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Japan Rugby

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 05:19

TheStroBro wrote:
Hinato wrote:The NZRU fought very hard to succeed (one year contract instead of two). And it is not until 2022 that the Japanese will really send the sauce. New Zealand rugby is too fragile to withstand the coming Japanese Pro League in the medium term.


Perfectly able, they just hold the jersey.


The jersey can only go so far for so many players. What we'll likely see is an amendment to the selection criteria seeing as the Top League/Pro League will be running in the exact same window what SR transforms into in regards to NZ and Australia. You'll have to play in one of those two competitions to remain eligible. With 16/17 - 20 professional teams in Japan (depending on the final number of teams) they will be plenty of opportunity to earn good money in an advantageous time zone for many players.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Hinato » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 07:56

What you have to understand is that the Japanese will target the best international players in the medium term to play in the Pro League. If 10/15 international New Zealand main selection will be present in Japan for 2 or 3 years at the same time, the New Zealand federation will be obliged to review its policy and select them. The calendar at the same time as Super Rugby, the new big Japanese ambitions for the Pro League and its selection, the NZRU will face a steamroller.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Figaro » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 08:13

Some of this is a bit hyperbolic.

The French league has dwarfed e.g. the Pro14 for resources for decades. At any one time there have been a handful of Welsh, Irish and Scottish players in France, generally earning far more than back home. But this has been going on for twenty years and it's never been more than a handful. In fact at one point this season it looked like the only two Welsh players in France were both in the ProD2 and nowhere near the national side.

The Japanese League will probably pick up a fair few New Zealanders but I don't see why it would be the death knell for NZ rugby. Remember the occasional high profile marquee players are not typical of the players in the league, and these sides can only afford so many. French rugby already picks up a bunch of New Zealanders but it's not obvious to me that the national side has been unduly harmed.

The median salary in the new Japanese League is likely to be lower than other opportunities to play Pro rugby

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 09:42

The three Pacific Islands unions should consider whether it would be better if their international players were playing in Europe or in Japan. I think Japan probably makes more sense but that is a strategic decision for those unions to make.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 10:25

Chester-Donnelly wrote:The three Pacific Islands unions should consider whether it would be better if their international players were playing in Europe or in Japan. I think Japan probably makes more sense but that is a strategic decision for those unions to make.


What makes you think, any out of the T,S and F can make a strategic decision on where their eligible players play at? They simply go where they can make more money to support their families. And for T+S 1/3 to 1/2 are born Kiwis.
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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 11:28

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:The three Pacific Islands unions should consider whether it would be better if their international players were playing in Europe or in Japan. I think Japan probably makes more sense but that is a strategic decision for those unions to make.


What makes you think, any out of the T,S and F can make a strategic decision on where their eligible players play at? They simply go where they can make more money to support their families. And for T+S 1/3 to 1/2 are born Kiwis.


They can make a decision. Implementation of the decision is a different matter. But having your players spread across the globe is not a recipe for success. Do you think Uruguay has better players than Fiji? Of course not but Uruguay beat Fiji. Uruguay has strategy and Fiji has no strategy. Uruguay is more than the sum of its parts, and Fiji is an underachiever.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby victorsra » Fri, 03 Jul 2020, 12:54

I'm with RugbyLiebe, they can't and probably they don't want because what matters is their players careers. What matters for them is to be able to have those players available to train together before competitions. That's the only possible strategy.

I think what is closer to Chester's idea is the always commented Super Rugby franchise. The franchise would need to pay salaries closer to what Europe and Japan pays, which is an utopia because how would they find such rich sponsor to provide that money? They will never impose players need to be in the franchise to play for the national team and only youngs players, veteran players or players that lost space abroad would be in such franchise...
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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby TheStroBro » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 01:46

Working Class Rugger wrote:
TheStroBro wrote:
Hinato wrote:The NZRU fought very hard to succeed (one year contract instead of two). And it is not until 2022 that the Japanese will really send the sauce. New Zealand rugby is too fragile to withstand the coming Japanese Pro League in the medium term.


Perfectly able, they just hold the jersey.


