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Autumn Nations Cup 2020

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Canalina » Wed, 18 Nov 2020, 10:00

Raven wrote:2- It is really hard to understand how they didn't have a contingency plan as to an alternative date to play these matches, it's weak that the alternative of the tournament is a plain "points to the 'uninfected team'"...

Agree with what you say before, but, again, which this alternative date could have been? Maybe I'm just poor of imagination but I can't imagine any alternative date, in a one-month-all-weekends tournament and in front of a virus which infects people for several days in the best case

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby brules » Wed, 18 Nov 2020, 13:01

Raven wrote: What I don't understand is, and maybe we can agree or further discuss; 1- Against France there were 4 cases, my first thought was, don't let those 4 play and field a team with what is left of the squad (perhaps very unprofessional for these days), clearly after seeing what happened, that would have been a Corona Bomb given on how it spread after?, or was there a breach after knowing of those cases?

In soccer it works like that. Those positive are isolated the others keep training and playing. But restrictions and the frequency of tests are very high. In Pro14 it is different: games are postponed even with small numbers.

The fact that the game was called off with 4 positives means that either the protocols are not as tight as the soccer's one or they knew that there was a breach. imho.

In theory they should implement measures to limit the virus diffusion as much as possible, even during training. Going from 4 to 29 in less then a week is quite a lot, very bad luck.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby victorsra » Wed, 18 Nov 2020, 16:29

Raven wrote:
Armchair Fan wrote:
Canalina wrote:I can't imagine plans B or C, honestly.

Having a Barbarian side training, having asked Russia or Romania to be ready just in case, even Portugal is training right now... If this is done for the TV money, they should have had plans to offer all the expected matches.


Seems a lot easier said than done,

I get your point (and the hint of frustration as well - also shared, as "we" as an audience are deprived of more international rugby, specially T2 Rugby, which we don't see that often) but do you imagine the likes of Spain / Russia or Romania training "just in case"? and once they are given a hypothetical 'green light' they would have to travel to a given 'last minute' location, with diverse sanitary protocols... Perhaps a BaaBaa's side, but see what happened to 'their' last fixture v England!

Nah, a replacement team was never going to be a real option. What I don't understand is, and maybe we can agree or further discuss; 1- Against France there were 4 cases, my first thought was, don't let those 4 play and field a team with what is left of the squad (perhaps very unprofessional for these days), clearly after seeing what happened, that would have been a Corona Bomb given on how it spread after?, or was there a breach after knowing of those cases? 2- It is really hard to understand how they didn't have a contingency plan as to an alternative date to play these matches, it's weak that the alternative of the tournament is a plain "points to the 'uninfected team'"... kind of the same feeling I had when the RWC games where postponed because of venues that where affected with the Typhoon, you know it may happen, have an alterative date / venue ready!

On a humour note, isn't this what most T2 followers have been waiting for? a 6 Nations + Georgia? :D So, hurray! a toast to the "7 Nations" finally - for 1 time only :lol:


I don't think any back up plan would be realistic. I never saw a competition with a team training "just in case". It costs $ and it is definitly demoralizing for the "back up" team.

However, the Nations Cup's fault was to not take a measure when the first cases appeared in Fiji. They had 7 and that's a big yellow alert if you don't have calendar to reschedule matches. They should've acted at that precise moment and invited Russia or Romania. But they knew that would be traumatic (PIs would slam the 6N for sure), so they bet things would get better (or not worse).

In fact, they should invite Russia or Romania or Spain right now for the final round at least, otherwise Italy will leave another tournament winless :oops: With Fiji's W.O. we probably won't see Italy vs Georgia (unless Wales "helps").

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby ficcp » Wed, 18 Nov 2020, 21:18

It is hard to see Wales defeated by Georgia. So Italy would probably face Wales for the 5th. place. Your solution to invite NOW another team to face Georgia for the 7th.place is a good one. Any of the 3 proposed teams would enjoy to face the Georgians.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby novac » Thu, 19 Nov 2020, 07:38

I am sure Romania would love to play a game against Georgia.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby vino_93 » Thu, 19 Nov 2020, 15:01

In a fortnight, Fiji should be able to play.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Tobar » Thu, 19 Nov 2020, 22:22

I don't see any realistic way that any other team can join at this stage. There are only 2 weeks left until it's over and teams would have to train and quarantine for 2 weeks. The logistics of preparing that is a bit of a nightmare. The only option I can see is Spain because they are near the remaining countries and have already played against Uruguay. But even that is a stretch.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Armchair Fan » Thu, 19 Nov 2020, 23:54

Portugal is in a better position than Spain. They have their squad gathered right now.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Armchair Fan » Fri, 20 Nov 2020, 12:19

Scotland-Fiji cancelled too.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby kearnc25 » Fri, 20 Nov 2020, 19:35

In fairness this tournament isn't important at all tbh if the games can happen cool but unless there is an obvious easy option B it wouldn't be worth it. It sucks but it is what it is with the pandemic.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby ficcp » Fri, 20 Nov 2020, 23:08

vino_93 wrote:In a fortnight, Fiji should be able to play.


