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Italy vs Georgia

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby 4N » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 18:12

Polledri is good :thumbup:

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Canalina » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 20:16

https://1tv.ge/en/news/georgia-defeated-italy-rugby/
"The Georgian rugby team has already played against Italy four times. All matches resulted in favor of Italy."

Just a mistake? Or what is referring to?
I knew Italy and Georgia matches just one time previously

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Canalina » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 20:17

HL, in georgian


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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby oldprussians » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 21:40

I thought the Georgians played with amazing heart ..but Glen Jackson and all the officials were so concerned with n[ot being seen as bias to the Tier 1 team that they really went overboard. .both Georgian trys were gifts the 1st was a triple movement and the second was gift penalty try for an early tackle that in real time Jackson didn't give. And if it was we are talking split second. Having said that Italy were very nervous and butchered 3 try scoring opportunities. .but job done

@Hernan14

I find the anti Italian feeling that some Argentinian like come up with very strange. Most Italian fans support Argentine as their second team due to many Italians being in Argentina...all with Italian passports I might add.

Maybe they still feel bitter about the best 2 Argentine born players playing for Italy.... Dominguez and Parisse.

Anyhow well done Georgia you are not far off...

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Armchair Fan » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 22:09

I don't think if was a gifted penalty try. As rules are right now, it is what it is. Tough for anybody suffering it, but...

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby dans » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 22:27

oldprussians wrote:I thought the Georgians played with amazing heart ...


I agree...it wasn't a bad result. Georgia can play better, but so do Italy.
On a different day it could have ended the other way around. It proves the gap isn't that big and with more tests like these, a win against tier 1 oposition will come.
There is plenty of depth in Georgian rugby at the moment that will ensure their future. It will come a time when they'll need to deliver or they'll be forever at the door of 6N.
I was surprised their forward play made so many mistakes and I don't think were convincing in the scrum today...I say it was about confidence and believe and you get that by playing upwards more frequently.
The Italians definetly played their percentage game better, more patient, simpler, with less mistakes and were a match in the scrum...
I don't think they were shinning but was enough to build a big enough gap for the end... The game did feel like there was a meaning to the match...good watch:)

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby oldprussians » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 23:21

dans wrote:
oldprussians wrote:I thought the Georgians played with amazing heart ...


I agree...it wasn't a bad result. Georgia can play better, but so do Italy.
On a different day it could have ended the other way around. It proves the gap isn't that big and with more tests like these, a win against tier 1 oposition will come.
There is plenty of depth in Georgian rugby at the moment that will ensure their future. It will come a time when they'll need to deliver or they'll be forever at the door of 6N.
I was surprised their forward play made so many mistakes and I don't think were convincing in the scrum today...I say it was about confidence and believe and you get that by playing upwards more frequently.
The Italians definetly played their percentage game better, more patient, simpler, with less mistakes and were a match in the scrum...
I don't think they were shinning but was enough to build a big enough gap for the end... The game did feel like there was a meaning to the match...good watch:)


Not sure Georgia were ever going to win..

Yes maybe Georgia have a small margin of improvement... but so could Italy.. a big one

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Ainsthrilln » Sat, 10 Nov 2018, 23:31

Canalina wrote:https://1tv.ge/en/news/georgia-defeated-italy-rugby/
"The Georgian rugby team has already played against Italy four times. All matches resulted in favor of Italy."

Just a mistake? Or what is referring to?
I knew Italy and Georgia matches just one time previously


According to some previews, there was a game played in 2000 against Italia XV, that I understand was not an official test match.

Stat watch

- Italy beat Georgia 31-22 in their last meeting in Asti in 2003.
- Three years earlier an Italy XV got the better of Georgia in a 51-7 win in Livorno.

https://www.sixnationsrugby.com/mobile/en/news/33628.php

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Scoob » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 03:01

Not the result Georgia wanted,but they didnt disgrace themselves either.
The scrums were a mess the whole game, so neither got an advantage there.

Georgia's lineouts went well,Bregvadze had solid game. Cheishvili played well at lock,his time at Cornish pirates is paying off as he is hugely improved. Lasha lomidze still doesnt know what position he should be playing.
The loose forwards played pretty well. Beka Gorgodze is a very good prospect. Lobjhanidze had a good game,his form was way better than his last few appearances and looked a lot sharper. Khmaladze struggled and must be under serious pressure from Abzhandadze for a starting spot.Abzhandadze has a far better kicking game,excellent speed off the mark and his passing is definitely better.He maybe 19,but hes the best you got. The centres played well,Mtchedlidze was possibly there best player,passed and tackled well and scored a barnstorming try. Koshadze didnt see much off the ball,Haig clearly rates him highly. Matiashvili was solid,would have liked to see him take the line on with his quick feet a bit more.Dzneladze was unseen,probably not his best position. Kvesiladze came on second half and played well,best suited in the centres but has a good turn off pace for a big guy.
Overall promising signs that different style that Haig and co are trying to play is starting to be seen.
I would keep the same team for the next match,except have Sichinava replace Dzneladze and Abzhandadze replace Khmaladze.

