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South American rugby

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Re: South American rugby

Postby Tobar » Thu, 20 Dec 2018, 17:59

TheStroBro wrote:
Tobar wrote:Currie Cup is a 2 month competition, most that it would cost is housing for the players I imagine. I don’t think that most would get paid much to be there anyway.

Yeah, but since LSR is partially owned by the Unions this would definitely eat into any of the Argentine budget...if this thing even happens.


Of course it would, I’m aware of that. Just saying that entering the Currie Cup may not be as expensive as you’d think. I imagine that these players would also be involved in LSR so it’d be like an “all star” team.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Thu, 20 Dec 2018, 18:55

The question is for how long time Pampas XV will exist.

I defended this previously, that in the paper it is good as Currie Cup's calendar does not clash with LSR. However, the question is how is now UAR's budget to make all those teams work.
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Re: South American rugby

Postby Rugga » Thu, 20 Dec 2018, 19:32

When’s LSR meant to start?

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Thu, 20 Dec 2018, 19:41

Last week of January 2020.
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Re: South American rugby

Postby Tobar » Thu, 20 Dec 2018, 19:58

victorsra wrote:The question is for how long time Pampas XV will exist.

I defended this previously, that in the paper it is good as Currie Cup's calendar does not clash with LSR. However, the question is how is now UAR's budget to make all those teams work.


They better hope they can make some money from LSR then. Where are the proposed teams going to be (if they have picked somewhere)? Are they doing regional kind of teams or just picking from all over?

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Thu, 20 Dec 2018, 21:54

No news.
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Re: South American rugby

Postby NaBUru38 » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 13:02

Unions are now busy with preparations for 2019. There's plenty of time to prepare the South American League.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 14:30

Not that much. They have 13 months now until the kickoff. It is not plenty time. It is still just ok. They need to find owners, partners, sponsors, where teams would be based... If they are still debating how which countries will take part we have a already a problem.
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Re: South American rugby

Postby carbonero » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 16:44

Podcast with Daniel Hourcade > https://audioboom.com/posts/7122092-xv- ... l-hourcade

He confirmed some of the tidbits that were floating around. Chile, Colombia and Paraguay will start their HP programs in 2019. LAR is still scheduled for February 2020. Paraguay has their own franchise but no more than five local players will feature the first season.

Colombia won’t be part of this first iteration of LAR but Hourcade raved about their development. He said that in ten years they will “eat” their regional competition bar Argentina citing the mass appeal of the sport, the increase from 3.200 to 17.000 players in just eight years, the good level he saw while coaching Sudamerica XV and the proactivity of their management. For example, he recommended the creation of a short tournament outside of club rugby to give elite players better competition. I don’t have the details but Hourcade said that Colombia responded creating a 12 round franchise competition for seniors, women and youth rugby.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby Tobar » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 17:48

carbonero wrote:Podcast with Daniel Hourcade > https://audioboom.com/posts/7122092-xv- ... l-hourcade

He confirmed some of the tidbits that were floating around. Chile, Colombia and Paraguay will start their HP programs in 2019. LAR is still scheduled for February 2020. Paraguay has their own franchise but no more than five local players will feature the first season.

Colombia won’t be part of this first iteration of LAR but Hourcade raved about their development. He said that in ten years they will “eat” their regional competition bar Argentina citing the mass appeal of the sport, the increase from 3.200 to 17.000 players in just eight years, the good level he saw while coaching Sudamerica XV and the proactivity of their management. For example, he recommended the creation of a short tournament outside of club rugby to give elite players better competition. I don’t have the details but Hourcade said that Colombia responded creating a 12 round franchise competition for seniors, women and youth rugby.


Colombia has made terrific strides and I'm proud of the grit they're showing. I have no idea to what lengths the game will grow but FCR is doing a terrific job in growing the sport and getting awareness for it in a country that only cares about football, football, football and cycling. The majority of their focus has been around Medellin since that's where their best players are but cities like Barranquilla are making great strides (FWIW, Quilla has almost as many senior clubs as NYC). They also have a very active social media which is pretty important for a developing nation and in Colombia everything is run through Instagram (restaurants, stores, etc. all use it as their websites).

I think the tournament you're referring to is Super 20 (for men) which is the nationwide competition for the best clubs. Gatos RC beat Duendes RC, both from Medellin and have players like Juan Manuel Diosa (Gatos) and Sebastian Mejia Gil (Duendes) who are captains of the national team. It's a very top heavy competition but still very good to see a competition for the whole country.

Did he discuss what exactly the HP programs for Chile, Colombia and Paraguay will entail?

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Re: South American rugby

Postby carbonero » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 18:20

Tobar wrote:I think the tournament you're referring to is Super 20 (for men...

Hourcade said it was a brand new tournament. The Super 20 was already in place when he signed with Sudamerica Rugby.

Tobar wrote:Did he discuss what exactly the HP programs for Chile, Colombia and Paraguay will entail?

No details. Hourcade oversaw the HP program of the UAR and the URU. The framework was pretty basic. Securing extra training for the players during the first years, while also granting them some benefits (stipend, scholarship, insurance, discounts, etc.). And later finding some sort of intermediate competition above amateur rugby.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby Tobar » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 19:07

Oh really, a new tournament? That’s interesting. I’d like to see a smaller group of the top teams playing against each other, home and away. You could do top 6 in the country based on results from Super 20 with a final in the Cincuentenario (home stadium for ARCh in Medellin). You can have 3 matches all in the same day with the 1v2 as the final one.

