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OLD STUFF - rarities

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Tue, 17 Sep 2019, 08:07

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A report about the first ever Fiji's and Samoa's test match appeared this morning on facebook. It was played in 1924 and it remained famous also due to the supposed presence of a tree in the middle of the field. They played a second test one month after, after the Fiji's tour in Tonga

The report is too long so I just link it http://www.facebook.com/pacificmodernhi ... =3&theater

To RugInt: I think there's a mistake in your cards, the first Samoa-Fiji match ended 0-6 and the second 9-3, while you report a samoan win and a draw
http://www.rugbyinternational.net/countries/samoa.htm
http://www.rugbyinternational.net/countries/fiji.htm

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Edgar » Tue, 17 Sep 2019, 14:56

Great find, Canalina. I once had a book about rugby history which mentioned a few quirky facts such as this, but that's the first time I've seen photographic evidence! Pacific Island rugby has a long history but has been largely neglected by the rest of the international rugby community, not only on the pitch, but also in the press and among the game's historians. Fiji met Tonga biennually from 1924 til 1934 - playing barefoot, apparently! The Fijians first donned boots in 1938 for their series against NZ Maori, which they drew. Fiji were generally the flag-bearer for Pacific rugby and fixtures with Tonga became less common after WWII as they played further series' against the Maori - and also the Wallabies (with whom they also drew their inaugural series).

Meanwhile, little known fact is the All Blacks played an unofficial match against Fiji in Suva in 1913 on return from Europe & North America, winning 67-3 - a huge score in those days, obviously.

From the time his excellency kicked off till referee Hill blew the final whistle, a great exhibition of what the training and practice of professionalism can bring a game to was given to the Suva public by the All Blacks and a lesson such as a professional musician might give to his pupil was given to the local rugby football aspirants. There was of course never the least suggestions of the local team making a game of it, though McDermott was fortunate to score a try in the first half. The New Zealanders combination was as perfect as their speed was terrific, no sooner did one of them start to rush than the rest lined up in an slanting line behind him, in order that the ball might be passed up the field. The dodging was great, and it was a common sight to see one of men in black successfully dodge the whole of the white clad team. Storr opened the scoring at the beginning of the game and try upon try and goal upon goal was scored till the whistle blew with the score 67-3.


http://rugbymuseum.co.nz/tdih-december- ... r-in-fiji/

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After their sixteen match tour of the USA and Canada, where they outclassed their opposition, the 1913 All Blacks played an unofficial match against a Fijian side whilst their ship was in Suva. The referee was Billy Hill of Australia who had been invited by the California Rugby Union to referee the Stanford v California match, had controlled two of the All Black matches (including the test against All-America) and was returning home on the same ship as the All Blacks.

BTW, I've heard the "Invincible" All Blacks played the Cook Islands on the way home in the mid-20s, which the locals claim ended in a scoreless draw. No doubt just a scrimmage - if that.

& speaking of 'Old Stuff,' how about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCQGIhCmPTg

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Edgar » Fri, 20 Sep 2019, 08:42

Wikipedia mentions a scoreless draw between a scratch team and the All Blacks in Rarotonga, Cook Islands in 1924, as the All Blacks were on their way to Europe. This sounds like more of a scrimmage, and could "never have been considered an official international," the site adds. https://www.wikizeroo.org/index.php?q=a ... W9uX3RlYW0

Fixtures against minor rugby nations were a regular fixture on Lions tours for most of the twentieth century as well. They met Rhodesia (Zimbabwe) on numerous occasions, South West Africa (Namibia) several times, East Africa (Kenya-Uganda) and Ceylon (Sri Lanka) twice apiece, and Canada and Fiji once each. Though most of these games were won with ease, the Lions did suffer a couple of losses. They succumbed 8-3 to British Columbia at the end of a marathon 35-match tour of Australasia and Canada in 1966, and suffered a 25-21 defeat to Fiji in front of a capacity 25,000 crowd in Suva in 1977.

But the practice seems to have been abandoned as direct flights to far off locations became more common. Tours in general became a lot shorter, in fact. The "grand slam" All Blacks of 1978 only played half as many games (18) as the "Original" All Blacks had on their tour in 1905 (35). The 2005 All Blacks, by contrast, simply played four straight tests on their tour, midweek fixtures having also fallen by the wayside, though they squeezed in a match against Munster on their way to a third grand slam in 2008.