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Tobar » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 03:28

dans wrote:
oldprussians wrote:I thought the Georgians played with amazing heart ...


I agree...it wasn't a bad result. Georgia can play better, but so do Italy.
On a different day it could have ended the other way around. It proves the gap isn't that big and with more tests like these, a win against tier 1 oposition will come.
There is plenty of depth in Georgian rugby at the moment that will ensure their future. It will come a time when they'll need to deliver or they'll be forever at the door of 6N.
I was surprised their forward play made so many mistakes and I don't think were convincing in the scrum today...I say it was about confidence and believe and you get that by playing upwards more frequently.
The Italians definetly played their percentage game better, more patient, simpler, with less mistakes and were a match in the scrum...
I don't think they were shinning but was enough to build a big enough gap for the end... The game did feel like there was a meaning to the match...good watch:)


At the end of the day, what matters most to me is that Georgia is able to be involved in and host more Tier 1 rugby matches. I don't care if it's Six Nations, RWC, whatever. You guys are hosting Scotland next year which is great. Hosting a premier match like that should be able to easily sell out Dinamo Stadium and fetch a good price for the union. More matches like that will only result in greater funding to support the sport in the country. When was the lat time Georgia hosted a tier 1 nation?

Also, not going to lie but Georgia seems like the perfect location for some 6 Nations matches (at least if it wasn't so far). It just seems like an awesome environment to go to and watch some rugby and drink some beers. I'd love to go one day.

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby victorsra » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 04:09

Good result for both countries we can say. Is it a chance to see it in Tbilisi?
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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby thatrugbyguy » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 04:28

Georgia needs Romania, Spain and at least Russia to reach the level they have before serious 6N discussion can happen. We'll know where Russia stands next year. The other two somehow need to get access to T1 games, Romania especially. France use to play Romania regularly, almost yearly I think, after the 5 Nations up until the early 2000's. They really need to make a proposal to the FFR to make this happen again.

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 16:17

Anthem singing and watching sponsored by ICY beer
If said and spelled in Georgian -- აისი (aisi)) means "Dawn"

(( I've proposed it as a local ice hockey franchise name about 10 years ago
აისი თბილისი -- Icy Tbilisi ))


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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 16:51

ABOUT past tests

By World Rugby tradition each country decides itself
what is a test for it, and for what to award a cap

According to GEO stats, it played 4 tests vs ITA

http://site.rugby.ge/ka-GE/2018-SHEMO-H2H/

(( trans lettered and edited a bit ))

saqarTvelo 0-4 italia

4 games [4 away] total 60:141 try-count 5/19

1998 11/04 lakvila 14:31 1/5
2000 26/01 livorno 07:51 1/6
2003 06/09 asti 22:31 1/4
2018 10/11 florencia 17:28 2/4

but ITA for its hyper-arrogant attitude
does not treat 1998 and 2000 games as tests

Good on them :!:

We hope one day they change their mind
and award those missing caps to their lads,

for

1) 1998 was a RWC qualifier after all and
Italy awarded caps vs RUS which finished lower than GEO in the same pool

2) 2000 was a warmup before ITA 6N debut

ITA fielded exactly the same XV that beat SCO a week later
and they were aided by Italian REF -- main reason for the blowout

May be many of you did NOT know those details
but we are keen to recall them

ITA managed to avoid GEO for full 15 years = living spell of a generation
and ALL those 4 tests were played in ITA -- not a single one in GEO

:::

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby oldprussians » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 17:42

Have all forgotten when Italy A beat the Georgia 1st team?

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Armchair Fan » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 18:02

oldprussians wrote:Have all forgotten when Italy A beat the Georgia 1st team?

Have a look at the team Georgia fielded in 2015 Tbilisi Cup and the one fielded in 2015 RWC. Let's be honest about 'first team' claim.

All explanations have already been given thousands of times regarding that game and tournament.

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 18:20

We also count ITA'A as tests separately
'cause they are T1 nation and we are neither ashamed not arrogant
albeit bar two occasion never fielded strongest lineup vs those A's

same source >> http://site.rugby.ge/ka-GE/2018-SHEMO-H2H/
GEO 3-3 ITA'A | aggregate P 6 [2H 1A 3N] 101:88 T 12/5

:::

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Canalina » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 18:32

Just to add to the stats, Italy lead 5-0 also on the Continental Shield

The Tbilisi Caucasians lost twice with Rovigo on autumn 2014
Batumi lost with Rovigo and Viadana last year
Locomotive lost with Calvisano in the current edition

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 19:05

You are right -- all those games went to wire
and decided by tiny | meager margins:
pls, post the scores and then sum them

But NONE of those results
could mask FIR's utterly wrong attitude --

when you are playing a Nation
simply show enough respect to it
and give caps to your OWN players

Imagine NZL now doing the same as
your Federation acted in 1998 and 2000

On the other hand, there are many instances
when caps were given retrospectively --
eg by Australia when QLD RU was shut in 1920s

Even world | olympic titles and medals are awarded lately
when people realize they were not given at the time

Pls correct your wrongs ... before GEO beats ITA one day --
judging by Uxx results the writing is on the wall

:::

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby dans » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 19:15

thatrugbyguy wrote:Georgia needs Romania, Spain and at least Russia to reach the level they have before serious 6N discussion can happen. We'll know where Russia stands next year. .....


