´t be a surprise that they get some new legs the upcoming season. Is it clear in what pool they would fall into?


Clubs from their geographical zone are mostly in Pool 5.
Currently there are Saint-Marcellin (8K inhabitants), Montélimar (38K), Annecy (126K), Renage (3K), Portes-les-Valence (known as Véore, 10K), Le Teil (8K), Izeaux (2K), Privas (8K), Aix-les-Bains (30K), Le Pont de Claix (10K).
Seyssins (7K) and merger between La Roche de Glun (3K) & Bourg-les-Valence (20K) will go down.
Annecy, Saint-Marcellin & Montélimar can still go up.

A few clubs from Rhône-Alpes are in pool 3 with clubs from Bourgogne-Franche-Comté & Auvergne, but it's more western parts of Rhône Alpes. Alps clubs as Annecy & Aix-les-Bains are in pool 5, so ...

I don't think they will have many problems to qualify for the final phases. Once there, promotion is another story ...
For example for the decisive round coming, Montélimar (2nd pool 5) will face Le Puy (1st pool 3); Annecy (3rd pool 5) will face Metz (1st pool 4); and Saint-Marcellin (1st pool 5) will face Thuir (2nd pool 11) in a small city fight :D

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Wed, 08 May 2019, 08:53

Working Class Rugger wrote:Servette is proving quite an interesting test case. So far they have been able to progress up the ladder of the French system with little to no issue both in and off the pitch. It will be interesting to see if that continues if/when they start pressing for inclusion in the professional ranks. If they do manage to get to at least the ProD2 level they could essentially blaze a pathway for teams from other nations to look to do similar in the future.

What they achieve is nice, but it's a huge lost of time.
I trully hope other countries will try to develop pro leagues by themselves.
Seriously, what's the point to play for years sunday players ? Servette had no opposition at all during many seasons, games had no interests ... it would have been more interesting for them to push for the creation of a Western pro league, with maybe Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, ... 6-8 clubs to start, this would have been great for the sport in these places. Not losing your time in french minor leagues (especially in Rhône Alpes where you have many levels).

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Wed, 08 May 2019, 09:06

sammo wrote:What does their squad list look like? Are they largely Swiss?

Here is the squad : https://www.servettercgeneve.ch/index.p ... r/effectif

I see many french players in the clubs, who used to play pro rugby (as Bougherara), or in Fédérale 1 / Fédérale 2. Or some youngs who come from the training centers of pro teams.
But they have a very good training centers for youths too. Not that used in first team unfortunately ...

Some of their top players :
- William Goodwin (ENG) : http://www.itsrugby.fr/joueur-35803.html
- Julien Gros (FRA, SWI international) : http://www.itsrugby.fr/joueur_22885.html
- Hugo Bouvier (FRA) : http://www.itsrugby.fr/joueur_27945.html
- Karim Bougherara (FRA, ALG international) : http://www.itsrugby.fr/joueur_15347.html

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Wed, 08 May 2019, 11:54

vino_93 wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:Servette is proving quite an interesting test case. So far they have been able to progress up the ladder of the French system with little to no issue both in and off the pitch. It will be interesting to see if that continues if/when they start pressing for inclusion in the professional ranks. If they do manage to get to at least the ProD2 level they could essentially blaze a pathway for teams from other nations to look to do similar in the future.

What they achieve is nice, but it's a huge lost of time.
I trully hope other countries will try to develop pro leagues by themselves.
Seriously, what's the point to play for years sunday players ? Servette had no opposition at all during many seasons, games had no interests ... it would have been more interesting for them to push for the creation of a Western pro league, with maybe Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, ... 6-8 clubs to start, this would have been great for the sport in these places. Not losing your time in french minor leagues (especially in Rhône Alpes where you have many levels).