Now available :D https://www.theroar.com.au/2019/09/21/r ... o-nations/

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby gibbs » Sun, 06 Oct 2019, 18:16

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“Rugby ‘Test’. Ceylon vs. England. At Longden Place on October 6 and 7 1971. Tickets: Rs. 5 (reserved seats under cover), Rs. 3 (reserved seats), Re.1/ (standing).” The response for the above advertisement published by the Ceylon RFU was so high, even before the arrival of the England team on October 5, 1971, it is said, almost all the reserved-seat tickets were soldout. The visit of the England Rugby team to Sri Lanka (then called Ceylon) was an extension of their Far East tour. To celebrate its Centenary year, and also to fulfil the wishes of RFU President in getting all rugby playing nations involved in the Centenary Celebrations, the Rugby Football Union of England arranged a tour of the Far East in 1971 covering Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore and Ceylon. Who recalls our rugby Centenary was just eight years behind?

Upon their arrival at 10.35 a.m. on October 5, the Englishmen were accompanied to a hotel in Mt. Lavinia, where they held a press conference in the afternoon. Late in the evening they attended a Cocktail party at Westminister House, hosted by the High Commissioner for the U.K.. During the press conference Bob Weighill, manager of the England team explained the purpose of the tour and said “that the main idea of the Far East tour was to spread the gospel of rugby to all rugby playing countries” in the region.

Budge Rogers, a record cap holder for England was the skipper of the visiting team which had a good number of rugby internationals who were to become household names here in Sri Lanka. “Not since the British Lions played a game in Colombo in 1951 on their return home from New Zealand. Ceylon had the opportunity of witnessing such skilled exponents of the game” stated in a match preview, and added that “the Ceylon crowd can expect to see attractive attacking rugby as skilful and explosive runners like Rodney Webb and Jeremy Janion, the most feared wingers in England will turn out for today’s match.” Famous rugby correspondent Austin Daniel wrote: “This English XV seems to be the strongest yet to step onto Ceylon soil. With thumbs twitching and pulses racing, the Ceylonese people prepare to watch them in action.”

For the first ‘Test’ the Ceylon team had Hadji Omar, Bumpy Jayasekera, Tyronne Holdenbottle, Kamal Ratnapala, Anton Benedict, Tony de Sylva, Gamini Udugama and E. ‘Viper’ Guneratne, Glen VanLangenberg and Randy Pietersz, M.A. Majeed, Jeff Rutnam (Capt.), Omar Sheriff, Reggie Bartholomeusz and Ronnie Schokman.

England 40 – Ceylon 11. That was the result of the first rugby ‘Test’ refereed by Major Chris Tyler, one of the nine referees on RFU referee A1 list. A rugby reporter wrote: “Ceylon fared much better than against the Bosuns way back in 1969 and they had the honour of leading against the English side early in the game. (Penalty by VanLangenberg.) They even scored a try against the powerful British side.(try by Majeed, converted by VanLangenberg).”

THE ERA OF FRIENDLY RUGBY

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby sk 88 » Sun, 06 Oct 2019, 20:31

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1971_Engl ... f_Far_East

Played again 2 days later apparently.

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby gibbs » Mon, 07 Oct 2019, 09:48

sk 88 wrote:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1971_England_rugby_union_tour_of_Far_East

Played again 2 days later apparently.


Looking at pre 1980's team sheets of both national and Sri Lankan club sides, They seem to be dominated by Burghers (Ceylonese of Dutch heritage).. Unfortunately with their exodus to places like Australia, Canada and the UK especially post 60's due to political upheavals in the island.. The country lost a lot of naturally athletic group of people more suited for sports like Rugby

For the first ‘Test’ the Ceylon team had Hadji Omar, Bumpy Jayasekera, Tyronne Holdenbottle, Kamal Ratnapala, Anton Benedict, Tony de Sylva, Gamini Udugama and E. ‘Viper’ Guneratne, Glen VanLangenberg and Randy Pietersz, M.A. Majeed, Jeff Rutnam (Capt.), Omar Sheriff, Reggie Bartholomeusz and Ronnie Schokman.

