Tier 2 & 3 Rugby Forum

Major League Rugby

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 01:19

For sure. I guess the reason SR and Wales opted to scrap the geography was their wish to overcome local rivalries.

Wellington Hurricanes would "exclude" people from Hawke's Bay. "Otago" Highlanders would exclude Southland fans. Neath-Swansea Ospreys (the original name) would exclude Aberavon fans, while Neath fans wouldn't like to cheer for a team called "Swansea" and vice versa. And so on.

Maybe they thought, "look, many soccer clubs don't have geographical names, so it's fine". Arsenal, Celtic, Rangers, Juventus, Real Sociedad, Palmeiras, Corinthians, Vasco da Gama, Cruzeiro, Velez Sarsfield, Nacional, Colo-Colo, Cruz Azul, Al-Ahly, etc.... or are too generic, like Espanyol, River Plate or America.. or their name refer only to neighbourhoods that many people might not know, like Tottenham, Chelsea, Aston Villa, Schalke, Benfica, Galatasaray, Flamengo, Botafogo, Boca Juniors, San Lorenzo de Almagro, Peñarol... but soccer is too big, too popular, those clubs were born a century or more ago and draw big crowds very quickly, therefore they never realy needed to care about names. They quickly became famous with fans from all over their countries and abroad.

Rugby I do agree needs geography.
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 84
Joined: Sun, 05 Feb 2017, 15:38
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Higgik » Sat, 30 May 2020, 02:02

thatrugbyguy wrote:I've always felt that team nicknames should reflect the place where the team comes from. In Super Rugby the Waratahs are named after the state's flower, the Brumbies are named after the wild horses that once roamed the area, the Reds are named after their states colours, and the Rebels are named after the Eurkea Rebellion from the 1850's. The Western Force however was completely manufactured.

The problem with rugby's naming conventions though at the moments extend beyond whatever the hell MLR are currently doing. In Super Rugby the teams no longer have geographical descriptions in their name, which to me wa one of the stupidest decisions to ever make. You cannot build fans, nor rivalries, if people don't know where the Sharks or Crusaders are from. Same with Ospreys, I still have no idea where in Wales they are located. RUNY and Rugby ATL are coming from the same place. Give the teams locations for crying out loud, I shouldn't have to open Google maps to find them.

But RUNY has NY in the name, so pretty famous initials across the whole world, while ATL is the recognised 3 letter code in the US for Atlanta.
Agree with the other 3 though. They should have a territory name. Reasoning behind It is to try and get more fans in a very tribal sport. Swansea Ospreys would lose Neath fans. Glamorgan Ospreys would have been good but Cardiff would have moaned with the Blues.
In Wales, I would have had Western Dragons (instead of link with Llanelli), Glamorgan Ospreys, Cardiff Blues, Gwent Steelers (New name New start for team in Newport). In SA name them after the cities or the province.

User avatar
Posts: 3209
Joined: Wed, 30 Apr 2014, 16:57

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby 4N » Sat, 30 May 2020, 02:27

Yeah ATL is pretty recognizable here, although maybe not as much for overseas fans. Not sure if the RUNY name would be immediately identified as New York. I don’t think it’s a good name either way though. Sounds like it was what they settled on when the first 35 choices were unavailable.

Posts: 886
Joined: Thu, 12 Dec 2019, 21:26
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 30 May 2020, 02:41

Welsh pro teams:

Scarlets (formerly Llanelli Scarlets, formerly Llanelli) is based in the small Carmarthenshire town of Llanelli. Before regional rugby Llanelli already was the de facto regional team of Carmarthenshire / Dyfed.

Ospreys (formerly Neath-Swansea Ospreys) was formed by merging Swansea and Neath. The hope was that the combined team would combine both sets of fans. Attendance figures suggest that has been a success. Average attendances before Ospreys; Swansea 3k, Neath 4k. Ospreys average attendances now 7k. The trouble is they play in Swansea City's 21k seater soccer stadium. The problem with that stadium is it's in Swansea, it looks like a football stadium and when Ospreys play it's 2 thirds empty. There are now discussions to build a 10k seater stadium in Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot.

Blues (formerly Cardiff Blues, formerly Cardiff)

Dragons (formerly Newport-Gwent Dragons, formerly Newport). The name of the Newport-Gwent Dragons used to bother me. Newport is a town, Gwent is a county. This would be like renaming Liverpool FC as Liverpool-Merseyside Unicorns. It's just rubbish. Dragons is a better name, but the fans are all Newport supporters.

