Tier 2 & 3 Rugby Forum

Multi-sport Cities

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 12:08

To be fair those are cricket teams. You can't name them the Birmingham Borings, the Lancastershire Lames, the Fulham Fallasleeps or the Yorkshire Yawns. :D
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 12:27

Figaro wrote:
sk 88 wrote:The teams are:
Manchester Originals
Northern Superchargers
Birmingham Phoenix
Trent Rockets
Welsh Fire
London Spirit
Oval Invincibles
Southern Brave

So three have city names, one country, two directions, one stadium name and one river.


Some of those are cringeworthy. Manchester Originals sounds like a variety of toffee. Trent rockets sounds like a train, Northern superchargers like a government scheme to boost a local economy


:lol:

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 12:35

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote: But I do think that American football is looking closer to being professional in Germany and being the second football code, rather than rugby.


The NFL Europa had in its last season a record 20k average with 5 German teams out of 6. It wasn't sustainable apparently so I see no way how American Football will ever be sustainable at all.
Apart from that, there is no word for football code in Germany (you can build one easily with our famous composita structures with Fußballsport).
Football is soccer. Germans don't understand that football is a sport family in English with the speaker chosing the sport he likes the most to call it football.

So much said, AF has been the second biggest football code since the day a regular competition appeared. The first German final drew 4k in 1978 and in 1979 the average was 600 visitors, going up to 11k for the final in 1981. I doubt any German rugby final has done so good in the last 50 years.


Unsustainable because they have a squad of 50+ players for a game where you only have eleven players on the field at once. Germanize it. Make it more efficient. Limit the squad sizes and substitutions. Make every player do two jobs. It'll be more fun for the players if they get to defend and attack, and they'll have to be fitter. A new football code will be born. German Fussball. Every country should have its own code of football.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby thatrugbyguy » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 12:48

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote: But I do think that American football is looking closer to being professional in Germany and being the second football code, rather than rugby.


The NFL Europa had in its last season a record 20k average with 5 German teams out of 6. It wasn't sustainable apparently so I see no way how American Football will ever be sustainable at all.
Apart from that, there is no word for football code in Germany (you can build one easily with our famous composita structures with Fußballsport).
Football is soccer. Germans don't understand that football is a sport family in English with the speaker chosing the sport he likes the most to call it football.

So much said, AF has been the second biggest football code since the day a regular competition appeared. The first German final drew 4k in 1978 and in 1979 the average was 600 visitors, going up to 11k for the final in 1981. I doubt any German rugby final has done so good in the last 50 years.


With the NFL being a success in London it wouldn't surprise me if they would look to trying again in Europe. Their dream is to clearly have a team in London playing in the NFL but I think it's too difficult a task to do logistically, worse than Super Rugby. I think last time it failed in England with NFL Europe was because they kept moving the London team around. I actually do think there's enough of a fanbase in Europe to have another attempt at NFL Europe, but it would have to be treated as a serious competition and not a glorified trial for an NFL contract. 2 Teams in the UK, 2 in Germany and 1 each in a couple of other nations.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 13:32

Chester-Donnelly wrote:Unsustainable because they have a squad of 50+ players for a game where you only have eleven players on the field at once. Germanize it. Make it more efficient. Limit the squad sizes and substitutions. Make every player do two jobs. It'll be more fun for the players if they get to defend and attack, and they'll have to be fitter. A new football code will be born. German Fussball. Every country should have its own code of football.


We did that in 1917 by renaming a sport invented by a Danish guy to Handball and modifying it to being a contact sport until 1919. And as we love innovations and are not afraid to take over good ideas from other nations, it is now played indoors and not on a football-sized-pitch like it used to be. Fußball has since the 1900s and will never have again any other meaning than soccer.
Last edited by RugbyLiebe on Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 13:58, edited 1 time in total.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 13:50

thatrugbyguy wrote:
RugbyLiebe wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote: But I do think that American football is looking closer to being professional in Germany and being the second football code, rather than rugby.


The NFL Europa had in its last season a record 20k average with 5 German teams out of 6. It wasn't sustainable apparently so I see no way how American Football will ever be sustainable at all.
Apart from that, there is no word for football code in Germany (you can build one easily with our famous composita structures with Fußballsport).
Football is soccer. Germans don't understand that football is a sport family in English with the speaker chosing the sport he likes the most to call it football.