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Vova12 » Thu, 10 Oct 2019, 12:10

Spain - USSR 1985



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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Thu, 10 Oct 2019, 17:36

# 57 1985 1/05 Seville SPN W 15-9 FIRA

Usual short note in SOV.SPORT with HT score 6-6

Tided up team list

* Soviets

1 Hairulin Ramil @ T 3'
2 Medeksha Konstantin
3 Ugrekhelidze Sergo

4 Sokolov Andrey
5 Tikhonov Alexander

6 Fyodorov Alexander = EX HOOKER from VVA
7 Plotnikov Nicolay
8 Ovchinikov Alexander

9 Demidov Sergey
10 Slyusar Oleg

11 Mironov Igor CAPT @ C 4' T 44' C 45' P 58'
12 Liparteliani Oleg (Shishkov Boris 52')
13 Nechaev Igor
14 Berzin Pavel

15 Gonyani Anatoly

* 2t 2c p = 15 pts

* Ref Campanile's first name was Giovanni

* Liparteliani (tragically killed in 2003) was known just as OLEG =
slavonic name spread to his mountaineous region of SVANETI

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Armchair Fan » Thu, 10 Oct 2019, 17:48

Appreciated.

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Thu, 10 Oct 2019, 18:23

+++ Found what was given to me to correct | amend

01 May 1985 11:30
Estadio Olímpico de la Cartuja, Seville
Attendance: 3500

Spain:

1. Jose Julio Alvarez Ruiz de Temino
2. Santiago Santos Munoz (C)
3. Tomas Pardo Vidal
4. Rafael Alvarez Cienfuegos
5. Bosco Abascal Romero
6. Felipe Blanco Palmero
7. Javier Amunarriz Pagadizabal
8. Jose Antonio Egido Sancho

9. Javier Diaz Paternain
10. Luis Nunez Doval = 3P
11. Gabriel Rivero Macia
12. Fernando Garcia de la Torre
13. Jon Azkargorta Aretxabala
14. Luis Fernando Martin Fernandez (SUB Jose Salazar Penalva)
15. Francisco Puertas Soto

Head Coach: Angel Luis Jimenez Sanchez

SOV Head Coach: Igor Bobkov

:::

Did this for every SOV test = exactly 100
during Oct - Dec 2010
for iRB stats service | archive

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Mon, 09 Dec 2019, 15:05

USEFUL PASTIME -- colorizing old, B&W pix

Got best results via this Singaporean tool
https://colourise.sg/


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Wed 23/06_1965 Tbilisi, Didube, Dinamo stadium
RUGBY Promo game: Dinamo.Tbilisi (with lettering on chest) bt Gantiadi.Tbilisi 31:9


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Sat 05/11_1966 Tbilisi, Vake, Lokomotivi stadium
SOVIET "Trial" champs, last game: Dinamo.Tbilisi (white shorts) bt Spartak.Kiev 12:6


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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Vova12 » Tue, 07 Jan 2020, 17:57

These are very good books and are sold very cheaply. They cost me a lot more.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wallaby-Gold ... 5Sc9D0sBHg

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Century-in-B ... SwYMldPZFi

Those who wish can buy.
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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Tue, 14 Jan 2020, 17:32

The story (written in italian) of the possible filiation from old Corinthian FC to Barbarians (R)FC, emerged in the Super Liga American Rugby thread

https://blog.rugby.it/?p=10651

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Armchair Fan » Wed, 29 Jan 2020, 21:23

1988 Spain v Maori All Blacks [Full game]

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Sat, 01 Feb 2020, 18:54

Ok, this is not old but they are anyway memorabilia

Charity Stars, an on line website selling "VIP things" for charity purpose, put on sale a long series of Azzurri's wearings. Included the shirt that Leo Ghiraldini should have worn during RWC's New Zealand v Italy, the game cancelled by the typhoon. It's a sort of rarity, I hope it may attract an high offer.
The destination of this charity sell is an organization that offers free scholarship to poor students (I don't know it, I hope it's a serious one)

https://www.charitystars.com/search?q=rugby

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Vova12 » Sun, 22 Mar 2020, 09:31

11-11-1978 Rugby France А - USSR

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/4fYz/3VYNhRrBS
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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Fri, 27 Mar 2020, 19:54

Two nice stories highlighted by the Welsh federation and the Twickenham museum

The very last second's entry on the field by Derek Quinnell during Wales v France 1972, his first cap and his brother-in-law last cap. One year after Quinnell made the last pass during the "best rugby action ever", in the first minutes of Barbarians v All Blacks
https://www.wru.wales/report/quinnell-m ... for-wales/

Charles Hare was the groundsman of Twickenham during almost all the first half of the XX century; he lived with his family on a cottage near the stadium and he worked at Twickenham from 1907 to 1946. He retired proud because no one match during his 39 years of career was postponed due to bad pitch conditions
https://worldrugbymuseum.blog/2016/01/0 ... roundsman/

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Tintifax » Sun, 29 Mar 2020, 10:03

A Vienna XV played against Heidelberg at home in 1923. The article noticed no score I assume a clear away win. The match report sounds like a game or an experienced against an inexperienced team: Vienna with individuals skills but without a gameplan like the german counterpart. There was a noteworthy crowd at the venue - and they liked it.