Would it be a waste of time if they reach their goal and eventually make it into the professional ranks? A European pro league would be great but it's likely simpler for the more ambitious clubs to work their way through the French system at first. Perhaps if enough enter the system it could provide the impetus for them to go down that path.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Wed, 08 May 2019, 15:44

Working Class Rugger wrote:
vino_93 wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:Servette is proving quite an interesting test case. So far they have been able to progress up the ladder of the French system with little to no issue both in and off the pitch. It will be interesting to see if that continues if/when they start pressing for inclusion in the professional ranks. If they do manage to get to at least the ProD2 level they could essentially blaze a pathway for teams from other nations to look to do similar in the future.

What they achieve is nice, but it's a huge lost of time.
I trully hope other countries will try to develop pro leagues by themselves.
Seriously, what's the point to play for years sunday players ? Servette had no opposition at all during many seasons, games had no interests ... it would have been more interesting for them to push for the creation of a Western pro league, with maybe Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, ... 6-8 clubs to start, this would have been great for the sport in these places. Not losing your time in french minor leagues (especially in Rhône Alpes where you have many levels).


Would it be a waste of time if they reach their goal and eventually make it into the professional ranks? A European pro league would be great but it's likely simpler for the more ambitious clubs to work their way through the French system at first. Perhaps if enough enter the system it could provide the impetus for them to go down that path.


Do you really think that hiring pro players to play in French 6 to 9-10 divisions is useful ? I don't think.
Yes maybe in 5 years they will be in Pro D2 (and I say maybe, as it's now that it will become difficult for them). And then what ? Their squad is full of outsider, I don't think they have generated any interest in Switzerland from now. They have lost 5-6 years.

Anyway, I don't think french federation will accept it anew. There was a massiv opposition against them by french clubs. Not so many of them like to see pro players destroying 100% amateur teams... and it's difficult for the FFR to put a team directly in Fédérale 3. So ... they are probably the last giving this opportunity (except a few clubs from Luxemburg, Monaco or Andorra maybe).

Of course a Euro Pro League is a long job. Do you think it would be longer than going to Pro D2 starting from back in France ? I don't.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby 4N » Wed, 08 May 2019, 16:22

I wish rugby bosses in places like France and Italy would be more open-minded about foreign teams in their leagues. If you look at ice hockey, the Austrian league for example has teams from multiple countries. It certainly helps a club like Bolzano (Italy) out that they are able to join up with a league in a country where the sport is established at the professional level. Telling Switzerland they need to help set up a pro league when Geneva is on the French border seems like an unnecessary roadblock for the growth of the sport. And obviously if they get into Pro D2, playing at a large modern stadium with the backing of a soccer club (btw they have a pro hockey team as well), it will be big for the sport in Switzerland. I would guess their crowds have grown quite a bit already.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby germanbullsfan » Wed, 08 May 2019, 17:33

I wouldnt be to conserned about the lack of support in the moment. If Servette makes it in Federale 1 iam shure from that time the numbers of spectators and the media interest will rise . In the long run genf and the swiss rugby will benefit from that long march through the french league system .

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Thu, 09 May 2019, 08:59

4N wrote:I wish rugby bosses in places like France and Italy would be more open-minded about foreign teams in their leagues. If you look at ice hockey, the Austrian league for example has teams from multiple countries. It certainly helps a club like Bolzano (Italy) out that they are able to join up with a league in a country where the sport is established at the professional level. Telling Switzerland they need to help set up a pro league when Geneva is on the French border seems like an unnecessary roadblock for the growth of the sport. And obviously if they get into Pro D2, playing at a large modern stadium with the backing of a soccer club (btw they have a pro hockey team as well), it will be big for the sport in Switzerland. I would guess their crowds have grown quite a bit already.


You can't compare Ice hockey with rugby, neither Austria to France.
Austria is a small country. Ice hockey is a difficult sport to develop as you need ice rinks, and big ones for Austrian leagues. There aren't enough of them in Austria, and no cities with the potential for. So to offer good oppositions, they needed outsiders.

Rugby is easy to develop ... You only need to convert football pitches. Here we have many of them, some not used anymore. Cities start to share big stadiums between both sports; or rugby clubs can take old football pitches when new modern ones are built.
Currently in France, you have 30 pro teams. Probably the same number in Fédérale who are looking for promotion in Pro D2 in short or medium term. Or maybe even more...
There's no need for outsiders. FFR priority is to develop the sport in the whole country. Same for the FIR.