So much said, AF has been the second biggest football code since the day a regular competition appeared. The first German final drew 4k in 1978 and in 1979 the average was 600 visitors, going up to 11k for the final in 1981. I doubt any German rugby final has done so good in the last 50 years.


With the NFL being a success in London it wouldn't surprise me if they would look to trying again in Europe. Their dream is to clearly have a team in London playing in the NFL but I think it's too difficult a task to do logistically, worse than Super Rugby. I think last time it failed in England with NFL Europe was because they kept moving the London team around. I actually do think there's enough of a fanbase in Europe to have another attempt at NFL Europe, but it would have to be treated as a serious competition and not a glorified trial for an NFL contract. 2 Teams in the UK, 2 in Germany and 1 each in a couple of other nations.


I don't know how the NFL conference system works, but I think for it to be popular in UK it will need to be the real NFL, not a European copy, so I think a European conference would be the best option.
2 teams in UK?. I would probably put them both in London. Maybe one in West London and one in East London.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 14:52

Figaro wrote:
sk 88 wrote:The teams are:
Manchester Originals
Northern Superchargers
Birmingham Phoenix
Trent Rockets
Welsh Fire
London Spirit
Oval Invincibles
Southern Brave

So three have city names, one country, two directions, one stadium name and one river.


Some of those are cringeworthy. Manchester Originals sounds like a variety of toffee. Trent rockets sounds like a train, Northern superchargers like a government scheme to boost a local economy


Silly second names aside, in most cases the home team is simply ignoring the other feeder teams. Even Trent Rockets is clearly referencing their home ground "Trent Bridge", although they can be sneaky and pretend they are referencing the river directly. The only two teams not doing this are Northern Monkeys and Southern Softies.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby thatrugbyguy » Wed, 17 Jun 2020, 15:07

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
I don't know how the NFL conference system works, but I think for it to be popular in UK it will need to be the real NFL, not a European copy, so I think a European conference would be the best option.
2 teams in UK?. I would probably put them both in London. Maybe one in West London and one in East London.


If I'm not mistaken the NFL conference system works on some type of rotational basis. 32 teams split into 2 Conferences with 4 divisions within each. Everyone plays their divisional rivals twice a year for 6 games, the other 10 games are split among teams in their own conference and the rival conference. Over a 2 or 3 year period all 32 teams eventually play each other home and away. Or something along those lines but that's my understanding. I'm sure one of the Americans here will point out how wrong I am though, lol.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby NaBUru38 » Thu, 18 Jun 2020, 17:42

Uruguay invented indoor football (Brazilians invented the small ball) and handball (balón).

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby victorsra » Thu, 18 Jun 2020, 18:12

Yes, indoor soccer started in Montevideo during the 1920s in the YMCA (institution that also is where basketball abd volleyball were born, in USA). However, the current futsal code (the code recognised and organized by FIFA) was created in Brazil, in São Paulo's YMCA in the 1950s. But FIFA'S futsal is not the only form of indoor soccer. There are other forms, specialy in North America, that are not recognised by FIFA.

So, we can say Uruguay invented indoor soccer and Brazil invented the futsal code.
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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Thomas » Thu, 18 Jun 2020, 20:44

Germany did have a professional league but it collapsed in itself. I personally know coaches who used to travel year in year out to coach the German season and then back to their country, they would support NFL Europe teams. However financially it became unsustainable.

The problem with American Football in Europe (UK Included) they were under IFAF Rules, while NFL Europe was under NFL Rules with a limited number of local talent, both were at different purposes and goals.

NFL has stated publicly that they are sports entertainment hence why they are not going to have a team in the UK or Europe anytime soon.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Working Class Rugger » Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 06:40

Thomas wrote:Germany did have a professional league but it collapsed in itself. I personally know coaches who used to travel year in year out to coach the German season and then back to their country, they would support NFL Europe teams. However financially it became unsustainable.

The problem with American Football in Europe (UK Included) they were under IFAF Rules, while NFL Europe was under NFL Rules with a limited number of local talent, both were at different purposes and goals.

NFL has stated publicly that they are sports entertainment hence why they are not going to have a team in the UK or Europe anytime soon.


And there's no need to have a team in England or a European league. Not for something like the NFL. All they want or need is to foster a fan base that they can monetise. Which can be done without all the expensive overhead of a franchise.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 06:56

Thomas wrote:Germany did have a professional league but it collapsed in itself. I personally know coaches who used to travel year in year out to coach the German season and then back to their country, they would support NFL Europe teams. However financially it became unsustainable.