To line up a team without much training for 3 weeks.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby GeoRugby » Sat, 21 Nov 2020, 19:09

Wales vs Georgia 18-0 Final score.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby kearnc25 » Sat, 21 Nov 2020, 19:12

Right so after Ireland broken my heart again I may be a bit grumpy but this is the tier two so thankfully I don't have to think about that. There are a few positives to take from this game for Georgia, the tackling was fantastic and in the last 30 they tried to play wide and stretch Wales in fact for a period of 15-20 mins they looked the better team. The negatives to me are the kicking game and the set piece. This Wales team are atrocious probably the worst they've been this century and the inability to score a point on them is probably case closed on the question are Georgia on this level for now. Still it's more exposure for the team to tier one competition which is only ever a good thing and the Georgia 8 is a hell of a player.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby fullbackace » Sat, 21 Nov 2020, 19:37

Our 2015 team would've won or at the very least come close to winning this game. We've lost a lot of quality over the last few years. The last time we played a tier 1 team that performed this badly was 2007 Ireland and we almost got the win. This time around we didn't make a single point. We played a terrible game and there is no excuse for it.
Don't Pray For Easy lives, Pray for enough Beer!

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby GeoRugby » Sat, 21 Nov 2020, 20:06

I am starting to doubt that Georgia will have new coach in 2021 with all this going round. Not good. As far as this game, an improved performance, solid defense, decent attacking game towards the end and an improvement in maul. Scrum remains a problem. I would have loved to see Mataradze. We've seen Gogichashvili in action, now lets give someone else a chance- see how they perform.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby kearnc25 » Sat, 21 Nov 2020, 20:18

fullbackace wrote:Our 2015 team would've won or at the very least come close to winning this game. We've lost a lot of quality over the last few years. The last time we played a tier 1 team that performed this badly was 2007 Ireland and we almost got the win. This time around we didn't make a single point. We played a terrible game and there is no excuse for it.



That is something that will be lost in all this, the opportunity has come 2 or 3 years to late for Georgia. This team isn't the 2015 team it isn't even the 2019 team. Best hope from it is that you walk away with the experience hope that more frequent tier one tests come even two a year would help and then sort the union out. The disruption internally will stop the team getting back to 2015 form.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby beber » Sat, 21 Nov 2020, 21:45

Big shame seeing Georgia's scrum destroyed like that
The defense was fairly impressive and they improved a lot their defense in maul
Gorgadze standout, he is going to be a world class player
Unfortunately, disastrous scrum cost them a lot, still, they never were really close to score a try unfortunately

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby dropkick » Sun, 22 Nov 2020, 09:29

What's up with Georgia's scrum these days?

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby GeoRugby » Sun, 22 Nov 2020, 11:06

dropkick wrote:What's up with Georgia's scrum these days?


Many factors, including key players retiring, injuries, young players trying to fill the big shoes and needing time to do so and an incorrect selection of players for some positions.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Tobar » Sun, 22 Nov 2020, 19:50

kearnc25 wrote:This Wales team are atrocious probably the worst they've been this century and the inability to score a point on them is probably case closed on the question are Georgia on this level for now.


Spot on analysis but I just want to focus on this one sentence. Going into this tournament I knew that people would put way too much stock into the results - either Georgia would play terribly and everyone would say they don’t deserve a spot or they would perform magnificently and everyone would start calling for promotion into the Six Nations.

We need to rephrase the question “is Georgia good enough to play in the Six Nations?” to “does Georgia deserve a shot?” There are two “shots” here, one is for playing against more Tier 1 teams and the second is to join the Six Nations.

We can unequivocally say that Georgia deserves more Tier 1 competition. Anyone who disagrees with this either has ulterior motives or doesn’t care about growing the sport.

As for the Six Nations question, this can get complicated and opens up a whole can of worms related to union finances and tradition. But I want to focus on one thing - comparing Georgia to Italy. Something to consider is the fact that Italy hasn’t fared too well despite being a part of the competition for 20 years and having multiple pro teams playing against this competition regularly. In the past two years they averaged a 23 point deficit against Six Nations teams (and this is also taking into account that they were relatively successful in 2019 with only a 10 point deficit against 3/4 teams). This is a very simple analysis but I think Georgia would be capable of very similar results against these countries if they get to play them 5+ times per year.