Posts: 5830
Joined: Sat, 05 Jul 2014, 02:44
National Flag:
AustraliaAustralia

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Sat, 30 May 2020, 02:52

I understand the perspective that you risk alienating fans if the Hurricanes or the Highlanders or whoever limit themselves to a single location, but there's value in tribalism as well. NSW and Queensland should be the biggest match on the domestic Super Rugby calendar each year, and yet it passes by without barely anyone noticing. Switch to rugby league's State of Origin and it's nothing but New South Wales vs Queensland. When a team doesn't have a proper identity all you ever get are people who take a luke warm interest in the sport. Frankly, if the Hurricanes revert to Wellington and that alienates the people of Hawkes Bay, Manawatu or the other unions associated with the team, then they aren't really interested in Hurricanes in the first place. You're better off having it be Wellington vs Auckland, or Swansea vs Cardiff, or Queensland vs New South Wales, or New York vs Atlanta than nondescript names.

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 03:00

I don't have any data to tell, but I'm not sure if they achieved their goal. Let's say, in Napier (Hawke's Bay), the vast majority of rugby fans support the Hurricanes? In Bridgend, people realy support the Ospreys? I tend to feel outside the main home city, people that want to support a Super Rugby or a PRO14 team simply choose a team because of any random preference (a player, a title campaign, the colours, anything) and not because the team is allegedly representing their region.... I may be wrong, I would like to know more from people from those countries. But I woudn't be surprised if the Crusaders have more fans in Napier than the Hurricanes or that Bridgend people give a damn to PRO14. After all, that's what happens in American cities without major leagues or European and Latin American cities without leading soccer clubs: they either give a damn and keep with their small team or they choose a big team for a much more personal reason.

If I am right, this means teams should have their geographical centres in their names. And maybe relegation-promotion systems in those countries should be considered, allowing Hawke's Bay to go up to the main NZ tournament if they have money, for exemple.
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 03:10

thatrugbyguy wrote:I understand the perspective that you risk alienating fans if the Hurricanes or the Highlanders or whoever limit themselves to a single location, but there's value in tribalism as well. NSW and Queensland should be the biggest match on the domestic Super Rugby calendar each year, and yet it passes by without barely anyone noticing. Switch to rugby league's State of Origin and it's nothing but New South Wales vs Queensland. When a team doesn't have a proper identity all you ever get are people who take a luke warm interest in the sport. Frankly, if the Hurricanes revert to Wellington and that alienates the people of Hawkes Bay, Manawatu or the other unions associated with the team, then they aren't really interested in Hurricanes in the first place. You're better off having it be Wellington vs Auckland, or Swansea vs Cardiff, or Queensland vs New South Wales, or New York vs Atlanta than nondescript names.


I think the only different case is London. Do you think the Saracens and Harlequins needed "London" or "Surrey" or "Middlessex" in their names? Not sure. I was going to say Paris as well, but Racing do use "92" (the number of the Hauts-de-Seine department, i. e. their Paris' suburb area... although people outside France don't know that) and Stade Français uses "Paris" as a name as well....
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 5830
Joined: Sat, 05 Jul 2014, 02:44
National Flag:
AustraliaAustralia

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby thatrugbyguy » Sat, 30 May 2020, 03:25

London is unique in this instance because a lot of sporting clubs go back a hundred years. If we're talking modern clubs though it doesn't make a lot of sense to leave off the location.

Posts: 84
Joined: Sun, 05 Feb 2017, 15:38
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Higgik » Sat, 30 May 2020, 07:49

Higgik wrote:
thatrugbyguy wrote:I've always felt that team nicknames should reflect the place where the team comes from. In Super Rugby the Waratahs are named after the state's flower, the Brumbies are named after the wild horses that once roamed the area, the Reds are named after their states colours, and the Rebels are named after the Eurkea Rebellion from the 1850's. The Western Force however was completely manufactured.

The problem with rugby's naming conventions though at the moments extend beyond whatever the hell MLR are currently doing. In Super Rugby the teams no longer have geographical descriptions in their name, which to me wa one of the stupidest decisions to ever make. You cannot build fans, nor rivalries, if people don't know where the Sharks or Crusaders are from. Same with Ospreys, I still have no idea where in Wales they are located. RUNY and Rugby ATL are coming from the same place. Give the teams locations for crying out loud, I shouldn't have to open Google maps to find them.