The jersey can only go so far for so many players. What we'll likely see is an amendment to the selection criteria seeing as the Top League/Pro League will be running in the exact same window what SR transforms into in regards to NZ and Australia. You'll have to play in one of those two competitions to remain eligible. With 16/17 - 20 professional teams in Japan (depending on the final number of teams) they will be plenty of opportunity to earn good money in an advantageous time zone for many players.


It will, it's instilled in the Culture of NZ Rugby. It won't work for Australia of course. But it is what it is.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 03:10

TheStroBro wrote:
Working Class Rugger wrote:
TheStroBro wrote:
Hinato wrote:The NZRU fought very hard to succeed (one year contract instead of two). And it is not until 2022 that the Japanese will really send the sauce. New Zealand rugby is too fragile to withstand the coming Japanese Pro League in the medium term.


Perfectly able, they just hold the jersey.


The jersey can only go so far for so many players. What we'll likely see is an amendment to the selection criteria seeing as the Top League/Pro League will be running in the exact same window what SR transforms into in regards to NZ and Australia. You'll have to play in one of those two competitions to remain eligible. With 16/17 - 20 professional teams in Japan (depending on the final number of teams) they will be plenty of opportunity to earn good money in an advantageous time zone for many players.


It will, it's instilled in the Culture of NZ Rugby. It won't work for Australia of course. But it is what it is.


The area it could cause issue isn't the top band of players but the middle. Close enough to be in contention but not quite at that level. But still very good players. The kind of depth that allows for NZ Rugby to have greater depth in their squads providing more competition both on and off the field for those in the top band. Not journeymen but fringe players. That's where the damage could. Stay in NZ always just on the outside looking in for $150k NZD a season or go to Japan for 3x that?
Perhaps even more. All of a sudden the guys applying pressure to the 30-40 or so top band players are gone. Weakening the squad depth of each respective squad and this could work its way down the tree.

And there are examples of this in Rugby League. A great many if not the comfortable majority of NZ RL players in the NRL come from Rugby where they each grew up wanting to wear the famous jersey. But the opportunities and money from the NRL came knocking many couldn't pass up those offers. If this pro league fulfils its potential in terms of financial clout coupled with at least two divisions of professional teams then NZRU are going to have to begin to reassess their model.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Hinato » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 06:29

South Korea: will Hyundai Glovis join the future Japanese Pro League?

Japan, after its excellent rugby world cup last year (1/4 finalist), restructures its rugby and will see the launch in January 2022 of the New League (2 professional divisions and a national corporate league). But in the rest of Asia, apart from Malaysia, the situation has not improved. Worse, it got worse.

Hong Kong rugby is in a difficult situation with the political crisis with China and the coronavirus has added a layer. As a result, it seems unlikely that Global Rugby, launched this year, could take place in 2021. The latter could even disappear. A tragedy for the South China Tigers and therefore for the Dragons (the Hong Kong selection).

This announced disaster will not help Hyundai Glovis either. Franchise founded in December 2015, it was born after the disappearance that same year of the emblematic team of Samsung Heavy Industries Rugby (created in 1995).

The goal of Hyundai Glovis is to give hope to South Korean rugby. Their slogan "The hope of korean rugby" is quite clear. The franchise aimed to professionalize and integrate Global Rapid Rugby to become the backbone of the selection. But the announced failure of it will force its leaders to review the situation of the team.

A last solution then exists for Hyundai Glovis: integrate the Japanese New League. Geographically, the two countries are very close and it would be ideal for the team based in Incheon. The South Korean franchise could certainly not start out in one of the two professional divisions, but it has the essential infrastructure to meet the requirements of the third national corporate division.

Its major asset is the magnificent Namdong Asiad Rugby Stadium (5,078 seats) where South Korea has played its home matches in the Asia Rugby Championship since 2013. Hyundai Glovis, composed of 9 players at its launch in December 2015, now has a group 28 players including 21 South Korean internationals. The franchise also struck a big blow last May by signing the wing and star of local rugby Jeong Yeon Sik (who played these last two seasons at Hino Red Dolphins in Japan).

