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Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby armchair_expert » Thu, 11 Mar 2021, 16:15

Tuesday

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby TheStroBro » Thu, 11 Mar 2021, 20:09

snapper37 wrote:
thatrugbyguy wrote:It defeats the purpose of tour though. Ideally you'd want at least a two-test series along with 2 or 3 matches against domestic clubs. 5-matches spread over 3 weeks would at least constitute a tour of sorts. But that's the other problem, what possible opposition could local clubs/provincial teams actually supply? When the Lions tour to NZ or Australia or South Africa there's enough players to fill in for the likes of New South Wales or Maori All Blacks or Western Province for players who will be playing in the test series. But would there be enough women players to do the same? Could NSW or Queensland play a competitive match if 6 or 7 players are in the Wallaroos team? That I don't know. I'm not against the idea, but i'm struggling to see how this can be done in any way that actually provides benefit to women's rugby. Either you go in with what is essentially an England team playing in a different colour shirt, or you dilute the entire project by sending a team that is made up of women with different levels of fitness and skill who may or may not be able to get the time off work to do it. This needs to be carefully thought out before there is any commitment made.



You're not giving any of the other players form other nations any credit. England isn't the end all be all of all British/Irish rugby. I'll give you that the teams will be mostly made up of England players but not all. I like the idea if a British and Irish lioness tour was to happen that a tour through NZ as making the most sense. Two test series against the Silver Ferns and maybe mid week games being against the North or South Island all star teams and possible a game vs Ausrtraila on route. A three week tour would be a perfect length for a team made mostly of amateurs and a great way to build the idea of tours going forward.


Cross Code match eh, Rugby and Netball. Excellent. :D

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Fri, 12 Mar 2021, 06:53

An interesting interview (in italian) to Italy's coach Di Giandomenico
https://www.sport2u.tv/rugby2u-con-andr ... ndomenico/

He is perplexed too by the continuous postponements of the international events, but he is also aware of the current problems: "could we play in this moment? Yes we can. But the question is 'how?'. The problem is the preparation".
There's a thing he says about a crisis happened in the 6N few time ago: "there's a good solidariety in international women rugby because we feel that the more we play together the more we help the level to raise. But there was a moment of strong identitary crisis, let's say four or five years ago, with Scotland and Wales a bit hesitant... I think Italy helped on strengthen the identity of the 6N and we may take this little merit".
He is no more explicit (he always stays away from polemics, accusations or auto-celebrations) but my understanding from his words is that Wales and Scotland were meditating to quit the tournament

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby johnbirch » Sat, 13 Mar 2021, 13:28

Canalina wrote:An interesting interview (in italian) to Italy's coach Di Giandomenico
https://www.sport2u.tv/rugby2u-con-andr ... ndomenico/

He is perplexed too by the continuous postponements of the international events, but he is also aware of the current problems: "could we play in this moment? Yes we can. But the question is 'how?'. The problem is the preparation".
There's a thing he says about a crisis happened in the 6N few time ago: "there's a good solidariety in international women rugby because we feel that the more we play together the more we help the level to raise. But there was a moment of strong identitary crisis, let's say four or five years ago, with Scotland and Wales a bit hesitant... I think Italy helped on strengthen the identity of the 6N and we may take this little merit".
He is no more explicit (he always stays away from polemics, accusations or auto-celebrations) but my understanding from his words is that Wales and Scotland were meditating to quit the tournament
He is referring to Scots and Welsh proposals a few years ago to have a "division 1" and "division 2" in the W6N. We heard about it at SQ and ran a campaign against, after which it all disappeared again. This was the article about the proposal in 2013 https://www.scrumqueens.com/news/drastic-changes-6-nations-proposed. As you see, it proposed dumping Italy into "Division 2" without consulting them.