But RUNY has NY in the name, so pretty famous initials across the whole world, while ATL is the recognised 3 letter code in the US for Atlanta.
Agree with the other 3 though. They should have a territory name. Reasoning behind It is to try and get more fans in a very tribal sport. Swansea Ospreys would lose Neath fans. Glamorgan Ospreys would have been good but Cardiff would have moaned with the Blues.
In Wales, I would have had Western Dragons (instead of link with Llanelli), Glamorgan Ospreys, Cardiff Blues, Gwent Steelers (New name New start for team in Newport). In SA name them after the cities or the province.

The mix of club and region, was solely down to WRU. They did not have enough money to create 4 franchises in the main population areas, (originally 5). The club's then got involved and wanted their own branding. The problem then was they were not big enough, as you say, to be professional. The product is now a mishmash of club's trying to 'steal' fans from other clubs.
If the WRU had enough money and started again, they would have centrally contracted 100 or so players and created teams in the major population areas. Maybe they would have gone for 3 teams as well.
Cardiff, Glamorgan, Gwent as the names of teams based in Cardiff, Swansea and Newport.

Posts: 886
Joined: Thu, 12 Dec 2019, 21:26
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 30 May 2020, 07:51

For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Posts: 84
Joined: Sun, 05 Feb 2017, 15:38
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Higgik » Sat, 30 May 2020, 08:24

Chester-Donnelly wrote:For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Agree, but calling them Glamorgan Ospreys would help in giving them an identity.

Posts: 886
Joined: Thu, 12 Dec 2019, 21:26
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 30 May 2020, 09:05

Higgik wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Agree, but calling them Glamorgan Ospreys would help in giving them an identity.


I think they have their identity. Glamorgan also covers Cardiff and is associated with cricket.
Ospreys is a good brand. People of Swansea and Neath support Ospreys. People in other parts of Wales for example North Wales can choose a rugby team to support, like they do football. People in North Wales support Liverpool, Everton or Manchester United. They can do the same for rugby. Probably Welsh speakers will choose Scarlets as they are the most Welsh team. People might choose to support Cardiff Blues. Cardiff, being the capital city, is a brand in itself. The only team I think people are unlikely to choose as their team is Dragons. Dragons does have potential to attract supporters from outside Newport, they are the closest club to England and therefore North Wales, but first they need to sort out their dreadful pitch and have some success.

Posts: 309
Joined: Tue, 12 Apr 2016, 14:19
National Flag:
WalesWales

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby sammo » Sat, 30 May 2020, 09:42

Higgik wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Agree, but calling them Glamorgan Ospreys would help in giving them an identity.


Sorry, but Swansea isn’t in Glamorgan... and nor is Neath! I would be reticent your use the name of a historic county, especially one which has such strong links with Cardiff

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 14:49

thatrugbyguy wrote:London is unique in this instance because a lot of sporting clubs go back a hundred years. If we're talking modern clubs though it doesn't make a lot of sense to leave off the location.

Why unique? Almost all big French rugby clubs have a hundred yo too. Racing and Stade Français are from the 19th century for exemple.

And in soccer almost all continental Europe and South American clubs are a hundred yo or more as well...
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 15:01

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Higgik wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Agree, but calling them Glamorgan Ospreys would help in giving them an identity.


I think they have their identity. Glamorgan also covers Cardiff and is associated with cricket.
Ospreys is a good brand. People of Swansea and Neath support Ospreys. People in other parts of Wales for example North Wales can choose a rugby team to support, like they do football. People in North Wales support Liverpool, Everton or Manchester United. They can do the same for rugby. Probably Welsh speakers will choose Scarlets as they are the most Welsh team. People might choose to support Cardiff Blues. Cardiff, being the capital city, is a brand in itself. The only team I think people are unlikely to choose as their team is Dragons. Dragons does have potential to attract supporters from outside Newport, they are the closest club to England and therefore North Wales, but first they need to sort out their dreadful pitch and have some success.


The Swansea-Neath-Port Talbot area is called Swansea Bay. Swansea Bay Ospreys sounds good.