The team has now become the backbone of the South Korean team and their only hope. Because in the country rugby is on the verge of disappearance. South Korea relies on a very small pool: 987 licensees, including 3 corpos clubs (Hyundai Glovis, KEPCO and POSCO), 4 university clubs (Korea Univ., Yonsei Univ., Kyung Hee Univ. And Dankook Univ.) And some professional players in Japan. This is why the arrival of Hyundai Glovis in the Japanese New League in the coming years would be more than beneficial.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby theDarky » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 08:03

I don't believe that Korea can develop Rugby at its 15 form ...

I see several problems:
> the lack of stadiums with grass (many schools where koreans discover sport use sport facilities in clay) even if touch rugby could be a good alternative
> korean parents believes that US education model is better than british one (you can see it when kids learn english in private schools) a huge advantage for sports like baseball and basketball
> you cannot see it on TV even on pay channels

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 08:05

Hinato wrote:South Korea: will Hyundai Glovis join the future Japanese Pro League?

Japan, after its excellent rugby world cup last year (1/4 finalist), restructures its rugby and will see the launch in January 2022 of the New League (2 professional divisions and a national corporate league). But in the rest of Asia, apart from Malaysia, the situation has not improved. Worse, it got worse.

Hong Kong rugby is in a difficult situation with the political crisis with China and the coronavirus has added a layer. As a result, it seems unlikely that Global Rugby, launched this year, could take place in 2021. The latter could even disappear. A tragedy for the South China Tigers and therefore for the Dragons (the Hong Kong selection).

This announced disaster will not help Hyundai Glovis either. Franchise founded in December 2015, it was born after the disappearance that same year of the emblematic team of Samsung Heavy Industries Rugby (created in 1995).

The goal of Hyundai Glovis is to give hope to South Korean rugby. Their slogan "The hope of korean rugby" is quite clear. The franchise aimed to professionalize and integrate Global Rapid Rugby to become the backbone of the selection. But the announced failure of it will force its leaders to review the situation of the team.

A last solution then exists for Hyundai Glovis: integrate the Japanese New League. Geographically, the two countries are very close and it would be ideal for the team based in Incheon. The South Korean franchise could certainly not start out in one of the two professional divisions, but it has the essential infrastructure to meet the requirements of the third national corporate division.

Its major asset is the magnificent Namdong Asiad Rugby Stadium (5,078 seats) where South Korea has played its home matches in the Asia Rugby Championship since 2013. Hyundai Glovis, composed of 9 players at its launch in December 2015, now has a group 28 players including 21 South Korean internationals. The franchise also struck a big blow last May by signing the wing and star of local rugby Jeong Yeon Sik (who played these last two seasons at Hino Red Dolphins in Japan).

The team has now become the backbone of the South Korean team and their only hope. Because in the country rugby is on the verge of disappearance. South Korea relies on a very small pool: 987 licensees, including 3 corpos clubs (Hyundai Glovis, KEPCO and POSCO), 4 university clubs (Korea Univ., Yonsei Univ., Kyung Hee Univ. And Dankook Univ.) And some professional players in Japan. This is why the arrival of Hyundai Glovis in the Japanese New League in the coming years would be more than beneficial.


I thought that South Korean teams weren't considered an option. But it would be good if they were to admit Hyundai and hopefully in the future more South Korean franchises.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 08:34

I don't see Japan admitting foreign teams into their new league. But there could be opportunities for the Korean international players to play for Japanese teams. The focus for Korea must be to develop young players and have a strong university championship.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby theDarky » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 08:47

Chester-Donnelly wrote:I don't see Japan admitting foreign teams into their new league. But there could be opportunities for the Korean international players to play for Japanese teams. The focus for Korea must be to develop young players and have a strong university championship.


fully agree ... development of grass roots players must be their objective ... but their union seems very conservative (RFU and argentinian union seem very open minded compared to it)

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Hinato » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 10:17

Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 10:35

Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby rey200 » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 10:50

Well, they want to be the biggest thing in the sport, I guess having Korean media, companies and fans on board can only help. Soccer and baseball are much bigger in both countries, so there's no reason to join.
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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Hinato » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 11:45

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.


