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2027 RWC bids

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby ficcp » Mon, 14 Sep 2020, 18:11

Russia is bidding for RWC 2027 while USA is bidding for RWC 2031. They are not competing now for the same championship, but the situation could change.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby ficcp » Mon, 14 Sep 2020, 18:13

Correction : they are not bidding for the same tournament but are bidding for the RWC.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby victorsra » Mon, 14 Sep 2020, 18:25

The 2027 and 2031 hosts will be part of the same bidding process as I understand, which means Russia may bid for 2027 but they will be in the 2031 run anyway. USA, in the other hand, only wants 2031. In theory, they are part of the same selection process, if I haven't misunderstood.
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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 14 Sep 2020, 19:10

Russia is bidding for both:
https://twitter.com/RusRugbyNews/status ... 2104822784

And if I'm malicious, I believe USA bid will be supported by a few from the establishment that logically will want to avoid the can of worms of a RWC being given to Russia for lack of competitors in the mid of a tense diplomatic climate and with a sporting ban pending on them.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby victorsra » Mon, 14 Sep 2020, 21:49

In 2018, Russia had these venues:
- Kaliningrad = GMT +2
- Moscow, St. Petersburg, Sochi, Rostov, Nizhny Novgorod, Saransk and Kazan = GMT +3
- Volgograd and Samara = GMT +4
- Yekaterinburg = GMT +5

In Siberia/Pacific, major cities are:
- Novosibirsk = GMT +7 (stadium has 12.000 seats)
- Krasnoyarsk = GMT +8 (stadium has 15.000 seats)
- Khabarovsk = GMT +10 (stadium has 15.000 seats)
- Vladivostok = GMT +10 (stadium has 10.000 seats)

It is very complicated to properly schedule a WC trying to meet TVs requirement of more or less the same kickoff times every rounds, for exemple. True, GMT+7 +8 + 10 can be a great deal to reach Asia-Oceania markets, but groups will mix teams from all continents and they'll move during the tournament, specialy because Siberian stadiums are small to see T1s playing all their matches there. Anyway, as far as I understood, Russia made it clear they want to use basicaly the same 2018 stadiums.
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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby ficcp » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 01:52

victorsra wrote:The 2027 and 2031 hosts will be part of the same bidding process as I understand, which means Russia may bid for 2027 but they will be in the 2031 run anyway. USA, in the other hand, only wants 2031. In theory, they are part of the same selection process, if I haven't misunderstood.


I understood that the application was for one tournament only, not for one or the other. Maybe I am wrong but the information has not been clear enough. Anyway, I expect more countries interested in the organisation of 2027 RWC which have more than a year to show up.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby Rebus » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 07:24

I would expect the 2027 RWC to go to Australia and the 20131 to USA but in the current climate there are not going to be many countries who can bid for either.
World Rugby and Rugby Australia are not in a good financial place and this will guarantee the finances for both parties. It will help reinvigorate a sport in Australia which is losing interest domestically. Rugby Australia will also benefit from a proposed Lions tour in 2025 to keep the profile of the country high as a 2027 RWC destination.

World Rugby will also want to push for more growth and finances in USA and this will be the best chance to do it. The problem is , can USA prove it has the finances and infrastructure in place to support a competition of this size for what is still regarded a minority sport in the USA. It remains to be seen what the projected landscape will be of the MLR and the popularity of the game in 11 years time. It would be hoped that another 11 years of growth in the the MLR would make it a significant size to be attractive to commercial investors and domestic fans alike. If the USA were to get the RWC , I would expect the growth in interest to be facilitated by USA being invited to play more higher profile friendlies and for top 5 international teams to tour the USA & Canada. Digressing a bit , but could see USA being invited to an expanded 6 Nations if they won the 2031 RWC. Commercially it would boost the finances of the 6 Nations and rugby wise would raise the standards and domestic interest of the USA.

Russia has the infrastructure and the government backing , but lets be honest , it is just not the popular choice.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 08:12

This could be the perfect time to grow rugby in America. Viewing figures of NBA and NFL are down and many fans are turning away because they don't like politics brought into sport. I think there is a real opportunity for MLR to take an explicitly apolitical stance. They could pick up a lot of fans who want sport without politics, and without loads of ad breaks. Just play ball.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby sk 88 » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 08:28

victorsra wrote:Well, Russia needs to start doing political work... if we look at the WR Council, who is Russia's ally? Nobody. Maybe Rugby Europe, with 2 votes, not occupied by Russians. So, maybe.

USA starts with 4 votes (North American votes), but it is very likely to receive Sudamerica Rugby, Argentina (well, USA voted for Pichot...) and Home Nations votes. 21, just to start.