So it's cool for Geneva to have this opportunity. I'm pretty sure that if in 5-10 years they reach Pro D2 it will work for them. And maybe for Swiss Rugby (who knows...).
But during the long time it takes them to reach that, they could have work on another development, with Germany and/or Benelux. A project more useful for the european rugby than thrashing for years amateur players with french pro guys.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby dropkick » Thu, 09 May 2019, 09:21

vino_93 wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:
vino_93 wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:Servette is proving quite an interesting test case. So far they have been able to progress up the ladder of the French system with little to no issue both in and off the pitch. It will be interesting to see if that continues if/when they start pressing for inclusion in the professional ranks. If they do manage to get to at least the ProD2 level they could essentially blaze a pathway for teams from other nations to look to do similar in the future.

What they achieve is nice, but it's a huge lost of time.
I trully hope other countries will try to develop pro leagues by themselves.
Seriously, what's the point to play for years sunday players ? Servette had no opposition at all during many seasons, games had no interests ... it would have been more interesting for them to push for the creation of a Western pro league, with maybe Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, ... 6-8 clubs to start, this would have been great for the sport in these places. Not losing your time in french minor leagues (especially in Rhône Alpes where you have many levels).


Would it be a waste of time if they reach their goal and eventually make it into the professional ranks? A European pro league would be great but it's likely simpler for the more ambitious clubs to work their way through the French system at first. Perhaps if enough enter the system it could provide the impetus for them to go down that path.


Do you really think that hiring pro players to play in French 6 to 9-10 divisions is useful ? I don't think.
Yes maybe in 5 years they will be in Pro D2 (and I say maybe, as it's now that it will become difficult for them). And then what ? Their squad is full of outsider, I don't think they have generated any interest in Switzerland from now. They have lost 5-6 years.

Anyway, I don't think french federation will accept it anew. There was a massiv opposition against them by french clubs. Not so many of them like to see pro players destroying 100% amateur teams... and it's difficult for the FFR to put a team directly in Fédérale 3. So ... they are probably the last giving this opportunity (except a few clubs from Luxemburg, Monaco or Andorra maybe).

Of course a Euro Pro League is a long job. Do you think it would be longer than going to Pro D2 starting from back in France ? I don't.



Organising a European pro league isn't easy and it would cost a lot of money.


Servette has a chance to make the top level now while they didn't have to risk much in doing so.


The question going forward for them would be about JIFF players. Will they have to have mostly french qualified players or will an exception be made for them.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Thu, 09 May 2019, 10:11

dropkick wrote:
vino_93 wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:
vino_93 wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:Servette is proving quite an interesting test case. So far they have been able to progress up the ladder of the French system with little to no issue both in and off the pitch. It will be interesting to see if that continues if/when they start pressing for inclusion in the professional ranks. If they do manage to get to at least the ProD2 level they could essentially blaze a pathway for teams from other nations to look to do similar in the future.

What they achieve is nice, but it's a huge lost of time.
I trully hope other countries will try to develop pro leagues by themselves.
Seriously, what's the point to play for years sunday players ? Servette had no opposition at all during many seasons, games had no interests ... it would have been more interesting for them to push for the creation of a Western pro league, with maybe Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, ... 6-8 clubs to start, this would have been great for the sport in these places. Not losing your time in french minor leagues (especially in Rhône Alpes where you have many levels).


Would it be a waste of time if they reach their goal and eventually make it into the professional ranks? A European pro league would be great but it's likely simpler for the more ambitious clubs to work their way through the French system at first. Perhaps if enough enter the system it could provide the impetus for them to go down that path.


Do you really think that hiring pro players to play in French 6 to 9-10 divisions is useful ? I don't think.
Yes maybe in 5 years they will be in Pro D2 (and I say maybe, as it's now that it will become difficult for them). And then what ? Their squad is full of outsider, I don't think they have generated any interest in Switzerland from now. They have lost 5-6 years.