For the simple reason that South Korea can never have a real national rugby league (3 clubs corpos, you can not do anything with it). Impossible to compare with football, baseball and basketball. On the other hand, a South Korean team in the Japanese Pro League, you have a real backbone for the South Korean selection. South Korea has very few players but they are very good (in the best in Asia behind the Japanese, I don't count the Hong Kong people apart). It is therefore to have a second selection in Asia up to par for the future (that of Hong Kong will not exist in a few years). Meanwhile Malaysia.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Working Class Rugger » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 12:02

Hinato wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.


For the simple reason that South Korea can never have a real national rugby league (3 clubs corpos, you can not do anything with it). Impossible to compare with football, baseball and basketball. On the other hand, a South Korean team in the Japanese Pro League, you have a real backbone for the South Korean selection. South Korea has very few players but they are very good (in the best in Asia behind the Japanese, I don't count the Hong Kong people apart). It is therefore to have a second selection in Asia up to par for the future (that of Hong Kong will not exist in a few years). Meanwhile Malaysia.


The end goal should be to see both POSCO and KEPCO follow Hyundai's lead if they enter the Japanese system. Moving to professionalism would hopefully help drive a push to actually grow the game in South Korea via expanding the University system and push into High Schools and beyond.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 12:22

Working Class Rugger wrote:
Hinato wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.


For the simple reason that South Korea can never have a real national rugby league (3 clubs corpos, you can not do anything with it). Impossible to compare with football, baseball and basketball. On the other hand, a South Korean team in the Japanese Pro League, you have a real backbone for the South Korean selection. South Korea has very few players but they are very good (in the best in Asia behind the Japanese, I don't count the Hong Kong people apart). It is therefore to have a second selection in Asia up to par for the future (that of Hong Kong will not exist in a few years). Meanwhile Malaysia.


The end goal should be to see both POSCO and KEPCO follow Hyundai's lead if they enter the Japanese system. Moving to professionalism would hopefully help drive a push to actually grow the game in South Korea via expanding the University system and push into High Schools and beyond.


That's the wrong way round. It will fail. Korea needs to grow the sport in schools and universities before it is ready to have professional teams.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby victorsra » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 13:36

Hinato wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.


For the simple reason that South Korea can never have a real national rugby league (3 clubs corpos, you can not do anything with it). Impossible to compare with football, baseball and basketball. On the other hand, a South Korean team in the Japanese Pro League, you have a real backbone for the South Korean selection. South Korea has very few players but they are very good (in the best in Asia behind the Japanese, I don't count the Hong Kong people apart). It is therefore to have a second selection in Asia up to par for the future (that of Hong Kong will not exist in a few years). Meanwhile Malaysia.

Yes, Korea is strong in baseball (gold medal in Beijing 2008 Olympics) soccer (historically stronger than Japan, 10 WCs played, against only 6 by Japan).

In the other hand, Japan and Korea join forces in Ice Hockey with a combined league, that also have a Russian team (from Sakhalin islands, that borders Japan). There's a precedent. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia_League_Ice_Hockey

They don't realy need to have a professional team. Isn't the third division going to be semi-pro/amateur?
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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby 4N » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 13:55

Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Agree with you Hinato. :thumbup: I recall you posted a list of players eligible for Korea playing in Japan once and it was fairly strong. Historically they were competitive with Japan at times and the Korea University vs Yonsei game has attracted big crowds. And if the Tokyo Olympics take place, Korea have qualified in men’s sevens which will get some attention. Having a pro club in the Japanese league would be the next logical step. I have actually been impressed by some of their players when I have watched Korea. Their level of athleticism seems to be pretty good and they don’t lack size in the forwards.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 14:52

victorsra wrote:
Hinato wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.


For the simple reason that South Korea can never have a real national rugby league (3 clubs corpos, you can not do anything with it). Impossible to compare with football, baseball and basketball. On the other hand, a South Korean team in the Japanese Pro League, you have a real backbone for the South Korean selection. South Korea has very few players but they are very good (in the best in Asia behind the Japanese, I don't count the Hong Kong people apart). It is therefore to have a second selection in Asia up to par for the future (that of Hong Kong will not exist in a few years). Meanwhile Malaysia.