Which league are you talking about? Do you realize, that having some players and coaches flying over for 2-3 months doesn't make a league "professional"? If you mean the NRL Europa (not Europe btw), that's a different thing. Most German AF teams would have some players like that in their ranks, even rugby clubs have some players like that. Most players are young guys, who just want to make some new experiences, a bit like work&travel.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Thomas » Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 09:57

RugbyLiebe wrote:
Thomas wrote:Germany did have a professional league but it collapsed in itself. I personally know coaches who used to travel year in year out to coach the German season and then back to their country, they would support NFL Europe teams. However financially it became unsustainable.


Which league are you talking about? Do you realize, that having some players and coaches flying over for 2-3 months doesn't make a league "professional"? If you mean the NRL Europa (not Europe btw), that's a different thing. Most German AF teams would have some players like that in their ranks, even rugby clubs have some players like that. Most players are young guys, who just want to make some new experiences, a bit like work&travel.


I am talking about GFL the American Football competition, they had people there for 4 - 6 months. Some of these teams were professional irrespective of what other people. I know because I was paid to do some work there and some of the first American Football women coaches to work professionally before heading back to the US and NFL. They came out of Germany, Netherlands and NFL EUROPE.

They were really taking it seriously and get players in the try outs and draft. I am talking late 90's early 2000's when Braunschweig Lions and Hamburg Blue Devils won everything. some of the setups would have put Rugby to shame in those days.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 10:13

Thomas wrote:They were really taking it seriously and get players in the try outs and draft. I am talking late 90's early 2000's when Braunschweig Lions and Hamburg Blue Devils won everything. some of the setups would have put Rugby to shame in those days.


The NFL Europa was fully professional. The GFL had some more or less professional setups like the two you named, but they never went full-pro (they never played all of their players full-time to play AF). The league itself has always been amateur. It's like saying the German Bundesliga in rugby was pro, just because the HRK payed most of its players or many other clubs pay some players.
It doesn't take much to create setups which put Rugby to shame to be brutally honest.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 14:26

To put these various sports into perspective, obviously Premier League soccer pays obscene wages. For the other sports, the salary cap per team are:
Premiership rugby: £5m reduced from about £7m due to impact of Covid 19.
Super League (Rugby League) £2.1m
Cricket £750k
BBL £200k plus your 2 top earning British players.
Netball £75k.
I can't find any information on EIHL but I expect it's more than basketball but less than cricket.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby 4N » Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 16:43

NFL Europe was renamed NFL Europa in its final season. I used to watch it regularly, I remember Kurt Warner playing for Amsterdam.

The crowds in Germany tended to be very good. Frankfurt got close to 30k every year.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby CraigChalmers » Sun, 21 Jun 2020, 13:06

Chester-Donnelly wrote:I have looked at which cities in Britain have top division sports teams for what I think are the top 6 professional and semi professional team sports in Britain.
Soccer, cricket, rugby (both codes), ice hockey, basketball, netball.

I have considered Premier League and Championship soccer to be top division for this because the smallest Championship soccer club is much bigger than the biggest ice hockey, basketball or netball club. But that is where I draw the line as almost every large town has a team in the football league.

I am biased towards team ball sports. Speedway is a popular professional team sport but I haven't considered that.

Two of Britain's biggest cities do not make my list, Birmingham and Liverpool. Both are soccer cities, each with 2 big teams. Birmingham also has Warwickshire County Cricket Club. Both cities have excellent arenas for hosting big sporting events. Birmingham will be hosting the 2022 Commonwealth Games. But both cities have had several attempts of establishing professional sports teams in other sports, and each one has failed.

The cities in my list are in 9 of Britain's 11 regions. There are no cities in South East or East of England on the list, because the centre of those regions' sport and culture is Greater London, which is itself a region.

I have ranked the cities because I like to rank things.