Anyway, I don't think french federation will accept it anew. There was a massiv opposition against them by french clubs. Not so many of them like to see pro players destroying 100% amateur teams... and it's difficult for the FFR to put a team directly in Fédérale 3. So ... they are probably the last giving this opportunity (except a few clubs from Luxemburg, Monaco or Andorra maybe).

Of course a Euro Pro League is a long job. Do you think it would be longer than going to Pro D2 starting from back in France ? I don't.



Organising a European pro league isn't easy and it would cost a lot of money.


Servette has a chance to make the top level now while they didn't have to risk much in doing so.


The question going forward for them would be about JIFF players. Will they have to have mostly french qualified players or will an exception be made for them.


A 2nd professional league on the continent would be great but the money to achieve this very likely isn't there at present. The French system is the best option for any ambitious clubs looking to carve a path to professionalism and honestly, I think it's something the French system should embrace. I'm not suggesting the open the flood gates but 4-6 clubs from other countries certainly wouldn't hurt them.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby RugbyLiebe » Thu, 09 May 2019, 11:26

Do we actually know that France does indeed allow foreign clubs above a certain level? If I remember right, that was an argument for RC Luxembourg to change to Germany (must have been a quite low level back then).
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby germanbullsfan » Thu, 09 May 2019, 13:01

If this is the case , french rugby should declare this now to Servette , because now they are entering the Federale System were Things start to get serious.
But i think Genf is either a example or exception for FRR

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby 4N » Thu, 09 May 2019, 14:16

vino_93 wrote:
4N wrote:I wish rugby bosses in places like France and Italy would be more open-minded about foreign teams in their leagues. If you look at ice hockey, the Austrian league for example has teams from multiple countries. It certainly helps a club like Bolzano (Italy) out that they are able to join up with a league in a country where the sport is established at the professional level. Telling Switzerland they need to help set up a pro league when Geneva is on the French border seems like an unnecessary roadblock for the growth of the sport. And obviously if they get into Pro D2, playing at a large modern stadium with the backing of a soccer club (btw they have a pro hockey team as well), it will be big for the sport in Switzerland. I would guess their crowds have grown quite a bit already.


You can't compare Ice hockey with rugby, neither Austria to France.
Austria is a small country. Ice hockey is a difficult sport to develop as you need ice rinks, and big ones for Austrian leagues. There aren't enough of them in Austria, and no cities with the potential for. So to offer good oppositions, they needed outsiders.

Rugby is easy to develop ... You only need to convert football pitches. Here we have many of them, some not used anymore. Cities start to share big stadiums between both sports; or rugby clubs can take old football pitches when new modern ones are built.
Currently in France, you have 30 pro teams. Probably the same number in Fédérale who are looking for promotion in Pro D2 in short or medium term. Or maybe even more...
There's no need for outsiders. FFR priority is to develop the sport in the whole country. Same for the FIR.

So it's cool for Geneva to have this opportunity. I'm pretty sure that if in 5-10 years they reach Pro D2 it will work for them. And maybe for Swiss Rugby (who knows...).
But during the long time it takes them to reach that, they could have work on another development, with Germany and/or Benelux. A project more useful for the european rugby than thrashing for years amateur players with french pro guys.


I don’t think rinks are a big issue, there are also a number of Italian teams in the Austrian second division, some of them from small cities. Austria is a wealthy country and operated without foreign teams for decades, the decision to open up seems to be purely based on expansion.

You may not see it as the duty of the FFR or FIR (I would add Romania as well) but that’s the sort of thinking that prevents the sport from growing more than the lack of a Benelux-German league. Besides, LNR and FFR are not the same, just as the Premier Rugby and the RFU aren’t or MLR and USAR aren’t. Servette couldn’t join the LNR directly so had to start at the bottom. It’s not ideal I agree, but that’s how the system is currently. Maybe if France adds a third pro tier, they can allow teams to apply directly to join that.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby sk 88 » Thu, 09 May 2019, 19:21

When people talk about Servette should have tried to make the Swiss league pro or done a "Euro League" with Germany, Belgium & Netherlands how do we know they didn't try and conclude it was a pipe dream?

