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OLD STUFF - rarities

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby gibbs » Mon, 13 Apr 2020, 15:57

18th Sept 1950

British Lions 44
Ceylon 06 ( two tries )

Whistle stop over in Ceylon, British Lions on their way to Australia for a Test series...

Image

Ceylon XV( In traditional white attire ) Backs : M.C.Bostock, S.Navaratnam (Ceylonese), N.W.Dewing, J.E.L.Burton, D.Heath, W.B.Thompson, F.A.C.Roeloff (Ceylonese), Forwards :H.Campbell, T.Shannon, R.Whatley, D.Cartridge, B.G.Richards, N.Mollison, D.Scobie & L.Euphriams (Ceylonese) .

Ref C. A. Cameron

@Canalina .. This team comprised of 3 native Ceylonese

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Mon, 13 Apr 2020, 16:11

I published the 1907 photo you posted above in our italian facebook page, so I made a little wikipedia search. The page about the AB 1907 tour says that they played mostly of the games with the rugby league rules; just for curiosity, do you know which code they played in that match in Colombo?

https://www.facebook.com/16370306898725 ... =3&theater

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby gibbs » Mon, 13 Apr 2020, 16:27

Canalina wrote:I published the 1907 photo you posted above in our italian facebook page, so I made a little wikipedia search. The page about the AB 1907 tour says that they played mostly of the games with the rugby league rules; just for curiosity, do you know which code they played in that match in Colombo?

https://www.facebook.com/16370306898725 ... =3&theater


Seems so.. Check this link out

http://www.rugbyleagueproject.org/match ... aland.html

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Mon, 13 Apr 2020, 19:34

FOUND where I downloaded

this picture

Image

from

https://www.gofundme.com/f/raccolta-fondi-per-nuova-sede

:::

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby victorsra » Wed, 15 Apr 2020, 17:40

The 1920-30s Springboks "zulu haka" :shock: :shock: :shock:


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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby RugInt » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 12:23

Seems so.. Check this link out

http://www.rugbyleagueproject.org/match ... aland.html


The term 'All Blacks' for this the NZ rugby league team may be incorrect. I have a feeling they were called the 'All Golds'. The 'All Blacks' has been exclusively used for NZ national mens rugby team since the 1905-06 tour of Great Britian and France.

I'm guessing that this rugby league team would have played rugby union in Ceylon at that time (1907). Their opponents would have been exclusively European and British ex pats and of the old school of rugby. I can't see them playing the 'Northern League' game after the acrimonious split in 1892. I don't know for sure.

From Wikipedia
The tour party has come to be known as the professional All Blacks or All Golds, although at the time they were commonly referred to as the All Blacks—a named popularised by the New Zealand rugby union team that toured the Northern Hemisphere in 1905.


Article continues
During a stop over in Ceylon the team was challenged to a game by the Ceylon rugby union. The All Blacks won the match against Ceylon 33–8.[3] As a result of this match the rugby union New Zealand side declined to play the Ceylonese on the return leg of their tour, deeming that Ceylon had forfeited their amateur status by playing against Baskerville's men
.

Found it.
The nation's first "national" match was on 12 September 1907 and involved an All Ceylon team against the professional All Blacks (the New Zealand rugby league team) under rugby union rules on their 1907–1908 New Zealand rugby tour of Australia and Great Britain.[4] The professional All Blacks won the match 33-6.


So according to the above quote from Wikipedia's Sri Lanka rugby union page, the game was played, as I suspected, under union rules.

Found more.
The professional All Blacks only played upon being guaranteed a fee of 50 pounds, this resulted in English Rugby Football Union banning its member countries from playing representative matches in Ceylon.
Ah, so now we have the real controversy. They got paid and the Rugby Football Union didn't like that.

Its amazing what one can get side tracked with when one is partially under lockdown here in North-West Tasmania. 8-)

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 13:21

Thank you RugInt :thumbup:

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 13:41

Until 1910 or little more after, a strange game was played in the south-western region of England: it was called "Cornwall Netball" and it was a sort of fusion between rugby and basketball.
The field was a grass one, the goal was a basket high-suspended, the ball was oval, the tackles were permitted, forward passes were also permitted, there was no off-side and the kicking of the ball was prohibited. It was played nine vs nine, with 5 forwards, 3 midfielders and 1 fullback.
Like a male donkey and a female horse give birth to a funny but infertile son, the mule, so the strange coupling between rugby and basketball gave birth to a funny but infertile son, the Cornwall netball: this sport, indeed, faded away somewhen during the first decades of the XX century

More details and images -> https://rugby-pioneers.blogs.com/rugby/ ... et-ba.html

Image

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 17:36

Thank you Canalina :thumbup:

