Tier 2 & 3 Rugby Forum

Multi-sport Cities

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sat, 22 Aug 2020, 16:02

victorsra wrote:I think long-distance traveling don't necessarily makes a league full pro.


Not necessarily but it is an indication. Ice hockey teams tend to play a lot of games and it would be unreasonable to expect someone who isn't a full professional to make frequent long distance trips as it would be pretty much impossible to balance that with another job and family life. It could be that Belfast Giants is a fully professional team and some of the smaller Scottish teams are not.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Sat, 22 Aug 2020, 16:22

Yes, it is an indication that there is some investment going on, I agree.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby vino_93 » Sat, 22 Aug 2020, 19:26

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
victorsra wrote:I think long-distance traveling don't necessarily makes a league full pro.


Not necessarily but it is an indication. Ice hockey teams tend to play a lot of games and it would be unreasonable to expect someone who isn't a full professional to make frequent long distance trips as it would be pretty much impossible to balance that with another job and family life. It could be that Belfast Giants is a fully professional team and some of the smaller Scottish teams are not.

You can't play semi pro ice hockey with a league which has 2 or 3 games per week. Moreover on such a "big" territory.

Anyway, the league has a vast majority of outsiders, some with good salaries. All came from pro league, mostly in the USA. We have many exchange of players between EIHL and Ligue Magnus (France). Usually salaries are a bit better in UK than here.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Sat, 22 Aug 2020, 20:05

True, semi-professionalism only exists without mid-week matches.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 18:18

Another soccer club in Brazil has now embraced rugby: Vila Nova FC, one tradicional club from Goiás state. In football, they were relegated to the third division, but it as history in the top flight and also in other sports, being South American basketball champions in 1974.

So, let's list rugby teams that are part of multi-sports clubs with professional football. Obivously, most of these multisports clubs have completely independent football sections, which means in fact those are different clubs. But I'm sticking with the origins.


Brazil
- Corinthians
- Vila Nova

Formerly in rugby: Palmeiras, São Paulo FC, Vasco da Gama, Portuguesa, Paraná (Colorado), Caxias , Sampaio Correia, Alecrim, Galícia... (in recent time only)

Uruguay
- Peñarol

Paraguay
- Olimpia

Chile
- Universidad Católica

Argentina
- Gimnasia y Tiro de Salta

Spain
- Barcelona

Formerly in rugby: Atlético Madrid, Sevilla...

Portugal
- Académica de Coimbra
- Benfica
- Belenenses
- Sporting

Italy
- Lazio

Formerly in rugby: Milan

Germany
- St. Pauli
- Eintracht Frankfurt (alive?)

Belgium
- Anderlecht

Switzerland
- Servette
- Grasshopper

Monaco
- ASM Monaco

Romania
- Steaua Bucaresti
- Dinamo Bucaresti
- Univ. Cluj

Formerly in rugby: Farul Constanta, Sportul Studantesc

Russia
- CSKA Moscow
- Dynamo Moscow
- Torpedo Moscow
- Rotor Volgograd

Formerly in rugby: Lokomotiv? Spartak? Kuban?

Poland
- Arka Gdynia
- Lechia Gdansk
- Legia Warsaw

Czechia
- Slava Praha
- Sparta Praha

Serbia
- Partizan

Lithuania
- Zalgiris Kaunas

Georgia
- Dinamo Tbilisi
- Is Locomotive historicaly part of the same multisports club of footballl's Locomotive?

Tunisia
- Espérance de Tunis

Japan
Some Top League clubs with common origins with J-League clubs:
- Yamaha Jubilo (Jubilo Iwata in soccer)
- Tokyo Gas (FC Tokyo in soccer)
- Toyota Verblitz (Nagoya Grampus in soccer)
- Panasonic Wild Knights (Gamba Osaka in soccer)
- Mazda Blue Zoomers (Sanfrecce Hiroshima) ?

France
Opposite: rugby is professional was, but soccer was professional in the past in Racing, Stade Français...
Last edited by victorsra on Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 23:09, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby iul » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 19:14

AFAIK Baia Mare and Timisoara are part of the main sports club of the city too.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 19:16

iul wrote:AFAIK Baia Mare and Timisoara are part of the main sports club of the city too.


Constanta was part of Farul club as well, right?
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby 4N » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 19:20

victorsra wrote:Poland
- Arka Gdynia
- Lechia Gdansk


Legia Warsaw

https://legiarugby.com/

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 19:30

Poli Timisoara football went bankrupt and now there are two clubs from the city in the second division.... it is a bit messy situation to make possible to include in the list it looks like....

Baia Mare is in which football division? 4th? not professional, right?
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 19:31

4N wrote:
victorsra wrote:Poland
- Arka Gdynia
- Lechia Gdansk


Legia Warsaw

https://legiarugby.com/


Updated.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 20:27

victorsra wrote:
iul wrote:AFAIK Baia Mare and Timisoara are part of the main sports club of the city too.


Constanta was part of Farul club as well, right?


The old Constanta rugby club was RC Farul Constanta, but the current rugby club, ACS Tomitanii Constanta is a different organisation. Still, from the name, it sounds like it could be a multi-sport club.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 21:17

Yes, but the list is only of clubs with professional football. For exempe, basicaly all Argentina clubs and most Uruguayan and Chilena clubs are multi-sports. But amateur sports.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby vino_93 » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 21:19

Lithuania : zalgiris kaunas
(More known for basket, but they have a pro football team too)

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 22:43

There are some clubs with professional basketball that have rugby. For exemple, Obras Sanitarias in Argentina and Canoe in Spain (right, Armchair?)
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 22:45

victorsra wrote:Yes, but the list is only of clubs with professional football. For exempe, basicaly all Argentina clubs and most Uruguayan and Chilena clubs are multi-sports. But amateur sports.