As for Swiss players, only a handful of any club's players actually come from that town. Its a very odd view that players must play for a local side or a club should have only local players. How many scousers play for Liverpool or locals play for Spurs? How many New Yorkers play for the Jets or Yankees?

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Fri, 10 May 2019, 10:29

4N wrote:
vino_93 wrote:
4N wrote:I wish rugby bosses in places like France and Italy would be more open-minded about foreign teams in their leagues. If you look at ice hockey, the Austrian league for example has teams from multiple countries. It certainly helps a club like Bolzano (Italy) out that they are able to join up with a league in a country where the sport is established at the professional level. Telling Switzerland they need to help set up a pro league when Geneva is on the French border seems like an unnecessary roadblock for the growth of the sport. And obviously if they get into Pro D2, playing at a large modern stadium with the backing of a soccer club (btw they have a pro hockey team as well), it will be big for the sport in Switzerland. I would guess their crowds have grown quite a bit already.


You can't compare Ice hockey with rugby, neither Austria to France.
Austria is a small country. Ice hockey is a difficult sport to develop as you need ice rinks, and big ones for Austrian leagues. There aren't enough of them in Austria, and no cities with the potential for. So to offer good oppositions, they needed outsiders.

Rugby is easy to develop ... You only need to convert football pitches. Here we have many of them, some not used anymore. Cities start to share big stadiums between both sports; or rugby clubs can take old football pitches when new modern ones are built.
Currently in France, you have 30 pro teams. Probably the same number in Fédérale who are looking for promotion in Pro D2 in short or medium term. Or maybe even more...
There's no need for outsiders. FFR priority is to develop the sport in the whole country. Same for the FIR.

So it's cool for Geneva to have this opportunity. I'm pretty sure that if in 5-10 years they reach Pro D2 it will work for them. And maybe for Swiss Rugby (who knows...).
But during the long time it takes them to reach that, they could have work on another development, with Germany and/or Benelux. A project more useful for the european rugby than thrashing for years amateur players with french pro guys.


I don’t think rinks are a big issue, there are also a number of Italian teams in the Austrian second division, some of them from small cities. Austria is a wealthy country and operated without foreign teams for decades, the decision to open up seems to be purely based on expansion.

You may not see it as the duty of the FFR or FIR (I would add Romania as well) but that’s the sort of thinking that prevents the sport from growing more than the lack of a Benelux-German league. Besides, LNR and FFR are not the same, just as the Premier Rugby and the RFU aren’t or MLR and USAR aren’t. Servette couldn’t join the LNR directly so had to start at the bottom. It’s not ideal I agree, but that’s how the system is currently. Maybe if France adds a third pro tier, they can allow teams to apply directly to join that.


Ice Rinks isn't the subject here, but yes it might be a problem. Knowing it very well, leaving in a "minor" ice hockey country.
EBEL needed stronger opposition for these teams, needed to grow in Central Europe, needed to generate more value to be seen as a Top League. They couldn't achieve that by their own austrian clubs, they needed strong outsiders. Austria is wealthy, but is small. Its 10th biggest city is less than 50K inhabitants. That's a small market to sustain more than 8 rich ice hockey clubs.
And don't forget too that we are talking here about a closed shop. French rugby isn't, and will never be.

LNR & FFR aren't the same, but they are linked. Promotion/Relegation from Pro D2 to Fédérale 1 is linked by agreements between both institutions. Some Pro D2 clubs are lobying to reduce it to only one, but FFR doesn't accept that.
Moreover, LNR can only exist because FFR delegates to it power. That's FFR which is imposing some rules, as the JIFF. If you can read french, here is the detail of their relationship : https://www.lnr.fr/sites/default/files/ ... 8-2023.pdf

A third pro tier isn't ready to be created I think. FFR tried to do that by lauching Fédérale 1 Elite, but it appears many clubs were still too unprofessionnal, lied about their real financial states, ... There is a huge risk to see clubs collapsing - as it already happened, and it's not sure if there's space for it, especially regarding TV rights. Moreover, I think FFR is happy to keep a good Fédérale 1 under its power. But you can play fully professionnal in Fédérale 1 if you want.