1. London. Top division sports teams in all of the 6 sports except Ice Hockey. 4 Premier League, 4 Championship soccer clubs. 2012 Olympic Games host city. All of the country's national sports' national stadiums. Also hosts some NFL games.
2. Manchester. 2 of England's biggest soccer clubs. First class cricket team and Netball Superleague team. Old Trafford is the biggest stadium outside of London and hosts the Rugby Super League grand final. 2002 Commonwealth Games host city. National Basketball Performance Centre. National Cycling Centre. There are also top level basketball and ice hockey teams called "Manchester" but their homes are outside Manchester (but within Greater Manchester).
3. Glasgow. 2014 Commonwealth Games host city. Home of Scotland's 2 big soccer teams, and the national stadium. Sports teams for all of the 6 sports except cricket.
4. Cardiff. Sports teams for all of the 6 sports except basketball.
5. Leicester. Home of 2 of England's top sports teams in soccer and rugby, and a first class cricket team. Also a basketball club and the British Basketball League HQ.
6. Bristol. Teams in soccer, rugby, cricket and basketball.
7. Leeds. Teams in soccer, rugby league, cricket and netball. RFL HQ.
8. Worcester. Teams in rugby, cricket, basketball and netball.
9. Newcastle. Teams in soccer, rugby and basketball.
10. Coventry. Teams in rugby, netball and ice hockey. And soccer if Wasps and Coventry City FC can come to an agreement for the soccer team to move back to the Ricoh Arena.
11. Nottingham. Teams in soccer, cricket and ice hockey. Home of the National Ice Centre.
12. Sheffield. Teams in soccer, ice hockey and basketball.


Not sure how you can conclude Glasgow has teams in all 6 sports except cricket. Rugby League barely exists in Scotland (yes we have had some success at international level; including a notable draw with NZ a few seasons back, but this has been achieved almost entirely by selecting Scots qualified players from the north of England); OK Glasgow has a club in the Scottish National League, but they were formed a year ago and got into the 'top' league because so far as I can tell there are only 3 other clubs in the country. Shinty is probably a bigger sport in Glasgow than Rugby League - Glasgow Mid Argyll playing in the 2nd tier at present. Oh, and Strathclyde Sirens in Netball's Superleague are a much bigger deal too.

There are loads more Cricket Clubs in Scotland, however there is no national league but rather regional leagues - and I'm pretty sure there will be Glasgow clubs in the top flight of the western premier league.

By the way, I believe Glasgow is the only city in Europe that has hosted 2 European semi-finals at the same time: Celtic hosting Inter Milan in the Champions Cup and Rangers hosting Bayern Munich in the Cup Winners Cup in 1972. Combined attendance at the 2 games was 155,000

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Sun, 21 Jun 2020, 14:52

CraigChalmers wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:I have looked at which cities in Britain have top division sports teams for what I think are the top 6 professional and semi professional team sports in Britain.
Soccer, cricket, rugby (both codes), ice hockey, basketball, netball.

I have considered Premier League and Championship soccer to be top division for this because the smallest Championship soccer club is much bigger than the biggest ice hockey, basketball or netball club. But that is where I draw the line as almost every large town has a team in the football league.

I am biased towards team ball sports. Speedway is a popular professional team sport but I haven't considered that.

Two of Britain's biggest cities do not make my list, Birmingham and Liverpool. Both are soccer cities, each with 2 big teams. Birmingham also has Warwickshire County Cricket Club. Both cities have excellent arenas for hosting big sporting events. Birmingham will be hosting the 2022 Commonwealth Games. But both cities have had several attempts of establishing professional sports teams in other sports, and each one has failed.

The cities in my list are in 9 of Britain's 11 regions. There are no cities in South East or East of England on the list, because the centre of those regions' sport and culture is Greater London, which is itself a region.

I have ranked the cities because I like to rank things.

1. London. Top division sports teams in all of the 6 sports except Ice Hockey. 4 Premier League, 4 Championship soccer clubs. 2012 Olympic Games host city. All of the country's national sports' national stadiums. Also hosts some NFL games.
2. Manchester. 2 of England's biggest soccer clubs. First class cricket team and Netball Superleague team. Old Trafford is the biggest stadium outside of London and hosts the Rugby Super League grand final. 2002 Commonwealth Games host city. National Basketball Performance Centre. National Cycling Centre. There are also top level basketball and ice hockey teams called "Manchester" but their homes are outside Manchester (but within Greater Manchester).
3. Glasgow. 2014 Commonwealth Games host city. Home of Scotland's 2 big soccer teams, and the national stadium. Sports teams for all of the 6 sports except cricket.
4. Cardiff. Sports teams for all of the 6 sports except basketball.
5. Leicester. Home of 2 of England's top sports teams in soccer and rugby, and a first class cricket team. Also a basketball club and the British Basketball League HQ.
6. Bristol. Teams in soccer, rugby, cricket and basketball.
7. Leeds. Teams in soccer, rugby league, cricket and netball. RFL HQ.
8. Worcester. Teams in rugby, cricket, basketball and netball.
9. Newcastle. Teams in soccer, rugby and basketball.
10. Coventry. Teams in rugby, netball and ice hockey. And soccer if Wasps and Coventry City FC can come to an agreement for the soccer team to move back to the Ricoh Arena.
11. Nottingham. Teams in soccer, cricket and ice hockey. Home of the National Ice Centre.
12. Sheffield. Teams in soccer, ice hockey and basketball.