Or maybe West Wales Scarlets, South Wales Ospreys, Cardiff Blues and East Wales Dragons. It doesn't matter that all the region is South Wales, it offers a region identity for people that are in other cities, maybe.
Last edited by victorsra on Sat, 30 May 2020, 15:11, edited 2 times in total.
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 84
Joined: Sun, 05 Feb 2017, 15:38
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Higgik » Sat, 30 May 2020, 15:08

victorsra wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Higgik wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Agree, but calling them Glamorgan Ospreys would help in giving them an identity.


I think they have their identity. Glamorgan also covers Cardiff and is associated with cricket.
Ospreys is a good brand. People of Swansea and Neath support Ospreys. People in other parts of Wales for example North Wales can choose a rugby team to support, like they do football. People in North Wales support Liverpool, Everton or Manchester United. They can do the same for rugby. Probably Welsh speakers will choose Scarlets as they are the most Welsh team. People might choose to support Cardiff Blues. Cardiff, being the capital city, is a brand in itself. The only team I think people are unlikely to choose as their team is Dragons. Dragons does have potential to attract supporters from outside Newport, they are the closest club to England and therefore North Wales, but first they need to sort out their dreadful pitch and have some success.


The Swansea-Neath-Port Talbot area is called Swansea Bay. Swansea Bay Ospreys sounds good.

Or maybe West Wales Scarlets, South Wales Ospreys, Cardiff Blues and East Wales Dragons. It doesn't matter that all the region is South Wales, it offers a region identity for people that are in other cities, maybe.
like the name Swansea Bay Ospreys.

Cardiff Blues is good as Cardiff colours for many sports are Blue.

Still think Gwent Steelers would be better as would not have yellow as main colour.

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 15:11

About the colours, Ospreys does a mess, honestly. It would be much better to have them properly being white (Swansea) and black (Neath), maybe with some red for Aberavon fans. Scrap blue, yellow, purple or whatever they believe is cool. IMO you should only try new colours in away shirts if you are not with identity issues...
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 15:16

Higgik wrote:
victorsra wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Higgik wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:For Ospreys it makes sense to keep the name Ospreys. Swansea is not a very big city (240k). The biggest sports club in Swansea is Swansea City FC and always will be. Swansea was not a very big rugby club before the Ospreys was formed. Their home ground St Helens holds only 4500. Neath was the bigger club of the two.
Ospreys does play some games at the Gnoll, Neath 6000 capacity, and the Brewery Field, Bridgend 8000.
I asked coach Sean Holley whether Ospreys should move permanently to the Gnoll. He said the Gnoll is too old and there isn't enough parking, and he told me about the plans to build a new 10k capacity stadium at Llandarcy which is between Swansea, Neath and Port Talbot. I think that is the best solution for Ospreys. Ospreys needs to keep its name. It is the daughter of Swansea and Neath. The region has been called Ospreylia. None of the Welsh regions in rugby are regions in any other sense, but they are the four professional clubs with a decent support. It doesn't really matter what team people from Bridgend, the Valleys or North Wales say they support. They should support their local Welsh Premiership club, and also choose a Pro 14 team to follow.

Agree, but calling them Glamorgan Ospreys would help in giving them an identity.


I think they have their identity. Glamorgan also covers Cardiff and is associated with cricket.
Ospreys is a good brand. People of Swansea and Neath support Ospreys. People in other parts of Wales for example North Wales can choose a rugby team to support, like they do football. People in North Wales support Liverpool, Everton or Manchester United. They can do the same for rugby. Probably Welsh speakers will choose Scarlets as they are the most Welsh team. People might choose to support Cardiff Blues. Cardiff, being the capital city, is a brand in itself. The only team I think people are unlikely to choose as their team is Dragons. Dragons does have potential to attract supporters from outside Newport, they are the closest club to England and therefore North Wales, but first they need to sort out their dreadful pitch and have some success.


The Swansea-Neath-Port Talbot area is called Swansea Bay. Swansea Bay Ospreys sounds good.

Or maybe West Wales Scarlets, South Wales Ospreys, Cardiff Blues and East Wales Dragons. It doesn't matter that all the region is South Wales, it offers a region identity for people that are in other cities, maybe.
like the name Swansea Bay Ospreys.

Cardiff Blues is good as Cardiff colours for many sports are Blue.