You are talking about growing the sport, I'm talking about it too when I said it's not up to FFR and FIR to do the job for Switzerland. They have to make the sport growing INSIDE their own country, their own territory of operations. North of France / South of Italy. Huuuuuge job to do there (FFR is in advance compare to FIR of course). When this will be done, maybe they will try to look for outsiders… if needed, which will probably not be the case.

Anyway, Servette is here, and I wish them all the best for their project, as they were given the opportunity to do it. It's starting to be interesting now (even if I think Fédérale 3 will be easy for them considering their current squad).

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby Raven » Fri, 10 May 2019, 11:50

vino_93 wrote:Anyway, Servette is here, and I wish them all the best for their project, as they were given the opportunity to do it. It's starting to be interesting now (even if I think Fédérale 3 will be easy for them considering their current squad).


This is basically what we all wanted to hear I think as we cheer for them going up! haha.

And a Pro League with BE-NE-LUX-GER-CH teams involved sounds awesome in principle, but very difficult to achieve logistically; I don´t think there would be enough interest other than us here! :lol:

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Fri, 10 May 2019, 12:11

Raven wrote:
vino_93 wrote:Anyway, Servette is here, and I wish them all the best for their project, as they were given the opportunity to do it. It's starting to be interesting now (even if I think Fédérale 3 will be easy for them considering their current squad).


This is basically what we all wanted to hear I think as we cheer for them going up! haha.

And a Pro League with BE-NE-LUX-GER-CH teams involved sounds awesome in principle, but very difficult to achieve logistically; I don´t think there would be enough interest other than us here! :lol:


And if Servette ever were to make it as far as the Top 14 that would drive interest in the game in Switzerland and potentially provide a pathway for young Swiss players both current and in the future to pursue the opportunity to play the game at a higher level. I actually see Servette making their way in the French system as a pretty big endorsement of it.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Fri, 10 May 2019, 12:39

Raven wrote:
vino_93 wrote:Anyway, Servette is here, and I wish them all the best for their project, as they were given the opportunity to do it. It's starting to be interesting now (even if I think Fédérale 3 will be easy for them considering their current squad).


This is basically what we all wanted to hear I think as we cheer for them going up! haha.

And a Pro League with BE-NE-LUX-GER-CH teams involved sounds awesome in principle, but very difficult to achieve logistically; I don´t think there would be enough interest other than us here! :lol:


Well, that's less crazy than MLR or south american League !
And considering that German clubs would be mostly west based (Heidelberg, Frankfurt, Pforzheim, Hannover if you look at the big names these last seasons), that makes it even less. In fact, that's not bigger than going from Lille to Marseille.

I don't know. I think in these countries there are a few clubs who have a good semi pro setups, and who might be looking for another thing than poor local opposition. Opposition generates value, local peuple coule be interested, you could start showing it on TV, ...

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Fri, 10 May 2019, 12:45

Working Class Rugger wrote:
Raven wrote:
vino_93 wrote:Anyway, Servette is here, and I wish them all the best for their project, as they were given the opportunity to do it. It's starting to be interesting now (even if I think Fédérale 3 will be easy for them considering their current squad).


This is basically what we all wanted to hear I think as we cheer for them going up! haha.

And a Pro League with BE-NE-LUX-GER-CH teams involved sounds awesome in principle, but very difficult to achieve logistically; I don´t think there would be enough interest other than us here! :lol:


And if Servette ever were to make it as far as the Top 14 that would drive interest in the game in Switzerland and potentially provide a pathway for young Swiss players both current and in the future to pursue the opportunity to play the game at a higher level. I actually see Servette making their way in the French system as a pretty big endorsement of it.


Wait wait wait... It's a long time to go to the Top 14. Long long long time. It's not even sure they will reach Pro D2, so Top 14... That's another story. Many things can happen during this time, especially financially.