Not sure how you can conclude Glasgow has teams in all 6 sports except cricket. Rugby League barely exists in Scotland (yes we have had some success at international level; including a notable draw with NZ a few seasons back, but this has been achieved almost entirely by selecting Scots qualified players from the north of England); OK Glasgow has a club in the Scottish National League, but they were formed a year ago and got into the 'top' league because so far as I can tell there are only 3 other clubs in the country. Shinty is probably a bigger sport in Glasgow than Rugby League - Glasgow Mid Argyll playing in the 2nd tier at present. Oh, and Strathclyde Sirens in Netball's Superleague are a much bigger deal too.

There are loads more Cricket Clubs in Scotland, however there is no national league but rather regional leagues - and I'm pretty sure there will be Glasgow clubs in the top flight of the western premier league.

By the way, I believe Glasgow is the only city in Europe that has hosted 2 European semi-finals at the same time: Celtic hosting Inter Milan in the Champions Cup and Rangers hosting Bayern Munich in the Cup Winners Cup in 1972. Combined attendance at the 2 games was 155,000


For the purpose of this I was treating rugby as one sport. There are no British cities with a top flight teams in rugby union and rugby league. Salford City Reds and Sale Sharks share the AJ Bell Stadium but that isn't actually in Manchester.
The Six sports I was talking about are:
Football: Celtic and Rangers.
Rugby: Glasgow Warriors.
Ice Hockey: Glasgow Clan.
Basketball: Glasgow Rocks.
Netball: Strathclyde Sirens.
Cricket: no first class cricket team.

I'm afraid I don't know much about shinty.

I placed Manchester above Glasgow because of the facilities they have and how the city has successfully branded itself as the de facto capital city of North West England. But a lot of Manchester's sports teams are in Greater Manchester but not Manchester. Purely based on top flight teams by city Glasgow should probably be ranked second after London, and only loses out to London because London has so many Premier League football clubs.

I was a bit surprised Edinburgh doesn't have more top flight sports teams.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Figaro » Sun, 21 Jun 2020, 21:32

What about Dublin. I know you've been talking about the UK but I would imagine Dublin has a top flight team in a host of international sports as well as.all the various Gaelic ones.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby CraigChalmers » Mon, 22 Jun 2020, 09:30

Chester-Donnelly wrote:
For the purpose of this I was treating rugby as one sport. There are no British cities with a top flight teams in rugby union and rugby league. Salford City Reds and Sale Sharks share the AJ Bell Stadium but that isn't actually in Manchester.
The Six sports I was talking about are:
Football: Celtic and Rangers.
Rugby: Glasgow Warriors.
Ice Hockey: Glasgow Clan.
Basketball: Glasgow Rocks.
Netball: Strathclyde Sirens.
Cricket: no first class cricket team.

I'm afraid I don't know much about shinty.

I placed Manchester above Glasgow because of the facilities they have and how the city has successfully branded itself as the de facto capital city of North West England. But a lot of Manchester's sports teams are in Greater Manchester but not Manchester. Purely based on top flight teams by city Glasgow should probably be ranked second after London, and only loses out to London because London has so many Premier League football clubs.

I was a bit surprised Edinburgh doesn't have more top flight sports teams.


Ah, fair enough.

Think Edinburgh suffer from a lack of suitable venues - they have had top flight clubs in Basketball (Glasgow Rocks started life in Edinburgh before moving West to a far better arena), Ice Hockey (Edinburgh Capitals were left with nowhere to play after losing the use of Murrayfield Ice Rink to another club, who then had their application to join the elite league rejected) and I think Netball (Sirens were originally formed to play at Oriam - Scotlands high performance centre - before opting instead to base themselves at Glasgow's Emirates Arena). Edinburgh does have a team in the top flight of Womens Basketball (Caledonia Pride - but even they play some of their games at the Emirates Arena)