Then there are three although today there is only one multi-sport clubs with a professional rugby club and a professional football club, Dinamo Bucuresti.

CSA Steaua Bucuresti and FCSB are now 2 separate entities.
CS Universitatea Cluj-Napoca and FC Universitatea Cluj are now separate.
Dinamo Bucuresti is a multi-sport club including professional football and professional rugby.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 23:07

But that's what I wrote in the first post: "So, let's list rugby teams that are part of multi-sports clubs with professional football. Obivously, most of these multisports clubs have completely independent football sections, which means in fact those are different clubs. But I'm sticking with the origins"
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Armchair Fan » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 23:15

victorsra wrote:There are some clubs with professional basketball that have rugby. For exemple, Obras Sanitarias in Argentina and Canoe in Spain (right, Armchair?)

Meh in many ways. Canoe is as amateur as you can find in Spanish basketball second-tier. With a lot of tradition and pedigree, but almost amateur. And in rugby it merged with CRC Pozuelo and only recently recreated a rugby school. So it's hard to say it's a pro basketball club with rugby section.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Mon, 07 Sep 2020, 23:30

but at least there's shared history. Like Racing Club de France - Racing Metro/Racing 92.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 01:49

victorsra wrote:But that's what I wrote in the first post: "So, let's list rugby teams that are part of multi-sports clubs with professional football. Obivously, most of these multisports clubs have completely independent football sections, which means in fact those are different clubs. But I'm sticking with the origins"


I agree with what you're doing. I don't think there are any English examples of this due to how soccer and rugby developed in the nineteenth century. A lot of football clubs began as cricket clubs. As football became codified clubs either became soccer clubs or rugby clubs. Many rugby clubs are still called Something FC. There are some multi-sport clubs with semiprofessional football teams but I don't think there are any in the football league (top 4 divisions). These multi-sport clubs are not as old as the clubs in the football league.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby vino_93 » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 08:46

victorsra wrote:There are some clubs with professional basketball that have rugby. For exemple, Obras Sanitarias in Argentina and Canoe in Spain (right, Armchair?)

Sialiu Siauliai in Lithuania too.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 10:35

There are at least 5 sports clubs called Enisei Krasnoyarsk, but I guess that is just a place name rather than these clubs being linked.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 14:04

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
victorsra wrote:But that's what I wrote in the first post: "So, let's list rugby teams that are part of multi-sports clubs with professional football. Obivously, most of these multisports clubs have completely independent football sections, which means in fact those are different clubs. But I'm sticking with the origins"


I agree with what you're doing. I don't think there are any English examples of this due to how soccer and rugby developed in the nineteenth century. A lot of football clubs began as cricket clubs. As football became codified clubs either became soccer clubs or rugby clubs. Many rugby clubs are still called Something FC. There are some multi-sport clubs with semiprofessional football teams but I don't think there are any in the football league (top 4 divisions). These multi-sport clubs are not as old as the clubs in the football league.

What happens in Continental Europe and Latin America is that clubs were founded as multi sports and all sports were together as part of the same club for decades, even after professionalism came to football. However, in some cases, to achieve better management of the football team, they split the section and make it an independent thing. The sort of split varies from club to club. But in some cases it is like what happened with Wasps, for exemple.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 15:02

Victorsra very interesting. Now, what we are seeing in Britain in some cases is wealthy individuals or organisations building sports empires. For example Wasps (rugby plus netball)
Leeds Rhinos (rugby league plus netball)
Saracens (rugby plus netball)
Bristol Sport (Football, rugby, basketball)
Loughborough Lightening (Loughborough university) (netball, women's cricket, women's rugby)

I think this is a really positive development and could help the growth of smaller sports such as arena sports and women's elite sports, and make professional sports more sustainable by sharing facilities and other costs.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby CraigChalmers » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 17:23

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
victorsra wrote:Yes, but the list is only of clubs with professional football. For exempe, basicaly all Argentina clubs and most Uruguayan and Chilena clubs are multi-sports. But amateur sports.


Then there are three although today there is only one multi-sport clubs with a professional rugby club and a professional football club, Dinamo Bucuresti.

CSA Steaua Bucuresti and FCSB are now 2 separate entities.
CS Universitatea Cluj-Napoca and FC Universitatea Cluj are now separate.
Dinamo Bucuresti is a multi-sport club including professional football and professional rugby.


CSA Steaua Bucharesti and FCSB may be separate entities, however both of them have football teams. CSA are currently in Liga III - not sure how professional they are, but they are just about to open a brand new 31,000 seat stadium, so I don't think they will be planning to hang about there for long!

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Tue, 08 Sep 2020, 17:54

CraigChalmers wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
victorsra wrote:Yes, but the list is only of clubs with professional football. For exempe, basicaly all Argentina clubs and most Uruguayan and Chilena clubs are multi-sports. But amateur sports.


Then there are three although today there is only one multi-sport clubs with a professional rugby club and a professional football club, Dinamo Bucuresti.

CSA Steaua Bucuresti and FCSB are now 2 separate entities.
CS Universitatea Cluj-Napoca and FC Universitatea Cluj are now separate.
Dinamo Bucuresti is a multi-sport club including professional football and professional rugby.


CSA Steaua Bucharesti and FCSB may be separate entities, however both of them have football teams. CSA are currently in Liga III - not sure how professional they are, but they are just about to open a brand new 31,000 seat stadium, so I don't think they will be planning to hang about there for long!


It's an extraordinary situation. Both clubs claim to be the real Steaua Bucuresti.

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