Yes, Korea is strong in baseball (gold medal in Beijing 2008 Olympics) soccer (historically stronger than Japan, 10 WCs played, against only 6 by Japan).

In the other hand, Japan and Korea join forces in Ice Hockey with a combined league, that also have a Russian team (from Sakhalin islands, that borders Japan). There's a precedent. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia_League_Ice_Hockey

They don't realy need to have a professional team. Isn't the third division going to be semi-pro/amateur?


Nice bit of research Victor. That does set a precedent. And you are right, the third division doesn't have the requirement to be fully professional or have a 15000 capacity stadium, so that makes a Korean team more sustainable. I think that's a good call.

The home of the Korea Rugby Team and the Hyundai Glovis rugby team has a capacity of just under 5000.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby Hinato » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 15:21

victorsra wrote:
Hinato wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
Hinato wrote:Absolutely disagree with you. Hyundai Glovis wants to professionalize and integrate a professional championship. Their primary desire has always been to join the Japanese championship. Geographically, South Korea is at the gates of Japan. Fukuoka and most of western Japan are closer to the Korean peninsula than Tokyo. Nothing to do with Hong Kong and other parts of Asia and the Pacific. The potential for players is limited in number but sufficient for a professional team. In addition to the 28 players in the current squad, we can add the 11 who play pros in Japan (including 7 South Korean internationals), those currently free (having left their Japanese team) and the internationals from KEPCO and POSCO. You add some foreign players and Hyundai Glovis has the staff to play in the future Japanese New League.


Japan has professional leagues in soccer, baseball and basketball with no Korean teams. Why would the rugby league want to admit a Korean team? I'm not against the idea I just don't think it's going to happen.


For the simple reason that South Korea can never have a real national rugby league (3 clubs corpos, you can not do anything with it). Impossible to compare with football, baseball and basketball. On the other hand, a South Korean team in the Japanese Pro League, you have a real backbone for the South Korean selection. South Korea has very few players but they are very good (in the best in Asia behind the Japanese, I don't count the Hong Kong people apart). It is therefore to have a second selection in Asia up to par for the future (that of Hong Kong will not exist in a few years). Meanwhile Malaysia.

Yes, Korea is strong in baseball (gold medal in Beijing 2008 Olympics) soccer (historically stronger than Japan, 10 WCs played, against only 6 by Japan).

In the other hand, Japan and Korea join forces in Ice Hockey with a combined league, that also have a Russian team (from Sakhalin islands, that borders Japan). There's a precedent. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia_League_Ice_Hockey

They don't realy need to have a professional team. Isn't the third division going to be semi-pro/amateur?


The 3rd division will be corporate. To be more precise, professionalism will not be compulsory for the teams in this division. But we should quickly see professional franchises with small stadium. I am thinking in particular of Akita Northern Bullets or Yokogawa Musashino Atlastars who should be candidates to join the New League from 2023. Yes because in the Japanese press, it is already announced that many Japanese teams (corpo or community), in addition to the 25 of origin, wish to integrate in their turn the Pro League. So Hyundai Glovis would largely have its place in the 3rd division and it would be a huge plus for their selection. Their 3-team championship is a masquerade.

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Re: Japan Rugby

Postby theDarky » Sat, 04 Jul 2020, 15:28

@Victor

you have to realize that the asian hockey league is very unstable.

I don't think the JFRU is looking for such instability.

In Korea, you can watch the matches on SBS Sport (the public sports channel - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SBS_Sports)

the crowds are very small ...

the club Daemyung Sangmu is military so you can't call it a professional team

this league was more or less created to help develop local talent for ice hockey as it is an important winter game at the Olympic Games for the countries of North Asia

in 2018, 8 players were "foreigners" in the Korean team

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_hocke ... outh_Korea

@hinato

I know that Hyundai Glovis was created with the hope of joining the Japanese system (a bit like the perpignan dragons in rugby league)

But, and you know it, the Koreans and the Japanese hate each other (the French / German / English or Argentinian / Brazilian rivalries are nothing compared to this one)

Don't you remember what's happening to the Asian baseball series? the Koreans were more competitive than expected and the Japanese did not want to replay

I think that if GRR disappears, the path to professionalism for Koreans will be more difficult.

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