Yeap...I think we can add Germany here after today's game ...they need a good show next week against Canada and they have a chance...
If they keep a full strength team next year, they won't be a pushover for any of the teams in REC...

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Canalina » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 21:09

FLIDTA RISXVA wrote:You are right -- all those games went to wire
and decided by tiny | meager margins:
pls, post the scores and then sum them

But NONE of those results
could mask FIR's utterly wrong attitude --

when you are playing a Nation
simply show enough respect to it
and give caps to your OWN players

Imagine NZL now doing the same as
your Federation acted in 1998 and 2000

On the other hand, there are many instances
when caps were given retrospectively --
eg by Australia when QLD RU was shut in 1920s

Even world | olympic titles and medals are awarded lately
when people realize they were not given at the time

Pls correct your wrongs ... before GEO beats ITA one day --
judging by Uxx results the writing is on the wall

:::

Not totally agree about this.
It's true that it's a bit unfair versus the opponent team not conceding caps when the other team do it, but on the other hand a too much large concession of caps could lead to a devaluation of the caps themselves.
I mean: let's suppose, with an extreme example, that Italian rugby national team play a friendly match with San Marino. Of course San Marino would award caps, should Italy do the same even if probably the azzurri would field a sort of Serie B U23 select?
Yes, to not act disrespectfully toward San Marino.
No, to not act disrespectfully toward the value of the cap.
If at the end of the carrier I have twenty caps because I have played so many times in Nations Cup with Emerging Italy versus Uruguay, Chile and Portugal (no offense, of course) and you have "just" four caps because you played with the main team versus New Zealand, England, Wales and South Africa, you would be not too happy to hear that I have more caps than you.
So maybe Italy was selfish not awarding caps in those "A team" matches versus Georgia, or maybe they was just rigorous

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby TheStroBro » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 21:48

FLIDTA RISXVA wrote:You are right -- all those games went to wire
and decided by tiny | meager margins:
pls, post the scores and then sum them

But NONE of those results
could mask FIR's utterly wrong attitude --

when you are playing a Nation
simply show enough respect to it
and give caps to your OWN players

Imagine NZL now doing the same as
your Federation acted in 1998 and 2000

On the other hand, there are many instances
when caps were given retrospectively --
eg by Australia when QLD RU was shut in 1920s

Even world | olympic titles and medals are awarded lately
when people realize they were not given at the time

Pls correct your wrongs ... before GEO beats ITA one day --
judging by Uxx results the writing is on the wall

:::


So are you saying that all those years in the PNC and Churchill Cup New Zealand, Ireland, and Englands shouldn't have sent their 'A' teams and we should have capped our players? What a load of dung mate, just because you decided to give them Caps means nothing.

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby 4N » Sun, 11 Nov 2018, 21:55

FR probably knows more about caps (especially as they relate to T2) than anyone here. Just sayin.

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Mon, 12 Nov 2018, 08:10

TheStroBro

It's up to your Union whether to award caps vs NZL'A

Albeit it seems to me that NZL'A would have been much stronger than
any of Home Union 'true national sides' visiting NA during Lions tour summers

I'm just highlighting the fact that both in 1998 and 2000
ITA fielded their strongest possible teams vs GEO
but for some vague reason they treated us rugby minnows
and do NOT recognize those two games as tests to these days

I agree: this is their divine right as it's yours not to respect NZL'A
but I reiterate that it was stupid and unfair not to cap players
in a RWC 1999 Qualifier against eventual runner-ups of the pool
whereas reward participants of game vs 4th placed team of the same comp

(( ITA 4-0, GEO 3-1, CRO 2-2, RUS 1-3, DNK 0-4 ))

(( Yes, I guess why -- ITA had bad record vs SOV and needed to improve it vs RUS
whilst GEO were seen as temporary success -- does not this sound short-sighted ? ))

And in 2000 the very same XV that beat SCO did not get caps for trouncing GEO

What do you call this -- double standards | pragmatism :?:

I just advocate to right those wrongs done by arrogant past administrators

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Re: Italy vs Georgia

Postby Bogdan_DC » Mon, 12 Nov 2018, 09:19

I think the reason is plain simple: they were afraid of Georgia and put an "A" after their name to keep appearances in case they lose. Wales or Ireland did exactly the same against Romania in 70-80s.

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