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 18:28

The manager of that site, Rugby Pioneers, recovered from covid19. He posted today a tweet about this curious Cornwall Netball

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 20:15

From the same source


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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby theDarky » Thu, 16 Apr 2020, 21:31

Canalina wrote:From the same source



it's not a mix of rugby and basketball but a mix of rugby and Netball ... yes it exists and even have a world championship

it's very popular in Australia and New Zealand and it's mainly played by women ...

it's why the video is very interesting because normally in the 50's men didnt play a lot to netball

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netball

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/INF_Netball_World_Cup

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby gibbs » Fri, 17 Apr 2020, 06:37

RugInt wrote:
Seems so.. Check this link out

http://www.rugbyleagueproject.org/match ... aland.html


The term 'All Blacks' for this the NZ rugby league team may be incorrect. I have a feeling they were called the 'All Golds'. The 'All Blacks' has been exclusively used for NZ national mens rugby team since the 1905-06 tour of Great Britian and France.

I'm guessing that this rugby league team would have played rugby union in Ceylon at that time (1907). Their opponents would have been exclusively European and British ex pats and of the old school of rugby. I can't see them playing the 'Northern League' game after the acrimonious split in 1892. I don't know for sure.

From Wikipedia
The tour party has come to be known as the professional All Blacks or All Golds, although at the time they were commonly referred to as the All Blacks—a named popularised by the New Zealand rugby union team that toured the Northern Hemisphere in 1905.


Article continues
During a stop over in Ceylon the team was challenged to a game by the Ceylon rugby union. The All Blacks won the match against Ceylon 33–8.[3] As a result of this match the rugby union New Zealand side declined to play the Ceylonese on the return leg of their tour, deeming that Ceylon had forfeited their amateur status by playing against Baskerville's men
.

Found it.
The nation's first "national" match was on 12 September 1907 and involved an All Ceylon team against the professional All Blacks (the New Zealand rugby league team) under rugby union rules on their 1907–1908 New Zealand rugby tour of Australia and Great Britain.[4] The professional All Blacks won the match 33-6.


So according to the above quote from Wikipedia's Sri Lanka rugby union page, the game was played, as I suspected, under union rules.

Found more.
The professional All Blacks only played upon being guaranteed a fee of 50 pounds, this resulted in English Rugby Football Union banning its member countries from playing representative matches in Ceylon.
Ah, so now we have the real controversy. They got paid and the Rugby Football Union didn't like that.

Its amazing what one can get side tracked with when one is partially under lockdown here in North-West Tasmania. 8-)


Thanks for that.. Pretty interesting that Ceylon or Sri Lanka sports seems to get entangled in these controversies, Years later their maiden Test Cricket team was banned for life after they took a rebel tour to apartheid South Africa in 82'

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id ... frica-1982

A lot of brilliant players in that team got their careers cut short

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Fri, 17 Apr 2020, 07:56

Side note: I've read that Colombo, the capitol city where All Ceylon and All Blacks played, is really named after italian explorer Cristoforo Colombo. The name of the city is thought to have originally been "Kolamba", which should mean "harbor of the mango trees", but in 1505 the portoguese men who have colonized Ceylon slightly transformed the name in "Colombo", supposedly in honor of Cristoforo.
So Colombo and his friend Amerigo Vespucci gave name to the Americas, to Colombia, to U.S. state Columbia (I suppose) and to Sri Lanka's capitol city Colombo. Plus, Venice gave name to Venezuela and Rome gave name to Romania.
We italians have never had many colonies in the world but at least we gave name to some important lands 8-)

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby victorsra » Fri, 17 Apr 2020, 14:59

And exported millions of people to Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay, Chile, Venezuela, USA, Canada, Australia... :)

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Fri, 17 Apr 2020, 15:14

...France, Switzerland, Germany, Belgium, Luxembourg, Sweden...

Few weeks ago I opened the page of the Luxembourg Rugby board: out of 21 people, six have an italian surname.
We filled the world, but we are against immigrants in Italy : )

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby victorsra » Fri, 17 Apr 2020, 16:02

Italian diaspora numbers (Wikipedia, but the sources are basicaly offical censuses)

Just the countres is more than a million:

Brazil 32,000,000 (includes ancestry) ~15% of total population
Argentina 25,000,000 (includes ancestry) ~60% of total population
United States 17,300,000 (includes ancestry)
Colombia 2,000,000 (includes ancestry)
Venezuela 1,700,000 (includes ancestry)
Canada 1,587,970 (includes ancestry)
France 1,530,563 (includes ancestry)
Uruguay 1,055,220 (includes ancestry) ~33%
Australia 1,000,006 (includes ancestry)
...