I think Belfast should probably have made your list too - top flight teams in 3 of the 6 sports you listed: Soccer (Linfield, Glentorran, Cliftonville, Crusaders), Rugby Union (Ulster) & Ice Hockey (Belfast Giants). However, Belfast is also home to Antrim GAA, who field teams in both Gaelic Football and Hurling.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Mon, 22 Jun 2020, 12:33

CraigChalmers wrote:
Chester-Donnelly wrote:
For the purpose of this I was treating rugby as one sport. There are no British cities with a top flight teams in rugby union and rugby league. Salford City Reds and Sale Sharks share the AJ Bell Stadium but that isn't actually in Manchester.
The Six sports I was talking about are:
Football: Celtic and Rangers.
Rugby: Glasgow Warriors.
Ice Hockey: Glasgow Clan.
Basketball: Glasgow Rocks.
Netball: Strathclyde Sirens.
Cricket: no first class cricket team.

I'm afraid I don't know much about shinty.

I placed Manchester above Glasgow because of the facilities they have and how the city has successfully branded itself as the de facto capital city of North West England. But a lot of Manchester's sports teams are in Greater Manchester but not Manchester. Purely based on top flight teams by city Glasgow should probably be ranked second after London, and only loses out to London because London has so many Premier League football clubs.

I was a bit surprised Edinburgh doesn't have more top flight sports teams.


Ah, fair enough.

Think Edinburgh suffer from a lack of suitable venues - they have had top flight clubs in Basketball (Glasgow Rocks started life in Edinburgh before moving West to a far better arena), Ice Hockey (Edinburgh Capitals were left with nowhere to play after losing the use of Murrayfield Ice Rink to another club, who then had their application to join the elite league rejected) and I think Netball (Sirens were originally formed to play at Oriam - Scotlands high performance centre - before opting instead to base themselves at Glasgow's Emirates Arena). Edinburgh does have a team in the top flight of Womens Basketball (Caledonia Pride - but even they play some of their games at the Emirates Arena)

I think Belfast should probably have made your list too - top flight teams in 3 of the 6 sports you listed: Soccer (Linfield, Glentorran, Cliftonville, Crusaders), Rugby Union (Ulster) & Ice Hockey (Belfast Giants). However, Belfast is also home to Antrim GAA, who field teams in both Gaelic Football and Hurling.


I think I probably should have included Belfast. I didn't do enough research. I don't know enough about GAA but it turns out Belfast is not in the top tier for GAA sports, and Belfast's Ulster GAA stadium Casement Park is currently closed and requires redevelopment, so I can basically ignore GAA in comparing Belfast with other UK cities.
Belfast has Ulster Rugby team, the Northern Ireland football team, 4 top tier soccer teams, Belfast Giants ice hockey team, and Northern Knights first class cricket team. Northern Ireland also has a netball team which is ranked 11th in the world which isn't bad.
I think I would rank Belfast as high as 5th because although it doesn't have Premier League football teams or a Super League netball team, it has national teams instead. Belfast is a capital city after all.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Mon, 22 Jun 2020, 14:48

Figaro wrote:What about Dublin. I know you've been talking about the UK but I would imagine Dublin has a top flight team in a host of international sports as well as.all the various Gaelic ones.


Dublin has Croke Park, the home of GAA, 82,300 capacity stadium, the third largest in Europe. Dublin has teams in the top tier of the Gaelic football and Hurling inter-county championships. In GAA sports it is the number one city in the world.
Dublin also has the Aviva stadium, the home of the Ireland rugby team and the Republic of Ireland soccer team. Leinster is one of the top rugby clubs in the world. Dublin has 4 teams in the League of Ireland Premier Division (soccer).
Dublin is the home of the Ireland cricket team and the Leinster Lightning first class cricket team which play at the 11,500 capacity Malahide cricket ground.
Dublin also has the national acquatic centre and the national Basketball centre.
Basketball, netball and ice hockey are very small sports in Ireland. The main team sports are Gaelic football, hurling, soccer, rugby union and cricket. Ireland does rather well at the latter 3 for a fairly small country.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby NaBUru38 » Mon, 22 Jun 2020, 18:17

Neither Irish team has had any recent success at the Fifa World Cup or the UEFA Euro.

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Re: Multi-sport Cities

Postby Chester-Donnelly » Mon, 22 Jun 2020, 20:40

NaBUru38 wrote:Neither Irish team has had any recent success at the Fifa World Cup or the UEFA Euro.


They would be much better if they had just one team.

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