Interesting you put the home nations votes in with the US, what's the thinking behind that?

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby sk 88 » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 08:34

Rebus wrote:I would expect the 2027 RWC to go to Australia and the 20131 to USA but in the current climate there are not going to be many countries who can bid for either.
World Rugby and Rugby Australia are not in a good financial place and this will guarantee the finances for both parties. It will help reinvigorate a sport in Australia which is losing interest domestically. Rugby Australia will also benefit from a proposed Lions tour in 2025 to keep the profile of the country high as a 2027 RWC destination.


I've yet to see much breakdown of the finances of a proposed Aussie bid.

Does anyone know which stadiums are being proposed? Presuming still a 20 team tournament as the push for 24 seems to have died in the corridors of power despite its compelling case. Will the Aussie national, or state, governments put up with paying the World Rugby guarantee? What is the Aussie domestic sponsorship market like compared to Russia? I assume it is tiny compared to USA given that it is barely the size of some state's economies. TV wise Australia is good for Japan, but poor for France&England. Trying to think about US/South American time zones surely most of it would be in the middle of their night too?

I'm dubious the Aussie bid is the slam dunk many think. As we saw with France, money talks and I've a feeling they might not have the most.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby Rebus » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 08:51

SK88 , the only link I could see for the stadiums were https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2027_Rugby_World_Cup

I agree the commercial money is greater elsewhere from Australia , but based upon this article , there are a lot of parties interested in Australia making this happen.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/ ... p-2027-bid

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby Tobar » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 13:32

sk 88 wrote:
victorsra wrote:Well, Russia needs to start doing political work... if we look at the WR Council, who is Russia's ally? Nobody. Maybe Rugby Europe, with 2 votes, not occupied by Russians. So, maybe.

USA starts with 4 votes (North American votes), but it is very likely to receive Sudamerica Rugby, Argentina (well, USA voted for Pichot...) and Home Nations votes. 21, just to start.


Interesting you put the home nations votes in with the US, what's the thinking behind that?


Not victor but my thought process is that the 6 Nations have greater ties to the US than to Russia, even if it’s technically on the same continent. Closer cultural ties and more rugby awareness. From a pure market standpoint, the US has the chance to offer more long term.

Just think of the NBC Sports EPL deal for $1 billion. Rugby is not anywhere near the same level as soccer but this grabs headlines for the old boys on top.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby victorsra » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 13:49

sk 88 wrote:
victorsra wrote:Well, Russia needs to start doing political work... if we look at the WR Council, who is Russia's ally? Nobody. Maybe Rugby Europe, with 2 votes, not occupied by Russians. So, maybe.

USA starts with 4 votes (North American votes), but it is very likely to receive Sudamerica Rugby, Argentina (well, USA voted for Pichot...) and Home Nations votes. 21, just to start.


Interesting you put the home nations votes in with the US, what's the thinking behind that?


Well, Premiership and PRO14 have been showing interest in US market; during the World League debate they proposed USA in the first division...

I think if there is someone wanting to see US market growing are the Home Nations. Much more interested on them then on Russia, that was kicked out of the Challenge Cup.

I also think other T1s prefer USA, but the signals are not as clear as from the Home Nations IMO. It would be a huge shock to see them voting for Russia. If they had any interest on Russian rugby growth, Challenge Cup would have spots for them and we would be saying at least some comments regarding developing REC and etc. They are not interested.
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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby victorsra » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 14:44

victorsra wrote:
sk 88 wrote:
victorsra wrote:Well, Russia needs to start doing political work... if we look at the WR Council, who is Russia's ally? Nobody. Maybe Rugby Europe, with 2 votes, not occupied by Russians. So, maybe.

USA starts with 4 votes (North American votes), but it is very likely to receive Sudamerica Rugby, Argentina (well, USA voted for Pichot...) and Home Nations votes. 21, just to start.


Interesting you put the home nations votes in with the US, what's the thinking behind that?


Well, Premiership and PRO14 have been showing interest in US market; during the World League debate they proposed USA in the first division...

I think if there is someone wanting to see US market growing are the Home Nations. Much more interested on them then on Russia, that was kicked out of the Challenge Cup.

I also think other T1s prefer USA, but the signals are not as clear as from the Home Nations IMO. It would be a huge shock to see them voting for Russia. If they had any interest on Russian rugby growth, Challenge Cup would have spots for them and we would be saying at least some comments regarding developing REC and etc. They are not interested.


To be clear, this is only valid if 2031 is USA vs Russia. As I said before, it wouldn't be surprising to see a 2031 British bid.
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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby sk 88 » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 15:40

victorsra wrote:
victorsra wrote:
sk 88 wrote:
victorsra wrote:Well, Russia needs to start doing political work... if we look at the WR Council, who is Russia's ally? Nobody. Maybe Rugby Europe, with 2 votes, not occupied by Russians. So, maybe.