And about the effect on the Swiss game, that's another story too. For example the Dragons Catalans have more or less no mediatic impact in France. XIII is still a minor local sport despite the Dragons being a top club. There's a huge gap between achieving great results and converting them to national popularity.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby Raven » Fri, 10 May 2019, 12:52

Working Class Rugger wrote:And if Servette ever were to make it as far as the Top 14 that would drive interest in the game in Switzerland and potentially provide a pathway for young Swiss players both current and in the future to pursue the opportunity to play the game at a higher level. I actually see Servette making their way in the French system as a pretty big endorsement of it.

Imagining Servette in Top 14 is a wild dream, but thinking of the club as a pathway for many Swiss players is a wilder one it would be as good as a pathway for Swiss youngsters as Cardiff or Swansea City are for Welsh Football...limited and tied to results, ending up on a lot more foreign players rather than Swiss National ones. But it may help Swiss Rugby with more exposure and the apparition of more players at grassroots rugby which is important too.
Bottom line is rugby is currently growing quite fast in European countries where it was not very popular via TV/other media, Olympic Games = 7s programmes, etc. To have a Swiss professional set up is a massive achievement, not something everybody can brag about and certainly a tool that if used right can be of great benefit.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Fri, 10 May 2019, 14:10

Raven wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:And if Servette ever were to make it as far as the Top 14 that would drive interest in the game in Switzerland and potentially provide a pathway for young Swiss players both current and in the future to pursue the opportunity to play the game at a higher level. I actually see Servette making their way in the French system as a pretty big endorsement of it.

Imagining Servette in Top 14 is a wild dream, but thinking of the club as a pathway for many Swiss players is a wilder one it would be as good as a pathway for Swiss youngsters as Cardiff or Swansea City are for Welsh Football...limited and tied to results, ending up on a lot more foreign players rather than Swiss National ones. But it may help Swiss Rugby with more exposure and the apparition of more players at grassroots rugby which is important too.
Bottom line is rugby is currently growing quite fast in European countries where it was not very popular via TV/other media, Olympic Games = 7s programmes, etc. To have a Swiss professional set up is a massive achievement, not something everybody can brag about and certainly a tool that if used right can be of great benefit.

They are currently using many frenchs/outsiders in their first team, in a level where they don't need it. So I do agree with you...
Anyway it seems they want to develop youth game. And they will need it to be pro, as you need an approved youth training center. So of course they can take french guys, but poaching local Swiss would be more interesting for their local popularity / support.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby gambass » Mon, 13 May 2019, 10:01

Before going too far away in fantasy land (or is it too late ?). It's worth remembering, that Oyonnax played in Geneva a european cup match two years ago. It was a failure, with basically no locals showing up:

https://www.letemps.ch/sport/lessai-man ... ais-geneve (in french)

Back in the days, Bourgoin played also one or two matches there with no more succes iirc.

It's also worth keeping in mind, that due to the cost of living and the fact that they will have to import virtually 100% of their players from now on, the cost of the team will be much higher than the ones of their adversaries.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby vino_93 » Mon, 13 May 2019, 10:36

And a few datas about money :
- going to Pro D2 costs a few millions euros (2-3)
- not being relegated will cost around 5-7 millions
- playing promotion, around 10
- not being relegated around 20
- playing first places, between 25 to 35 ...

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby 4N » Mon, 13 May 2019, 10:47

gambass wrote:Before going too far away in fantasy land (or is it too late ?). It's worth remembering, that Oyonnax played in Geneva a european cup match two years ago. It was a failure, with basically no locals showing up:

https://www.letemps.ch/sport/lessai-man ... ais-geneve (in french)

Back in the days, Bourgoin played also one or two matches there with no more succes iirc.



Did you even read the link? It talks about administrative difficulties and mentions that there was only one week to promote the Oyonnax match. And mentions the 18k crowd that turned up for Bourgoin vs Munster.

But Servette is a local club with an established local following so an entirely different case obviously.

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Re: Servette Genf Rugby

Postby Raven » Wed, 22 May 2019, 07:37

So Servette´s run of winning games came to an end after losing (26-29) to RS Mauvezinoise this past Sunday.

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