Still think Gwent Steelers would be better as would not have yellow as main colour.


Red maybe is better for the Dragons IMO. What's the problem with 2 red teams? I searched "East Wales" and it is used for the whole region from Newport to Wrexham. Maybe it would be a great idea to try new fans in the North.

Maybe you don't need second names. Leinster, Munster, Ulster, Edinburgh are fine. Why not simply West Wales, South Wales, Cardiff and East Wales? Basically split the country in 3 + the capital.
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 15:21

But this has nothing to do with MLR :p
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 886
Joined: Thu, 12 Dec 2019, 21:26
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 30 May 2020, 17:14

I don't like any of these suggestions. Everyone in Wales knows where these clubs are. From Parc y Scarlets to Rodney Parade is only 100km. They already have identities, history and colours.

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 18:16

100km is Greater São Paulo area from east to west :lol:

But yes, people know where they are from. But what's the intention behind having "regional teams" instead of clubs. They could have Llanelli, Swansea,Cardiff and Newport. Why they don't? Because they want to catch fans from outside those cities. When I say "East Wales" catches even Wrexham (a North Wales city), this means a way to try to represent them. Because if the names are only abstract ones, it is more logical to give up from regional representation and let teams fight for fans outside their bases. But this would happen anyway if they kept their original city names (just like sports fans can support Dallas Cowboys, Los Angeles Lakers, Barcelona, Manchester United, Milan, Santos or Chivas Guadalajara outside their home cities). The question is: what they want with those names?
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 2299
Joined: Sun, 20 Apr 2014, 16:57
Location: Leicester
National Flag:
Great BritainGreat Britain

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby sk 88 » Sat, 30 May 2020, 18:46

4N wrote:It’s to the point. The other stuff sounds like D3 rugby clubs or invitational 7s sides. Nothing “major league” about them.

Some are good though. Seawolves for sure and Warriors works in Utah with the PI community. Arrows is alright and Gold is middle of the road with ATL. Colorado Raptors was solid too...


I like SaberCats.

There is a bit of history with faux-merged animal names in USA like Kansas Jayhawks, also loads of Japanese teams have weird fake animal names like that. I like the Red Hurricanes and the SunGoliaths!

Posts: 2299
Joined: Sun, 20 Apr 2014, 16:57
Location: Leicester
National Flag:
Great BritainGreat Britain

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby sk 88 » Sat, 30 May 2020, 18:59

victorsra wrote:I don't have any data to tell, but I'm not sure if they achieved their goal. Let's say, in Napier (Hawke's Bay), the vast majority of rugby fans support the Hurricanes? In Bridgend, people realy support the Ospreys? I tend to feel outside the main home city, people that want to support a Super Rugby or a PRO14 team simply choose a team because of any random preference (a player, a title campaign, the colours, anything) and not because the team is allegedly representing their region.... I may be wrong, I would like to know more from people from those countries. But I woudn't be surprised if the Crusaders have more fans in Napier than the Hurricanes or that Bridgend people give a damn to PRO14. After all, that's what happens in American cities without major leagues or European and Latin American cities without leading soccer clubs: they either give a damn and keep with their small team or they choose a big team for a much more personal reason.

If I am right, this means teams should have their geographical centres in their names. And maybe relegation-promotion systems in those countries should be considered, allowing Hawke's Bay to go up to the main NZ tournament if they have money, for exemple.


Basically this.

This is what people are actually like in reality. They support who they want for loads of different reasons that are hard to nail down.

One of my mates supports Spurs and his brother supports Villa. Their dad supports Leicester City and uses our tickets sometimes!

As for Wales .... these guys in Neath have zero problem supporting Swansea City.

Posts: 7245
Joined: Thu, 17 Apr 2014, 02:51
Location: São Paulo
National Flag:
BrazilBrazil

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 30 May 2020, 19:20

sk 88 wrote:
victorsra wrote:I don't have any data to tell, but I'm not sure if they achieved their goal. Let's say, in Napier (Hawke's Bay), the vast majority of rugby fans support the Hurricanes? In Bridgend, people realy support the Ospreys? I tend to feel outside the main home city, people that want to support a Super Rugby or a PRO14 team simply choose a team because of any random preference (a player, a title campaign, the colours, anything) and not because the team is allegedly representing their region.... I may be wrong, I would like to know more from people from those countries. But I woudn't be surprised if the Crusaders have more fans in Napier than the Hurricanes or that Bridgend people give a damn to PRO14. After all, that's what happens in American cities without major leagues or European and Latin American cities without leading soccer clubs: they either give a damn and keep with their small team or they choose a big team for a much more personal reason.