At least one of these nations was behind the decision to stay with this year's 6N format, despite Italy, France and England wanting to go back to the usual format after the WC postponement. I'll leave it to you to guess who.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby victorsra » Sat, 13 Mar 2021, 22:43

The Brazilian Rugby Union is proposing 4 months/year at least for 15-a-side rugby. It will be a mix of state competitions for clubs and national competition for state representative sides. That's a great evolution, the first time women's 15s has a space in the calendar.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Sun, 14 Mar 2021, 08:14

The discutible president of the Italian Olympic Committee, yesterday during the rugby federation general meeting

"I love rugby, I have often said that, having two daughters, if I would have (wrong verbal mode) a son I would have loved that he played rugby"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmU6UMzLd6w&t=17007s

Italian women rugby players are currently mocking him on the social media. "Class action against the moron!", one of them purposed :P

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:04

The global calendar project is out and as expected, first division access is limited... No promotion and relegation in the first cycle and only W6N teams, Canada, USA, New Zealand and Australia are eligible
https://twitter.com/WorldRugby/status/1 ... 5214844928

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:29

So #4, #5 and #6 from the Six Nations will not be part of the competition?

As I've said other times I don't love these global leagues, but if it helps to grow the number of test matches and mostly of transcontinental test matches, well, let's accept it

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Loohr » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:30

And like the Rugby World Cup qualification path, it's again Spain which is left behind. I'm not spanish, but we see in women rugby since 15 years that World Rugby and 6 Nations are against the development of women rugby in Spain and this will continue for years.

It's still so sad that rugby managing organizations are against the development of their sport.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:31

Canalina wrote:So #4, #5 and #6 from the Six Nations will not be part of the competition?

As I've said other times I don't love these global leagues, but if it helps to grow the number of test matches and mostly of transcontinental test matches, well, let's accept it

They are obviously considered as part of Rugby Europe. They used W6N logo in WXV1 to explain only them have access there.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:33

Loohr wrote:And like the Rugby World Cup qualification path, it's again Spain which is left behind. I'm not spanish, but we see in women rugby since 15 years that World Rugby and 6 Nations are against the development of women rugby in Spain and this will continue for years.

It's still so sad that rugby managing organizations are against the development of their sport.

It's not about Spain. It's about Rugby Europe, because it's an odd entity. Only 7 teams from Europe will have initial access. It doesn't matter if Russia or Netherlands could be theoretically better than Colombia or Kenya. They will only be allowed to enter in the second edition through a playoff.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:40

Armchair Fan wrote:
Canalina wrote:So #4, #5 and #6 from the Six Nations will not be part of the competition?

As I've said other times I don't love these global leagues, but if it helps to grow the number of test matches and mostly of transcontinental test matches, well, let's accept it

They are obviously considered as part of Rugby Europe. They used W6N logo in WXV1 to explain only them have access there.

This would need a qualifying tournament (in Spring?) between the bottom three of the 6N and the best teams (or just the winner) of the Euro Championship

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:43

Or predetermined by rankings, because why playing too much... In the end after the first edition promotion and relegation will depend on WXV results, not W6N

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Loohr » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:44

It's not about Spain. It's about Rugby Europe, because it's an odd entity. Only 7 teams from Europe will have initial access. It doesn't matter if Russia or Netherlands could be theoretically better than Colombia or Kenya. They will only be allowed to enter in the second edition through a playoff.


I talk about Spain because they are currently 10th on women's world rugby ranking with almost same point as Scotland, Wales or Ireland, other nations are far behind.
The playoff is also funny, they will choose the random team better ranked out of their system.
Based onthe actual World Ranking :
WXV1 :
Oceania/America : New Zealand, Canada, Australia
6 Nations : England, France, Italy

WXV2 :
Europe : Ireland, Wales
Oceania/America : USA
Oceania : Samoa
Asia : Japan
Africa : South Africa

WXV3 :
Europe : Scotland, Spain
Asia : Kazakhstan
America/Africa : Kenya or Colombia

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:44

Armchair Fan wrote:
Loohr wrote:And like the Rugby World Cup qualification path, it's again Spain which is left behind. I'm not spanish, but we see in women rugby since 15 years that World Rugby and 6 Nations are against the development of women rugby in Spain and this will continue for years.