USA starts with 4 votes (North American votes), but it is very likely to receive Sudamerica Rugby, Argentina (well, USA voted for Pichot...) and Home Nations votes. 21, just to start.


Interesting you put the home nations votes in with the US, what's the thinking behind that?


Well, Premiership and PRO14 have been showing interest in US market; during the World League debate they proposed USA in the first division...

I think if there is someone wanting to see US market growing are the Home Nations. Much more interested on them then on Russia, that was kicked out of the Challenge Cup.

I also think other T1s prefer USA, but the signals are not as clear as from the Home Nations IMO. It would be a huge shock to see them voting for Russia. If they had any interest on Russian rugby growth, Challenge Cup would have spots for them and we would be saying at least some comments regarding developing REC and etc. They are not interested.


To be clear, this is only valid if 2031 is USA vs Russia. As I said before, it wouldn't be surprising to see a 2031 British bid.


Right, yes I understand and agree totally in this scenario. Initially I thought you meant v either Australia or regardless of who else bid!

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby Neilwilk » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 16:23

I also think world rugby have pretty much hinted that they want 2027 red to go to Australia and 2031 to the USA and with the set up of major league rugby, the aim would be for the USA to be competitive enough like japan was in 2019 to reach the quarter finals, as if the USA and japan both become tier 1 nations imagine the marketing money and sponsorship that would generate the world rugby team would be rubbing their hands. Another example of how world rugby would love the USA to become a competitive market is with the British lions touring there. If the lions could could tour one country anywhere in world it would be the USA. Can you imagine how much money that would generate with tests in eg Chicago, Los Angeles and New York for example in the big American football stadiums. If you thought the Ryder cup was big, the lions touring America would blow the finances out of the water. And how many touring British fans would want to go on that tour? Probably a lot. Australia and New Zealand or evening South Africa could never generate as much money if the lions ever went stateside.

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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby victorsra » Tue, 15 Sep 2020, 16:30

And look how alliances could work.

France has its traditional links to Rugby Europe and we are supposed to believe Rugby Europe would support Russia. But would France break the vote vote with their 6N partners? Well, we don't know what goes on inside EPCR, but are the French supporting Russian clubs in the Challenge Cup. Not sure...

Same for Italy, that indeed has interests in Russia (whatever replaces the Continental Shield), but does it worth to break the group? And South Africa, that can become a PRO14 partner, the same?

It is too early to make such analysis, but Russia has a realy long road in short time to draw support, specialy for a country that is outside the Council. And support is a political thing, not a mere economic, development-or-fan-oriented decision.

In the other hand, I said South American support is certain, but more or less.... it depends to see USA commited to the ARC, and they would obviously do that...

Just to remind, it is the Council that choses the host indeed: 9.6 (m) of the Bye Law 9 https://www.world.rugby/handbook/bye-laws/bye-law-9
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Re: 2027 RWC bids

Postby thatrugbyguy » Thu, 17 Sep 2020, 05:25

sk 88 wrote:
Rebus wrote:I would expect the 2027 RWC to go to Australia and the 20131 to USA but in the current climate there are not going to be many countries who can bid for either.
World Rugby and Rugby Australia are not in a good financial place and this will guarantee the finances for both parties. It will help reinvigorate a sport in Australia which is losing interest domestically. Rugby Australia will also benefit from a proposed Lions tour in 2025 to keep the profile of the country high as a 2027 RWC destination.


I've yet to see much breakdown of the finances of a proposed Aussie bid.

Does anyone know which stadiums are being proposed? Presuming still a 20 team tournament as the push for 24 seems to have died in the corridors of power despite its compelling case. Will the Aussie national, or state, governments put up with paying the World Rugby guarantee? What is the Aussie domestic sponsorship market like compared to Russia? I assume it is tiny compared to USA given that it is barely the size of some state's economies. TV wise Australia is good for Japan, but poor for France&England. Trying to think about US/South American time zones surely most of it would be in the middle of their night too?

I'm dubious the Aussie bid is the slam dunk many think. As we saw with France, money talks and I've a feeling they might not have the most.


I've already said in this thread we aren't the slam dunk everyone thinks we are.

Most likely stadiums:

Stadium Australia - Homebush
Perth Stadium - Perth
Docklands Stadium - Melbourne
Adelaide Oval - Adelaide
Lang Park - Brisbane
New Sydney Stadium - Sydney
Newcastle Stadium - Newcastle
West Sydney Stadium- Parramatta
Gold Coast Stadium - Gold Coast
North Queensland Stadium - Townsville
Canberra Stadium - Canberra

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