The Conclusion sounds up to date & well known for T3-Nations:

- An established sport in Commonwealth but a new sport in Austria
- There are numerous prejudices about Rugby (brutality, complicated rules...)
- Rugby doesn't see itself as a competitor to soccer
- The hope for a better future

The Article also says
- About 50 Clubs in Germany, 2000 (Union) in England & 1500 in France. The Level in Germany isn´t bad.
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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Tintifax » Sun, 29 Mar 2020, 13:50

Edit: Heidelberg won 28:17 (17:0). In the second half joined 2 german players for the Viennese.
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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Mon, 30 Mar 2020, 08:11

Was/is that font usual in german/austrian newspapers?
I thought it was just a sort of stereotype the fact that the germans write (and speak, in the comics...) with a gothic font

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Mon, 30 Mar 2020, 08:43

Canalina wrote:Was/is that font usual in german/austrian newspapers?
I thought it was just a sort of stereotype the fact that the germans write (and speak, in the comics...) with a gothic font


More shocking is, that the article could easily be written today. Rugby playing itself down "will never reach the popularity of soccer" is one of them.

About the font. I learned to read it, by reading an old book as a kid (I think it was Ben Hur). It isn't used nowadays anymore.
Interesting read about the surprisingly extremely diverse debate which font to use.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiqua-Fraktur-Streit
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Mon, 30 Mar 2020, 09:26

Interesting, indeed.

That font seems obscure and fatiguing, to my eyes, but maybe it's just a matter of habit

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Mon, 30 Mar 2020, 11:05

Canalina wrote:Interesting, indeed.

That font seems obscure and fatiguing, to my eyes, but maybe it's just a matter of habit


My only problem is that s and f look to similiar. And the regular "s" is the "ß" (this letter is sharp s used only in Germany and Austria)

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I like Fraktur, but I prefer the fonts we use now.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Tintifax » Tue, 31 Mar 2020, 00:46

RugbyLiebe wrote:More shocking is, that the article could easily be written today. Rugby playing itself down "will never reach the popularity of soccer" is one of them.


An other Journalist about the same game:

Image

In Antiqua-letters:

"Es bringt alle Vorteile, die dem Fußballsport innewohnen, ohne so einseitig wie letzterer zu sein. Beim Rugby werden nämlich die Arme ebenso ausgebildet wie die Beine. Als Massensport dürfte zumindest bei uns Rugby nicht in Betracht kommen. Bei dieser Spielart ist es gestattet, den Gegner mit den Händen am Leib zu fassen, ihn zu Boden zu schleudern und dergelichen mehr. Man erkennt also sofort, dass nur Gentelemans, deren sportliche Gesinnung über jedes Lob erhaben ist und die sich demgemäß beherrschen können, diesen Sport betreiben dürfen. Ohne die Fußballer beleidigen zu wollen, kann doch festgestellt werden, dasß sie nicht Rugby spielen dürfen. Bei einem Kampf gegen Sparta [I think meant is Sparta Prague] zum Beispiel, gäbe es Todesopfer.
"

That’s the view of Viennese (almost all bourgeois) journalists at that time. He liked also the game but didn´t see any chance for a sport for the masses in these times. The working class can’t play rugby because it’s too rough. I can still see social seperation in many countries (including Austria) nowaday. (/discussion)

Short translation:
- Rugby is more demanding than Association- you must use also your hands & arms not only your legs.
- Rugby allows more contact than Association
- Only Gentlemen with a highly developed sportmenship should be allowed to play Rugby.
- The journalist will not insult the Association-Footballers, but the masses are too rough for this game, in a game against Sparta Prague [?] there would be deaths.
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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby RugbyLiebe » Tue, 31 Mar 2020, 06:36

Tintifax wrote: against Sparta Prague [?] there would be deaths.


Yep, that's Sparta Praha. It perfectly falls in line with their golden age of 58 games with just one game and them being called "Iron Sparta". Nice historical twist, that Sparta's Rugby department was founded in 1928 and is the second oldest rugby club in the Czech Republic.
How to grow rugby worldwide?
Look at the world ranking in July. Teams ranked 1-10 have to play one team from 11-20 (they don't play in a regular competition) away the next year. 11-20 play 21-30 away and so on. Yes, it really is that simple.

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