It's still so sad that rugby managing organizations are against the development of their sport.

It's not about Spain. It's about Rugby Europe, because it's an odd entity. Only 7 teams from Europe will have initial access. It doesn't matter if Russia or Netherlands could be theoretically better than Colombia or Kenya. They will only be allowed to enter in the second edition through a playoff.

As always it happens, I can't see the problem. It is just to wait the end of the first "cycle" (but what does cycle mean? A year? Or four years?), then every nation will have the chance to climb up to the top of the WXV. Until yesterday no one had the chance to climb to the top of the WXV because the WXV still didn't exist

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:53

Starting year? Have they said it? Is it implicit it will be 2022?

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby sammo » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:57

Canalina wrote:Starting year? Have they said it? Is it implicit it will be 2022?


2023. Here is the link with all information

https://www.world.rugby/news/624265/wor ... GZVttix29I

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 09:59

From 2023, thank you

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby sammo » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 11:21

With regard to promotion into/relegation from WXV3, WR states this;

A play-off between the fourth-ranked team and next best ranked team from the World Rugby Women’s Rankings will determine regional position for the next year.

Does this mean the next highest team in the world ranking that isn’t included in the current setup (likely to be Russia), or the next highest team in the world rankings within the bottom team’s region (Zambia if Kenya come last, Jamaica if Colombia come last)? I hope it is the former, otherwise we will have some pointless playoffs and some good teams permanently excluded.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 11:44

I hadn't noticed that. I think it means, in your example, Kenya v Zambia; and I suppose it has been designed to avoid that, year by year, the nations of the continents more strong may expel the nations of one given continent

Now I see that there's an other thing that I don't understand: will the regional tournaments be qualifying just before the first edition? Because, according to what I've understood, from the second "cycle" onwards the nations will be all the same, apart possibly the 16th one, the substitute of which will be decided by the ranking (and by the play-off). So this would immediately let apart the importance of the spring regional tournaments

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 12:04

Answer to myself: they wrote "Teams will qualify annually into the WXV competitions courtesy of their finishing positions within the respective existing annual regional competitions, such as the Women’s Six Nations. These regional competitions, played within a new regional window, must be completed by June each year".

So, I suppose, if England win the WXV one year but finish 4th in the Six Nations few months after, it's replaced on the top pool of the WXV by the winner of the 6N?

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby sammo » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 12:18

Canalina wrote:Answer to myself: they wrote "Teams will qualify annually into the WXV competitions courtesy of their finishing positions within the respective existing annual regional competitions, such as the Women’s Six Nations. These regional competitions, played within a new regional window, must be completed by June each year".

So, I suppose, if England win the WXV one year but finish 4th in the Six Nations few months after, it's replaced on the top pool of the WXV by the winner of the 6N?


Great question, this isn’t very clear, especially when there is promotion and relegation between WXV2 and 3!

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Canalina » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 12:25

Fortunately also ScrumQueens has the same doubts, and they explain them better than me

https://www.scrumqueens.com/news/world- ... lobal-comp

(second part of the article, from "There are oddities too")

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby Armchair Fan » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 13:16

I'd say the main rationale behind the whole structure is money. World Rugby absolutely needs that certain developed markets are in WXV1 because they are the only ones where TV and sponsors will be willing to pay enough money in order to sustain costly intercontinental travel in WXV2 and WXV3.

The honest truth is that this is not a World League, but Women's Super Series plus an organised distribution of test matches.

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Re: Womens XVs Rugby - Global news & Developments

Postby NaBUru38 » Tue, 16 Mar 2021, 13:18

I love the cross-pool format, because it will prevent usual matchups.

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