So take from that what you want. It’s not to suggest that Italy deserves to be taken down but we really shouldn’t be looking at Georgia’s results in a vacuum.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Warpath » Sun, 22 Nov 2020, 21:52

Wales will be hoping now Fiji's last game against them is cancelled too lol..shame really, if it wasn't for covid, we may be contesting the top 2 place in the pool :(

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby kearnc25 » Sun, 22 Nov 2020, 22:38

Tobar wrote:
kearnc25 wrote:This Wales team are atrocious probably the worst they've been this century and the inability to score a point on them is probably case closed on the question are Georgia on this level for now.


Spot on analysis but I just want to focus on this one sentence. Going into this tournament I knew that people would put way too much stock into the results - either Georgia would play terribly and everyone would say they don’t deserve a spot or they would perform magnificently and everyone would start calling for promotion into the Six Nations.

We need to rephrase the question “is Georgia good enough to play in the Six Nations?” to “does Georgia deserve a shot?” There are two “shots” here, one is for playing against more Tier 1 teams and the second is to join the Six Nations.

We can unequivocally say that Georgia deserves more Tier 1 competition. Anyone who disagrees with this either has ulterior motives or doesn’t care about growing the sport.

As for the Six Nations question, this can get complicated and opens up a whole can of worms related to union finances and tradition. But I want to focus on one thing - comparing Georgia to Italy. Something to consider is the fact that Italy hasn’t fared too well despite being a part of the competition for 20 years and having multiple pro teams playing against this competition regularly. In the past two years they averaged a 23 point deficit against Six Nations teams (and this is also taking into account that they were relatively successful in 2019 with only a 10 point deficit against 3/4 teams). This is a very simple analysis but I think Georgia would be capable of very similar results against these countries if they get to play them 5+ times per year.

So take from that what you want. It’s not to suggest that Italy deserves to be taken down but we really shouldn’t be looking at Georgia’s results in a vacuum.



This is a good comment, however I wasn't talking at all about whether or not Georgia should be in the six nations just on what their level is at the moment. So while I agree with the gist of your point it wasn't really what I was focusing on rather that the 2015 side is gone and this one needs a lot of work before regaining the same form.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby kearnc25 » Sun, 22 Nov 2020, 22:39

Warpath wrote:Wales will be hoping now Fiji's last game against them is cancelled too lol..shame really, if it wasn't for covid, we may be contesting the top 2 place in the pool :(


Nah they'd probably want to play the game and find some form/ blood new players.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby Tobar » Mon, 23 Nov 2020, 02:38

kearnc25 wrote:
Tobar wrote:
kearnc25 wrote:This Wales team are atrocious probably the worst they've been this century and the inability to score a point on them is probably case closed on the question are Georgia on this level for now.


Spot on analysis but I just want to focus on this one sentence. Going into this tournament I knew that people would put way too much stock into the results - either Georgia would play terribly and everyone would say they don’t deserve a spot or they would perform magnificently and everyone would start calling for promotion into the Six Nations.

We need to rephrase the question “is Georgia good enough to play in the Six Nations?” to “does Georgia deserve a shot?” There are two “shots” here, one is for playing against more Tier 1 teams and the second is to join the Six Nations.

We can unequivocally say that Georgia deserves more Tier 1 competition. Anyone who disagrees with this either has ulterior motives or doesn’t care about growing the sport.

As for the Six Nations question, this can get complicated and opens up a whole can of worms related to union finances and tradition. But I want to focus on one thing - comparing Georgia to Italy. Something to consider is the fact that Italy hasn’t fared too well despite being a part of the competition for 20 years and having multiple pro teams playing against this competition regularly. In the past two years they averaged a 23 point deficit against Six Nations teams (and this is also taking into account that they were relatively successful in 2019 with only a 10 point deficit against 3/4 teams). This is a very simple analysis but I think Georgia would be capable of very similar results against these countries if they get to play them 5+ times per year.

So take from that what you want. It’s not to suggest that Italy deserves to be taken down but we really shouldn’t be looking at Georgia’s results in a vacuum.



This is a good comment, however I wasn't talking at all about whether or not Georgia should be in the six nations just on what their level is at the moment. So while I agree with the gist of your point it wasn't really what I was focusing on rather that the 2015 side is gone and this one needs a lot of work before regaining the same form.


Yes I realized after posting that this isn’t what you said but I already put all that work in so I left it up. Still something that was on my mind.

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Re: Autumn Nations Cup 2020

Postby BigG » Mon, 23 Nov 2020, 09:13

Warpath wrote:Wales will be hoping now Fiji's last game against them is cancelled too lol..shame really, if it wasn't for covid, we may be contesting the top 2 place in the pool :(


Is there any hope for Fiji's return?

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