If I am right, this means teams should have their geographical centres in their names. And maybe relegation-promotion systems in those countries should be considered, allowing Hawke's Bay to go up to the main NZ tournament if they have money, for exemple.


Basically this.

This is what people are actually like in reality. They support who they want for loads of different reasons that are hard to nail down.

One of my mates supports Spurs and his brother supports Villa. Their dad supports Leicester City and uses our tickets sometimes!

As for Wales .... these guys in Neath have zero problem supporting Swansea City.


Use either {Cardiff, Swansea, Llanelli and Newport} or {Cardiff, South Wales, West Wales and East Wales}. IMO, both strategies would be valid, have a logic and would be better connected to reality than the current no-geography approach. Choose a tie, and outside that area it is your players and achievements and the marketing you do around them that wil bring the fans.
Brazilian Rugby News: www.portaldorugby.com.br

Posts: 886
Joined: Thu, 12 Dec 2019, 21:26
National Flag:
EnglandEngland

Re: Major League Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 30 May 2020, 19:36

victorsra wrote:100km is Greater São Paulo area from east to west :lol:

But yes, people know where they are from. But what's the intention behind having "regional teams" instead of clubs. They could have Llanelli, Swansea,Cardiff and Newport. Why they don't? Because they want to catch fans from outside those cities. When I say "East Wales" catches even Wrexham (a North Wales city), this means a way to try to represent them. Because if the names are only abstract ones, it is more logical to give up from regional representation and let teams fight for fans outside their bases. But this would happen anyway if they kept their original city names (just like sports fans can support Dallas Cowboys, Los Angeles Lakers, Barcelona, Manchester United, Milan, Santos or Chivas Guadalajara outside their home cities). The question is: what they want with those names?


They want to gain fans from outside their cities but at the same time not lose the fans they have. I actually don't agree with the "regional teams" concept for Wales. I refuse to call these teams regions. I call them pro clubs because that's what they are. England and Wales has 10 regions, one of which is Wales. Technically Wales is a regional team.
I live the the region of England & Wales called South West England. We have four professional rugby clubs. They are Exeter, Bristol, Gloucester and Bath. Actually there are 5 if you include Cornish Pirates but the Cornish are a separate nationality and far away. I live in Swindon. We don't have a professional or semi pro rugby club. Rugby fans in Swindon mostly support Bath but there are Bristol, Gloucester and Exeter fans here. There is no Bath region. The region is South West England. If we had a semi pro club in Swindon I would support that club and Bath. I see no problem with someone from Pontypridd supporting Ponty plus a Pro 14 team, or just Ponty.
I respect how Cardiff Blues have kept their identity. Swansea and Neath combining makes sense, and the Ospreys identity is now established. Scarlets represent the area that is the preserved county of Dyfed which is named after the ancient kingdom of Dyfed. They could call themselves Dyfed Scarlets if they wanted to add a "region" to their name.
The only team with an identity issue is Dragons, who are really Newport. If the RFU decided to ring fence the Premiership and decided that the South West has too many clubs, so they put Gloucester in the Championship and rename Bath the Bath-Gloucester Wyverns, then years later rename them the Wyverns, Bath supporters would continue to support them and pretend they're still called Bath, and Gloucester supporters would continue to support Gloucester but probably in smaller numbers. My point is that Dragons can attract fans from other parts of Wales, but it is a lot more difficult to attract fans from Ebbw Vale who have their own semi pro club in the Welsh Premiership and are historic rivals of Newport. It doesn't really matter much what Newport or Dragons are called, but for attracting new fans Dragons is probably a slightly better name. Newport isn't a fashionable city like Cardiff.
I want to also add that I am envious of the Welsh. My region is just as much a rugby region as is Wales. I like the Welsh Premiership. Every town has a team. Games are broadcast weekly on the BBC. I wish my region had the same thing. The WRU acts like the Welsh Premiership is a problem not something good. Let the city people support their Pro 14 teams and the town people support their Welsh Premiership teams.

PreviousNext

Return to Rugby Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 10 guests