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby sk 88 » Fri, 17 Apr 2020, 22:33

1978 English Cup Final. Leicester v Gloucester. Gloucester win 6-3.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INvb-dV0ZEQ

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Sat, 18 Apr 2020, 17:40

RATHER NEW THAN OLD ... STUFF

:!: This http://rugby.lt/wp-content/uploads/regbis.pdf
is from Lithuania :thumbup:

Regbis | Baltoji knyga = "White Book | Paper"

1 Kas yra regbis?
2 Regbio dvasia
3 Kuo regbis naudingas?
4 Regbio istorija
5 Regbis pasaulyje
6 Regbis Lietuvoje
7 Pagrindinės regbio taisyklės

Dear Canalina! Enjoy very last page - they could NOT find another ball ... nowhere

:::

We have NOT anything similar in Georgia --
and NEVER had in 60-odd years ...

bar this -- Laws and minimum of tactics for spectators

http://biblio.Qaflan.net/STAMBA/2010_RAA-RAGBI.pdf

:::

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Mon, 20 Apr 2020, 09:04

And the 6N captains photo is quite outdated, Ghiraldini without beard is almost unrecognizable : )

It's interesting the line under the italian ball, it says
RUGBY BALL
In the beginning, during the 19th century, rugby was played with balls of various shapes. The oval game tool was finally legalized in 1892.


1492: Cristoforo Colombo demonstrates that the world is round, reaching the Indies by west
1892: Rugby decides that the perfect form is not round but oval :)

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby FLIDTA RISXVA » Mon, 20 Apr 2020, 11:48

Found in my book pile

Image

ANUARUL FEREDAȚIEI ROMÂNE DE RUGBI 1968-1969
Editura Stadion, București 1970 = 160 pages

p.103-107 = directory of senior clubs

Divizia A (12 -- București 6)

Agronomia Cluj
Constructorul București
Dinamo București
Farul Constanța
Gloria București
Progresul București
Rulmentul Bîrlad
Grivița Roșie București
Steaua București
Știința Petroșani
Politehnica Iași
Universitatea Timișoara

Divizia B (30)

Seria: I (8), II (6), III (5), IV (5), V (6)

:::

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 06:35

Do you know who Bernardo Solano was?
Wikipedia explains that in 1870 circa "Richard Lindon and Bernardo Solano started making balls for Rugby School out of hand stitched, leather casings and pigs' bladders". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rugby_ball
I've tried to made some little search on google but all the results report simply the same wikipedia line.
Solano seems more a spanish surname but of course I'd like he was an italian emigrant

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby gibbs » Wed, 22 Apr 2020, 10:13

Canalina wrote:Side note: I've read that Colombo, the capitol city where All Ceylon and All Blacks played, is really named after italian explorer Cristoforo Colombo. The name of the city is thought to have originally been "Kolamba", which should mean "harbor of the mango trees", but in 1505 the portoguese men who have colonized Ceylon slightly transformed the name in "Colombo", supposedly in honor of Cristoforo.
So Colombo and his friend Amerigo Vespucci gave name to the Americas, to Colombia, to U.S. state Columbia (I suppose) and to Sri Lanka's capitol city Colombo. Plus, Venice gave name to Venezuela and Rome gave name to Romania.
We italians have never had many colonies in the world but at least we gave name to some important lands 8-)


Yep thats correct, Literally it was the "Port of the leafy Mango tree" in the Sinhalese language, But Latinized to Colombo by the Portugese, Sri Lanka despite it's small size is an extremely cosmopolitan and culturally vibrant nation with strong influences from the East and West.. Portuguese, Dutch, English, Scottish, Irish, Malay, East African, Moroccan, Persian, Chinese, Siamese, Burmese all have significant influence in Sri lankan culture given it was a major port of call in the middle of the Indian ocean maritime lanes

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Thu, 23 Apr 2020, 21:06

A nice reportage by italian national television about Romania v Italy, year 1983, in Buzau, ended 13-6
"Romanian rugby celebrates this year its 70th birthday, they're by now at the level of the best nations in the world and the british federations promised to play one test match versus Romania every year from now on".
That's true: until 2000 and after, Romania played a test match versus one of the Home Nations every year, sometime winning! I didn't know.
You may note also the very good crowd in Buzau stadium

Video -> http://www.facebook.com/watch/?t=57&v=502935193400843

(the historical list of Romania matches: http://www.rugbyinternational.net/countries/romania.htm)

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Re: OLD STUFF - rarities

Postby Canalina » Mon, 27 Apr 2020, 08:00

Rugby appeared in Switzerland already in 1874 or 1875, according to new researches which revamped a 1930 book written by an old player

https://lemultimedia.info/2020/04/26/de ... en-suisse/

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