As for HP, I figured it would just be like what URU/BR are doing but was curious if he gave specifics. Since the best players are all in Medellin, Bogota or even Cucuta it makes it pretty easy to pick a place for the program. Medellin is the home of rugby so it’d probably just be there. Then it’d make sense for players from the HP program to be part of the LSR and the stipends could go towards their salaries there.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Fri, 21 Dec 2018, 23:41

Some good developments in South America. Glad to hear the pro league is still on schedule for 2020. Excellent to hear about the High Performance program for Chile, Paraguay and Columbia, this type of program seems to be showing signs of success with other nations so good to see it adopted.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby carbonero » Fri, 28 Dec 2018, 19:39

Chile published their calendar for next season > https://www.chilerugby.org/wp-content/u ... c.jaz_.pdf

- Two test matches projected for June. Some sort of combine for the LAR during November
- Montevideo will host the qualifier for the 2019 Trophy in March and the qualifier for the 2020 Trophy in November
- Men’s Olympic qualifiers in Chile from June 27 to July 1
- Women’s Olympic qualifiers in Lima from May 30 to June 3. There will be another event in Córdoba early in the year.
- Sudamerica Rugby doubled their U18 competitions. They also included two sevens tournaments for the women

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Re: South American rugby

Postby Tobar » Fri, 28 Dec 2018, 21:34

Chilean Marcelo Torrealba signs with Austin MLR team.

https://www.austineliterugby.com/single ... lite-Rugby

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Re: South American rugby

Postby Canalina » Tue, 01 Jan 2019, 06:54

Paraguayan flyhalf Sergio Alvarenga is the best drop-man in 2018, having scored 3 drop goals in test matches: two versus Mexico and one versus Argentina XV (Espn Scrum gives him three drop goals against Mexico but the match reports unanimously say it was two penalty kicks and two drop goals). No one in the World did the same.
(The photo below is related to a man-of-the-match prize; I think unfortunately no one will award him as "Drop-man 2018")

Image

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Tue, 01 Jan 2019, 12:22

Yes, it is a vídeo we did when Paraguay beat Brazil in Bento Gonçalves, 2015.
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Re: South American rugby

Postby carbonero » Thu, 10 Jan 2019, 18:57

There is some movement around LAR. Apparently, the league headquarters will be in Sao Paulo. They are starting to hire > https://ww2.brasilrugby.com.br/blogs/ne ... nistrativo

The logo also looks familiar. They can’t be that lazy.

Also, some rumblings from Argentina > https://twitter.com/SergioEGomez/status ... 9465238528

Córdoba has the support of their provincial government, the private sector and a football club to enter the tender process. He also reports that Chile not Uruguay will have two franchises but that can be a simple mix-up.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Fri, 11 Jan 2019, 01:28

Yes, it is true. I've just confirmed that LAR's HQs will be in São Paulo.

That logo is a provisional one. They will do a new.
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Re: South American rugby

Postby NaBUru38 » Fri, 11 Jan 2019, 22:55

The logo is the least of my concerns.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby carbonero » Wed, 16 Jan 2019, 21:48

Tucuman confirms interest in joining the league. However, the last part of the press release states that they still don’t know the requirements to acquire a franchise > http://www.cordobaxv.com.ar/la-union-de ... americana/

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Wed, 16 Jan 2019, 22:56

Córdoba and Tucumán would be great.

Do you believe there is more enthusiasm for the provincial teams in Tucumán and Córdoba than in Rosario and Buenos Aires?

BTW, in late March, after the ARC, our podcast Mesa Oval will be with Agustin Danza to talk about the league, Don't miss ;)
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Re: South American rugby

Postby carbonero » Thu, 17 Jan 2019, 01:49

It’s hard to gauge enthusiasm because 99% of the rugby scene is finding out just now about the league. Expect some sort of backlash from the clubs.

Tucumán was always the best supported provincial side. They even played their matches in football stadiums. The interest has waned dramatically in the last decade but the league could reignite the fire. Cordoba and Rosario are not very different from each other. I think Córdoba will get the nod because they have a deeper player pool and better air connectivity. Buenos Aires won’t get near it.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby Tobar » Thu, 17 Jan 2019, 02:32

I wonder if down the road Argentina could have professional provincial teams similar to Ireland. More importantly, I wonder if this is feasible, assuming the league is successful of course.

Edit: I didn’t realize there were 23 provinces....maybe if there was promotion and relegation.

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Re: South American rugby

Postby victorsra » Thu, 17 Jan 2019, 13:21

And the political provinces are different from the rugby provinces... there are 25 rugby unions in Argentina. Some political provinces are merged in rugby, like Nordeste = Chaco + Corrientes. Others are split, like Santa Fe Province, split in Santa Fe and Rosario unions.

Buenos Aires Province for exemple has both realities: it is split in 4 rugby unions, that are also merged with other areas - URBA (federal district + surrounds of the Buenos Aires metropolitan region + La Plata) , Mar del Plata (the east), Sur (Bahia Blanca region + La Pampa province) and Oeste (the rural centre-west).


About Córdoba vs Rosario, they have more or less the same size (right?), but it is interesting how Rosario is much more successful in football (Rosario Central and Newell's Old Boys have more success than any cordobese club...) while Córdoba has a pretty strong basketball history (the mighty Atenas) + their rugby provincial team is way more successful than Rosario's. However, Rosario rugby clubs aren't behind Cordoba's, as Duendes has more national titles and there has always been Atletico playing URBA's tournaments...
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